DJL, I am turning the other check, and I promise to not disrespect you although for the benefit of other members reading this now and in the future, I won't be granting your wish to stop replying.
djl wrote:Gentlemen,
First, I would ask that Gary stop posting to my thread. First of all, you never answered my question - I asked for your recommendation. Instead you couldn't resist (as usual) form carping on everyone else who's trying to help me out. I haven't been in the water business a single day in my life, but even I could answer some of the comments you made in your last post.
I'm sorry you see it that way, and that you would want me to stop replying in this or any other thread, here or anywhere else on the internet. I have donated time and effort to give you accurate information and I was waiting for your analysis data before replying as to what I would propose.
What you call "carping" I call debate and I do that to correct info you or others are given by others here or anywhere else I post. I'm not sure that you understand the others' agendas but they do have them. My agenda is to help others help themselves and yes, I make many sales because of my posts (about 17,000) over the last twelve years.
Anyway, below I am going to reply to some things you are making incorrect assumptions about.
djl wrote:The point Andy was making is that even if the Kinetico takes additional regenerations over the traditional type (it likely will since it's a smaller unit), the point is its capacity to supply unlimited soft water cannot be rivaled due to the twin-tank design.
Andy never answers the question of how many regenerations per week but you are correct that there will be many of them using the lbs of salt and gallons of water he stated. Please let me know if you get any Kinetico salesman to tell you how many regenerations their softener will be doing per week. Until then you can not compare their softener to other softeners.
djl wrote:We've had many an occurrence in our family, especially when all 8 of our children lived at home (a year ago) where the soft water from our Eco system "ran out."
Then your experience is normal, I hear of that about every other day.. I speak with many people with the same story. That tells us that your old softener was undersized, too small, and if you look at the largest Ecowater softener, they can not produce a larger size than the cabinet can hold; usually no larger than a 1.2 ft3 softener.
djl wrote:So no matter what system you're selling, Gary (Clack valves notwithstanding), there's going to be down times and the 2-5 am window doesn't account for the whole of those down times. If the unit doesn't regenerate till then and the usage was unusually high before, you're out however many hours before the regeneration takes place. So you're not paying lots of money for just three hours.
What I sell comes standard with both metered/demand initiated immediate
and delayed regenerations. It also has variable reserve based on previous water usage in gallons day by day over the last 21 days. Neither Ecowater or Kinetico, or many other softeners have both immediate and delayed regenerations.
Or I can go with a twin tank softener with a Clack alternating motor control and two softeners using the Clack WS-1 control valve. That system has many advantages that Kinetico twins do not and it gives you 24/7 softened water. And they can be counter current regenerated, with fine mesh or SST-60 resin. I also sell regular twin tank softeners using Fleck control valves. MOST families don't need a twin tank type softener. So I certainly can and do compete with Kinetico twin tank softeners.
djl wrote:Furthermore, with the Kinetico unit, you have less parts to go bad since your factoring out all the electronics. Here in NW Arkansas there are a number of outages which makes this an issue for us, the Kinetico system having no electronics to "go out" with the power outages.
Fewer parts, really? Then you have no idea of how many tiny gears they have or that the control valve has three modules with a number of valves and springs and gaskets etc., and their latest valve possibly has more parts. The Clack WS-1 has all of 5 replaceable or wearable parts.
djl wrote:Additionally, Gary, I don't know if you have a relationship with the Lord Jesus, but if you don't you should and if you do, it needs some repairing. You seem just achin to pick a fight with whoever writes, no matter how well-intentioned they are. I don't mind an honest disagreement, but your manner of communicating on this and other websites tends to always return to the abrasive. As I said before, I don't know a lot about softeners, but as a pastor I know a fair deal about the human heart. Please get the help you need from the only One Who can give it. And that help is free. And the warranty on that is better than lifetime.
Though I understand and respect your right to write on any open forum, I would appreciate you not contributing further to this one.
Yeah I'm not all that PC but I voluntarily spent more than a couple years defending your and my right to freedom of speech and freedom of religion pastor and I'll kindly and respectfully assert my right to reply to what I choose to and how I choose. Notice I have not said anything about you personally, very unlike what has been said about me.
djl wrote:I tried to get better numbers today. A local WaterCare man came ... The hardness appeared to be between 5-6 grains. There's 2 ppm nitrates and 0.3 ppm nitrites. The chlorine reading seemed rather negligible. He was talking about installing either a CareSoft EM unit or CareClear softener and a RO-18 RO unit for approximately $1,390. ... The only attractive thing about the whole deal is that there in town and the price, though I learned long ago, "You get what you pay for.".... On the upside, regarding labor, he said they charge a flat fee of $60 for each service call plus whatever parts might be needed. The warranty was singularly unimpressive. The RO membrane, for example, was only a one-year.
A number of years ago I was a dealer for WaterCare. They have good equipment although it is proprietary, yet the control valves are made by Clack and Fleck.
You can top dress a softener for the removal of Nitrates, or use a Nitrate filter that regenerates with softener salt, or use a drinking water filter with a special Nitrate cartridge or an RO or distiller.
djl wrote:So do I buy two of these (over time) to compensate for the price of the Eco unit or close to two and a half of them for the price of the Kinetico?
Getting weary of the whole business...
DJL
I say buy online and spend a lot less than for any of them, including the WaterCare and hire a plumber or church member? to install it. You'll get nonproprietary industry standard equipment that any person 14 or older, including any local dealer can repair if they want to.
