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Oinkbama names zealots to science posts

 
 
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 10:47 am
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081220/ap_on_el_pr/obama

The basic agenda is that of spending gigantic sums of money to fix a problem (man-made global warming) which does not exist.

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Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 1,195 • Replies: 12
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kickycan
 
  2  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 11:17 am
@gungasnake,
Other brilliant scientific relevations made by gungasnake in the past: The earth is flat, leeches are the best treatment for any medical malady, and the moon is made of green cheese.
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 11:37 am
@kickycan,
Quote:
leeches are the best treatment for any medical malady


Your sarcasm aside, you are actually correct.
I know you werent trying to be, but leeches ARE used and acepted today for use in modern medicine.

http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/2004/504_leech.html

Quote:
In June 2004, the Food and Drug Administration cleared the first application for leeches (Hirudo medicinalis) to be used in modern medicine as medical devices. By definition, a medical device is an article intended to diagnose, cure, treat, prevent, or mitigate a disease or condition, or to affect a function or structure of the body, that does not achieve its primary effect through a chemical action and is not metabolized.


Quote:
Packing a one-two chemical punch, the benefit of leech therapy comes not from the amount of blood that is extracted, but in the powerful anti-clotting agent hirudin, contained in the parasite's saliva, which keeps blood flowing freely. At the same time, leeches emit a natural anesthetic that minimizes pain during their feast.


So you other comments aside, leeches ARE good for medical treatment today.
That means that Gunga was right, at least partially.


Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 11:45 am
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

So you other comments aside, leeches ARE good for medical treatment today.
That means that Gunga was right, at least partially.


Well, certainly in the USA something that is good for medical treatment might be the best for most but generally ....
kickycan wrote:

Other brilliant scientific relevations made by gungasnake in the past: The earth is flat, leeches are the best treatment for any medical malady, and the moon is made of green cheese.

0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 11:58 am
@gungasnake,
We will have to wait to see whether these guys are similarly the zealot Evangelical types that have been acting as Bush 's science advisors.

Im not a believer in man-induced climate change (Although the fact that the climate is changing is undeniable) for reasons that I hold as accurate. The present BUSH science advisors have taken the "peerness" out of their reports etc. They have had everything from stem cells , evolution, genomics, "peak oil" as well as climate change gone over with a large Rewrite pen to pass the BUSHSHIT tests. The drafts of many science reports have never seen the light of day because theyve not been subject to tech review but POLITICAL reviews.


And the snake has the balls to call the incoming advisors "zealots".
NickFun
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 03:10 pm
I recall visiting Alaska in 1982 and viewing this remarkable iceberg. I went there again last year and the iceberg is gone! The entire terrain has changed. If you want to see global warming firsthand go to Alaska. Say Hi to Sarah for me.
0 Replies
 
tenderfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 04:27 pm
Nick--- if you had gone back there 30 thousand years ago, you would have most likly seen a herd of hippo's bathing there, time can mean little in the gueesing game of our climate.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 06:26 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Im not a believer in man-induced climate change (Although the fact that the climate is changing is undeniable) for reasons that I hold as accurate.


Do you really think we would expect you to hold those views for reasons that are not accurate you silly moo?

Quote:
The drafts of many science reports have never seen the light of day because theyve not been subject to tech review but POLITICAL reviews.


The reason for that effemm is that we are scared shitless of "tech review". We do have a modicum of control over "POLITICAL reviews".

I think leeches are useful because they extract blood of a high cholesterol content and the body then replaces it with the pure pristine stuff and thus the cholesterol is diluted. Giving blood must have the same effect but it's not as posh because it is useful.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Sat 20 Dec, 2008 11:24 pm
http://tierneylab.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/12/19/flawed-science-advice-for-obama/

Quote:

Flawed Science Advice for Obama?
By John Tierney

Does being spectacularly wrong about a major issue in your field of expertise hurt your chances of becoming the presidential science advisor? Apparently not, judging by reports from DotEarth and ScienceInsider that Barack Obama will name John P. Holdren as his science advisor on Saturday.

Dr. Holdren, now a physicist at Harvard, was one of the experts in natural resources whom Paul Ehrlich enlisted in his famous bet against the economist Julian Simon during the “energy crisis” of the 1980s. Dr. Simon, who disagreed with environmentalists’ predictions of a new “age of scarcity” of natural resources, offered to bet that any natural resource would be cheaper at any date in the future. Dr. Ehrlich accepted the challenge and asked Dr. Holdren, then the co-director of the graduate program in energy and
resources at the University of California, Berkeley, and another Berkeley professor, John Harte, for help in choosing which resources would become scarce.

In 1980 Dr. Holdren helped select five metals " chrome, copper, nickel, tin and tungsten " and joined Dr. Ehrlich and Dr. Harte in betting $1,000 that those metals would be more expensive ten years later. They turned out to be wrong on all five metals, and had to pay up when the bet came due in 1990.

