Prop 8?

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

SO TKO when gay males rape and or murder straight males that in no way reflect on the majority of gay males correct?

However if somewhere in some manner a group of straight males murder a gay male then you get to point to this as some kind of indictment of all straight males at least all straight males that does not support your logic concerning the gay right community correct!

I seen little indication that gays males are any less likely as a group to be guilty of hate crimes then heterosexual males are.

In fact in the number of serial sexual driven killers gay males seem to be more then holding their own for example.

Good try but being a hypocrite on the subject of evil doers is not very rewarding.

You sidestep unsuccessfully the fact that Matthew Sheppard was killed solely because he was gay. He was not a random target. He was targeted because he was gay.

I did not say that those that killed him represented all straight men, only that it is proof that there exists a civil issue. This is not gays versus straights. Those men did not represent me nor my feelings.

Your strawman about gays who rape or murder straight men, is immaterial to whether or not gays face a real social strife.

I'd say "nice try" but it wasn't that good.

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As for a gay male raping or

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@Diest TKO,

Perhaps I am wrong but was it not you who took the interesting and amusing position that members of NAMBLA are not really gay?

Is it not strange that as far as I am aware there is no NAMGLA with heterosexual membership so that this organize sickness belong only to the gay community.

Do not feel proud as a result?

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Oh TKO thank for bringing up the military as Debra should take note that the SC had not rule that limiting or banning gays in the military is wrong.

Patience Bill.

BillRM wrote:

What you really need in a combat squad is sexual tensions not!

Well, examine reality Bill: Gays are in fact in the military right now. That fact is not up for dispute. The myth about loss of functionality has been proven wrong.

I work with a gay woman who served in the Air Force for 8 years. She loved her time in the Air Force and it saddened her greatly to leave, but in terms of life goals, how is it reasonable for her to have to live in secrecy? She was very skilled, and those skills of hers are no longer available to the USAF. That sir, IS a loss of functionality.

BillRM wrote:

It is bad enough when on ships such as aircraft carriers you get the love boat effect after we open such ships to women serving on them.

You here to govern who people fall in love with? Deal with it. Oh yeah, and guess what? The military hasn't fallen apart since Women have been let in. Ours is not the only military in the world, and for that fact, other armies do enlist women.

Instead of basing our opinion on what you think would happen, base it on what does happen. Sure, the love boat thing can happen, a lot of fraternizing can happen that is inappropriate and can lead to complication. Why single these out?

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@Diest TKO,

And straight males are never harm by gay males as a power trip because they are straight males in the wrong place at the wrong time?

Is that your position that such an event have never happen?

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Perhaps I am wrong but was it not you who took the interesting and amusing position that members of NAMBLA are not really gay?

I don't think I've yet had the chance to discuss NAMBLA on A2K, so you are thinking of someone else.

Yes, I'm sure NAMBLA has some homosexuals in it's ranks. I'm not sure what your point is. I said that homosexuality is not a mental disorder, not that homosexuals were incapable of being mentally ill or socially disruptive. Is it more of an offensive crime if a man sexually assaults a boy than if he assaults a girl?

BillRM wrote:

Is it not strange that as far as I am aware there is no NAMGLA with heterosexual membership so that this organize sickness belong only to the gay community.

What sickness? Pedophilia? Yeah, you need to check the record books buddy. That sickness runs in both homosexual and heterosexual people. It is in no way unique to gays.

BillRM wrote:

Do not feel proud as a result?

Proud of what?

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@Diest TKO,

Yes they are in and can not be open about it with open relationships or openly approaching fellow members of the military with out fear that they will be kick out.

As long as they only lush in thier heart little harm can be done.

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

And straight males are never harm by gay males as a power trip because they are straight males in the wrong place at the wrong time?

Is that your position that such an event have never happen?

Not at all. In fact, the presence of this kind of violence only further supports that tension and animosity is being breed. Hence a civil issue.

In the case of racial tensions, look at the Rodney King incident. Both the beating of Rodney King and the riots that followed were both evidence of the civil issue. The same applies here.

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@Diest TKO,

The sickness of pedophiles are in both communities however once more please point out one open heterosexual organization that support this behavior in the straight community in the manner NAMBLE support it in the gay community.

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Yes they are in and can not be open about it with open relationships or openly approaching fellow members of the military with out fear that they will be kick out.

As long as they only lush in thier heart little harm can be done.

You forget one thing: Gays live openly elsewhere in our society and in those work environments they don't destroy the work environment. My gay co-workers aren't a threat to me. Why should I think otherwise?

I meet the most interesting people here in DC. I met a gay man, who used to be a Marine. After he was done with his service, guess what he did for 5 years? Worked as a mercenary for Blackwater and carried out military missions in Iraq. Openly. The rest of the Blackwater story pretty much sucked, but the truth remains: He was gay in the war environment.

