When did Mexican become a "dirty" word?

@Green Witch,

Green Witch wrote:

I think the US masquerading as Canadians is a blown-up myth. It was a little of joke during the Reagan years when I traveling in Europe, but I never met anyone (in all my life) that actual went to such trouble. Most Americans proudly sewed American flags on their backpacks, plus you could spot us a mile away by the fact we all wore name brand sneakers while everyone else in the world wore real shoes. Italian boys would point at our feet and say "Hello Americans!".

this reminds me of this passage from Laurie Anderson's dialogue, The Cultural Ambassador

And the other thing it reminded me of, were all the attempts during the Gulf War to outwit the terrorists, and I especially remember an interesting list of tips devised by the US embassy in Madrid, and these tips were designed for Americans who found themselves in war-time airports. The idea was not to call ourselves to the attention of the numerous foreign terrorists who were presumably lurking all over the terminal, so the embassy tips were a list of mostly don’ts. Things like: don’t wear a baseball cap; don’t wear a sweat shirt with the name of an American university on it; don’t wear Timberlands with no socks; don’t chew gum; don’t yell “Ethel, our plane is leaving!”. I mean it’s weird when your entire culture can be summed up in eight giveaway characteristics.

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@dlowan,

Quote:

do Mexicans pretend to be from somewhere else in the US?

Forgot to include thoughts on this. They don't want to pretend, sadly, even when they are legal citizens they are seen as foreign. Anyone who even slightly looks Mexican is thought to be illegal and that's why the Arizona thing is so controversial. The law reminds me of German Jews forced to sew yellow stars on their clothing. The whole thing disturbs me and is a sign of how angry some Americans are about the issue of illegals. They are willing to punish the innocent in an attempt to trap the minority.

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@dlowan,

dlowan wrote:

Generally I find the convict references funny. Yours sounded like it was trying to be offensive.

Humble apology offered. It's why I don't work for the United Nations.

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@Green Witch,

Green Witch wrote:

dlowan wrote:

Generally I find the convict references funny. Yours sounded like it was trying to be offensive.

Humble apology offered. It's why I don't work for the United Nations.

Aarrgghh....I have changed my post since you wrote this.

Like I said, no harm.

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@Green Witch,

Green Witch wrote:

Quote:
do Mexicans pretend to be from somewhere else in the US?

Forgot to include thoughts on this. They don't want to pretend, sadly, even when they are legal citizens they are seen as foreign. Anyone who even slightly looks Mexican is thought to be illegal and that's why the Arizona thing is so controversial. The law reminds me of German Jews forced to sew yellow stars on their clothing. The whole thing disturbs me and is a sign of how angry some Americans are about the issue of illegals. They are willing to punish the innocent in an attempt to trap the minority.

I really need to clarify.

This makes no sense to me as a specific Mexican thing....are you saying it is, as opposed to an illegal immigrants from anywhere south of the border thing?

If so, can you tell me why specifically MEXICAN?

Are there just, either in fact or in perception, more Mexicans? (That makes sense because there is a border.) Or are the Mexicans seen by the anti people as being somehow WORSE than other illegal immigrants?

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@dlowan,

if i understand the question, i don't think there is a specific distinction in most peoples minds, the vast majority of illegals are from mexico, but i'm guessing most americans would lump folks from any south american country,together as a mexican due to skin colour

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@dlowan,

Quote:

If so, can you tell me why specifically MEXICAN?

Are there just, either in fact or in perception, more Mexicans? (That makes sense because there is a border.) Or are the Mexicans seen by the anti people as being somehow WORSE than other illegal immigrants?

This gets a little tricky because America is so large and diverse, but basically if you look like a Mexican (even if you are not) you are thought to be illegal. It's true some Mexican illegals send their children to our schools or end up in our emergency rooms or on line at our food pantries and Americans resent it for the very real reason that they have broken the law by coming here in first place. The reality is there are jobs here for them and some industries have encouraged the problem by not aggressively checking their status and offering them cheap or no cost housing. As I live in state that is not effected very much, I can't speak for Texans or folks in New Mexico or Arizona as to how bad a problem this is. I do understand it's a major strain on local governments and that is where the anger is coming from. People feel they forced into aiding and abetting criminals. The problem with the Arizona law is that it is going to encourage racial profiling, a long time hot button in the US.

And yes, Mexicans are thought to be worse than say some illegal Canadian. At least the Canadian can go home if he needs healthcare.

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@djjd62,

djjd62 wrote:

if i understand the question, i don't think there is a specific distinction in most peoples minds, the vast majority of illegals are from mexico, but i'm guessing most americans would lump folks from any south american country,together as a mexican due to skin colour

So...it's an ignorant assumptions that a whole bunch of people are "Mexicans"?

Would such people (the ignorant assumers) feel differently, do you think, if they discovered the person to be, say Chilean, but they were still an illegal immigrant?

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Kudos to dlowan for asking the proper questions.

I conclude that it's all down to using the name of a nationality, "Mexican", instead of the totally un P-C "Spic"...
... AND thinking that a Mexican would feel bad about being called a Mexican, when we are so proud about it.

The filth is inside the mind of the speaker, the desire of not appearing blatantly racist causes this horrible prostitution of the language... and provokes a more generalized use of racist thought.

This is pseudo-PC Orwellian newspeak .

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@fbaezer,

Quote:

The filth is inside the mind of the speaker, the desire of not appearing blatantly racist causes this horrible prostitution of the language... and provokes a more generalized use of racist thought.

This is pseudo-PC Orwellian newspeak

here-here!