Now, you could argue that anyone’s entitled to a mistake, and that mistakes can be valuable if people learn to become open to ideas that conflict with their preconceptions and ideology. That could be a useful skill in an advisor who’s supposed to be presenting the president with a wide range of views. Someone who’d seen how wrong environmentalists had been in ridiculing Dr. Simon’s predictions could, in theory, become more open to dissenting from today’s environmentalist orthodoxy. But I haven’t seen much evidence of such open-mindedness in Dr. Holdren.

Consider what happened when a successor to Dr. Simon, Bjorn Lomborg, published “The Skeptical Environmentalist” in 2001. Dr. Holdren joined in an an extraordinary attack on the book in Scientific American " an attack that I thought did far more harm to the magazine’s reputation than to Dr. Lomborg’s. The Economist called the critique “strong on contempt and sneering, but weak on substance”; Dr. Lomborg’s defenders said the critics made more mistakes in 11 pages than they were able to find in his 540-page book. (You can read Dr. Lomborg’s rebuttal here.) In an earlier post, I wrote about Dr. Holdren’s critique of the chapter on energy, in which Dr. Lomborg reviewed the history of energy scares and predicted there would not be dire shortages in the future:

Dr. Holdren began his critique by complaining that Dr. Lomborg was “asking the wrong question” because environmentalists had known for decades that there was no danger of energy being in short supply. This struck me as as odd bit of revisionist history, given both the “energy crisis” rhetoric of the 1970s and Dr. Holdren’s own bet that resources would become more scarce. Then, in the rest of the critique, Dr. Holdren faulted Dr. Lomborg for not paying enough attention to the reasons that there could be future problems with energy supplies.

Dr. Holdren’s resistance to dissenting views was also on display earlier this year in an article asserting that climate skeptics are “dangerous.” (You can read about the response to that article at DotEarth.)

Dr. Holdren is certainly entitled to his views, but what concerns me is his tendency to conflate the science of climate change with prescriptions to cut greenhouse emissions. Even if most climate scientists agree on the anthropogenic causes of global warming, that doesn’t imply that the best way to deal with the problem is through drastic cuts in greenhouse emissions. There are other ways to cope, and there’s no “scientific consensus” on which path looks best.

Roger A. Pielke Jr., a professor of environmental studies at the University of Colorado and the author of “The Honest Broker: Making Sense of Science in Policy and Politics,” discussed Dr. Holdren’s conflation of science and politics in a post on the Prometheus blog:

Quote:
The notion that science tells us what to do leads Holdren to appeal to authority to suggest that not only are his scientific views correct, but because his scientific views are correct, then so too are his political views.


AT the Reason Hit & Run blog, Ronald Bailey reviews some of Dr. Holdren’s work and notes that in a 1995 essay, he and his coauthors (Gretchen C. Daily and Dr. Ehrlich) “acknowledge ecological ignorance about the principles of economics, but don’t express any urgency in learning about them.”

At OpenMarket.org, the Competitive Enterprise Institute blog, Chris Horner criticizes the reported Holdren appointment and suggests that Dr. Holdren got in to the National Academy of Sciences through a “back door.”

What kind of White House science advisor you think Dr. Holdren would make?
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Dec, 2008 06:19 am
@gungasnake,
Hes the present director at Woods Hole and has been the gatekeeper of good climatic science . This is a good choice despite what you (and I) may think about his stand on climate change. The recent work on CC from Woods Hole is showing that dispersion of melt water from High Latitudes is having an effect on the strengths of the mid oceanic streams. This means that global warming can lead to possible global cooling. Theyve suspected that for decades but the new evidence from Woods Hole is pretty remarkeable.

We can remember the Bush "Science Advisors". I doubt that politically directed editing will be a policy of the Obama admin like it is in the Bush years



http://www.sehn.org/pdf/bush_silence.pdf
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Dec, 2008 07:01 am
@farmerman,
That's a bit wishy-washy effemm. Two "good"s , "an effect", "can lead", "possible", "suspected" and "pretty remarkable". "I doubt".

My goodness. It looks like just an excuse to have the sound of your voice heard. There can be no other meaning. Talk for talk's sake.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 21 Dec, 2008 07:18 am
@spendius,
sobered up yet spendi? becausey Your garbage is even more un intendedly funny and disarticulated this fine snowy morning.

My suggestion is that, instead of posting your normal compost you should try to compose some coherent thought (if you are able) and then try to write it concisely and precisely.

0 Replies
 
Shirakawasuna
 
  1  
Reply Wed 31 Dec, 2008 04:05 am
Now I'm not up on my Holdren mythology (I doubt the people writing the attack articles really are, either. Or they're just dishonest), but at least copper's prices have skyrocketed since 1980. Psst to those ready to pounce: I'm not saying it was a steady climb.

Perhaps the timeframe was a poor choice, rather than the generality.

But that kind of reasonable and wider view doesn't really jive with the hate machine, does it?
0 Replies
 
 

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