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@Diest TKO,

Mr. King had stolen someone car and then told part in a high speed chase placing many people lives in danger as a result. Both black and white ciitizens who happen to be using he highways at the time.

Then afterward he did not surround but did for a time resisted arrest.

The cops was guilty of using too must force but I do question if this had anything to do with Mr. King race and if Mr. King had been as white as a sheet of typing paper if the results would had not been the same.

It was a good excuse for a riot however.

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

The sickness of pedophiles are in both communities however once more please point out one open heterosexual organization that support this behavior in the straight community in the manner NAMBLE support it in the gay community.

What's the point? I condemn NAMBLA, and pedophilia. As you admit, it happens with both gays and straights, and the offense is in both cases is equally wrong and criminal.

The nature of your argument is incredibly prejudicial. Some Gays abuse young boys, so gays are sick. Therefore treat all gays as if they are sicko pedophiles.

Most rapists are middle aged white males. Do we treat all middle aged white males with that degree of contempt?

Do you even know where your argument takes you Bill?

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Mr. King had stolen someone car and then told part in a high speed chase placing many people lives in danger as a result. Both black and white ciitizens who happen to be using he highways at the time.

He was on drugs too.

BillRM wrote:

Then afterward he did not surround but did for a time resisted arrest.

Only blacks resist arrest?

BillRM wrote:

The cops was guilty of using too must force but I do question if this had anything to do with Mr. King race and if Mr. King had been as white as a sheet of typing paper if the results would had not been the same.

Yes. WAY TOO MUCH FORCE.

The fact is that Mr. King was obviously a criminal. His crime was in no way unique. Yeah, we are always left to question if he was white would he have been beaten so badly. It's been a while, but I guess you forgot all the details that came up about those officers and their histories afterwards. Given that, there is less to wonder about.

BillRM wrote:

It was a good excuse for a riot however.

Be careful Bill. You wouldn't want to confuse me into thinking that you believe that blacks just wanted a riot or that they are prome to uncivil behavior.

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@Diest TKO,

Do the average office worker live 24/7 in dangerous and uncomfortable situations where their lives depend on the judgment and training of their fellow workers as a combat squad in a war zone would?

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@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Do the average office worker live 24/7 in dangerous and uncomfortable situations where their lives depend on the judgment and training of their fellow workers as a combat squad in a war zone would?

Nope. But your claim is one of sexual tension. You may be inclined to believe that those circumstances create the most tension, but I'd say that you are more likely to see that in a less structured work environment, not the super structured environment of the ARMY etc.

Oh, and maybe you forgot about my story about the gay man serving in Blackwater. He very specifically did work in those conditions... openly gay.

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@Diest TKO,

I am old enough to remember and been too near a number of large scale riots power by young black males.

The police in dealing with the problem tended to just surround it and contain it to the black commuity and that is in my opinion a racist thing to do as it expose law abiding black citizens to unlawful mobs with all the danger that result from such mobs.

The sad thing is that all that would had been needed to end this many decade problem is a few examples of overwhelming force including deadly force being apply.

Anyone not off the street will be shot on sight end of riot end of problem.

One amusing scene was broadcast on the news many years ago of a very peaceful red neck trailor park completely surrounded by a large scale black riot with the smoke of burning buildings in the background.

Everyone was setting outside of their trailers with some form of firearm ranging from rifles and shotguns to small handguns and the reporter was asking if they had any problem and the reply was not one problem in the park.

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@BillRM,

At last you reveal yourself Bill.

Thats all for now.
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@Diest TKO,

So you indeed wish to had it both ways as you like to point out a hate crime that involved a few heterosexuals as proof of some sickness or evilness in the larger heterosexual community when it does not do so.

If such behavior have any large scale meaning then similar homosexual behavior also have such a meaing.

Sorry a few sick people of either straight or gay have zero meaining.

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@Diest TKO,

Yes you are right I had reveal myself in that I do not care for riots and would cheerfully support the used of deadly force against any group white/black/gay/straight that turn to violent mob actions to get their way.

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@Diest TKO,

Oh are you also under the impression that it was of great benefit to the black community to have blocks that contain business and homes burned to the ground?

That the burning of these structures should had been allow as it was allow by the government as after all it was only the black community that was being burned to the ground?

That hoodlums who cheerfully place other lives at risk should not had been stop cold for doing so no matter what their color happen to had been?

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@BillRM,

Quote:

Yes you are right I had reveal myself in that I do not care for riots and would cheerfully support the used of deadly force against any group white/black/gay/straight that turn to violent mob actions to get their way.

a barbaric opinion which tko will now attempt to use to nullify all of your opinions, because he is dishonest like that...

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