The real stupidity though is that we know that in relationship communication is everything, but we are willing to destroy communication and the honest transmission of our feelings in the attempt to get to the utopia of social harmony. Making relationships between the races and individuals more difficult by destroying communication actually moves the ball IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION from what is intended. The stupidity of the PC movement is breathtaking.

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@Green Witch,

I read an article some time back about Canadians, from Quebec, who have been going down to NY city, illegally, since forever to sell Xmas trees. The article said that there's a nice little feeling that New Yorkers get by having a true habitant sell them a tree.

You have to remember that "Irish" was once a dirty word, as was "Italian". New immigrants groups often get tarnished quickly. In my time DP was a term used to disparage immigrants; "displaced people", an older term that meant 'refugee'.

Haven't similar things happened in Australia, Deb?

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@hawkeye10,

Quote:

here-here!

The real stupidity though

Kinda ironic, but ... .

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@dlowan,

not sure, they, the americans,would still be rankled by the illegal bit i'm sure

it's interesting, i don't think anybody makes an automatic distinction about caucasians without hearing them speak, but a black person not from this country is automatically african (i worked with quite a few different african nationals and can sometimes distinguish a few of the individual countries when meeting people), any asian folks are almost automatically declared to be chinese (something that really steamed a fellow from the philippines i worked with) and as has been stated here most south americans will get lumped in with mexicans

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@djjd62,

Still this is the first time I come across any Mexicans infuriated at being called "Spanish" - though the reverse is very common, people from Spain getting absolutely furious at being lumped together with "Latinos". If this is really PC-Orwellian newspeak, it has backfired badly.

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@High Seas,

Quote:

Still this is the first time I come across any Mexicans infuriated at being called "Spanish" -

I missed where that occurred. If you'd be so kind as to provide a link.

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@JTT,

FBaezer post, this page:

Quote:

.....the desire of not appearing blatantly racist causes this horrible prostitution of the language... and provokes a more generalized use of racist thought.

This is pseudo-PC Orwellian newspeak .

1 Reply

@JTT,

JTT wrote:

I read an article some time back about Canadians, from Quebec, who have been going down to NY city, illegally, since forever to sell Xmas trees....

It's perfectly legal to sell Christmas trees in New York city as long as you obtain a license. For seasonal sales, permits are granted to all applicants with Christmas trees to sell - from upstate NY, Vermont, Maine, Quebec, wherever - with no legal residency requirement.

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@High Seas,

I'm not quite sure how one gets,

Quote:

(1) Still this is the first time I come across any Mexicans infuriated at being called "Spanish"

out of (2)

Quote:

(2) FBaezer post, this page:

.....the desire of not appearing blatantly racist causes this horrible prostitution of the language... and provokes a more generalized use of racist thought.

This is pseudo-PC Orwellian newspeak .

I read the whole post, then went back one page and read some other FBaezer's posts. Still, I wasn't able to discern how the meaning expressed in (1) could be found in anything he said.

1 Reply

@High Seas,

Quote:

It's perfectly legal to sell Christmas trees in New York city as long as you obtain a license. For seasonal sales, permits are granted to all applicants with Christmas trees to sell - from upstate NY, Vermont, Maine, Quebec, wherever - with no legal residency requirement.

Quote:

DECEMBER 20TH, 2007

New York deprived of its Montreal Christmas connection

BY CHRISTOPHER DEWOLF

...

Unfortunately, Lemay won't be returning to Manhattan this year. The New York Times reported last Sunday that he has been denied entry to the United States. Apparently, despite seeing no problem with his activities for the past ten years, US Customs has decided that Lemay shouldn't be allowed to sell Christmas trees on Second Avenue.

On Nov. 28, Mr. Lemay was stopped at the border in Beecher Falls, Vt., and denied entry into the United States. He was in his truck, Mr. Lemay said later, with a few trees and treetops (his full harvest of about 1,000 trees was to follow a day or two later) and his assistant for the season, Justin Tremblay.

Mr. Lemay said he had explained his yearly mission to the border officers, “but it was no, no all the way.”

Undaunted, Mr. Lemay and Mr. Tremblay returned the next day, to the same chorus of noes and an officer, said Mr. Lemay, brandishing a 2004 article from The New York Times about Mr. Lemay’s tree business.

“‘You are doing jobs that U.S. citizens could do,’ he told me,” Mr. Lemay recalled heatedly.

Last week, Ted Woo, chief of public affairs for the Boston office of Customs and Border Protection, said that privacy laws kept him from discussing individual cases. What he could address, he said, was the general notion of a Canadian selling Christmas trees. “Someone who is not a resident of the United States,” Mr. Woo said, “cannot bring in Christmas trees and sell them.”

http://spacingmontreal.ca/2007/12/20/new-york-deprived-of-its-montreal-christmas-connection/

[Added emphasis is mine.]

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@djjd62,

djjd62 wrote:

not sure, they, the americans,would still be rankled by the illegal bit i'm sure

it's interesting, i don't think anybody makes an automatic distinction about caucasians without hearing them speak, but a black person not from this country is automatically african (i worked with quite a few different african nationals and can sometimes distinguish a few of the individual countries when meeting people), any asian folks are almost automatically declared to be chinese (something that really steamed a fellow from the philippines i worked with) and as has been stated here most south americans will get lumped in with mexicans

Yes. I can get the illegal bit. We don't have enough people here illegally yet for anyone to assume anyone from any ethnic group is here illegally yet, though there are jokes that most of New Zealand is here (but they're not illegally here.)

I suppose the only people we can be SURE are not illegals are the Aboriginal people!

You do not mean that people from, say, India or Pakistan would be assumed to be Chinese, do you? I am surprised by people from the Philippines being seen as Chinese.

2 Replies

When did Mexican become a "dirty" word?

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