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AFI's Top 10 Films of the Top Ten Genres

 
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 02:43 pm
I have a tape of Day the Earth Stood Still. I watch it every year or so.
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joefromchicago
 
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Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 03:14 pm
Lightwizard wrote:
To this day, Hollywood including AMPAS and AFI considers English language films, specifically British productions , as not being foreign films and are considered with American films, especially those featuring American actors.

True, but this is the American Film Institute's list. In order for a film to be included by the AFI, I believe a movie has to be an American production or co-production (that's the only reason why I can see A Cry in the Dark being included -- it is, in all other respects, an Australian film). The Third Man was, by almost all measures, a British film, but it was partly financed by David O. Selznick, who released the film in the US. That might make it an American film, although the British Film Institute thinks it's a British film.

Lightwizard wrote:
"A Clockwork Orange" takes place in a future Britain and therefore is sci-fi, albeit mainly of the satirical, sociological kind. It was also made in England. I can agree it is the greatest satirical sci-fi film, and what movie would it edge out? I can't think of any off hand.

I guess my criteria for science fiction films would have some requirement for ... well, you know, science. A Clockwork Orange is just a film set in a dystopian future -- not much science there. On that basis, Idiocracy would be a science fiction movie too.

Lightwizard wrote:
The glaring omission in Epics is "Citizen Kane," their top movie of the 100 and absolutely an epic story of a personal life, saga and epic being closely related to begin with.

If Titanic and Saving Private Ryan are "epics" then there's no rational criteria for inclusion in this category. I suppose "epic" just means "a movie that cost a lot of money." On that basis, Citizen Kane should definitely be considered an "epic."
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Lightwizard
 
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Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 04:16 pm
The same debate as to the genre of "A Clockwork Orange" being science fiction is the same as whether or not sociology is a science. I remember an on-going debate at the meetings of the Los Angeles Science Fantasy Society -- yes, even with Ackerman as one of the founders and a long standing member, they kept the "fantasy" and never replaced it with "fiction", specifically about the sub-genre of science fiction, dubbed future fiction. Future fiction found its venue in the old Galaxy Magazine, where any science in the story (like futuristic cars) is secondary to the sociological themes. ACO has been written many times and usually classified as satirical sci-fi.

Almost always, one of the main aspects of sci-fi is that the story takes place in the future. So, was "1984" science fiction at the time is was written, or "Brave New World? Frank Herbert's "Santaroga Barrier" about an isolated town in California (not particularly in the future) that had closed itself off from the rest of the world and the citizens kept "high" on a strange biologically beneficial drug and appeared first in Astounding Science Fiction. "The Demolished Man" is a murder mystery and the cruz of the story is telepathy, not a typical technological advancement found in most sci-fi. Azimov's "The Caves of Steel," although making reference to robotic laws from past works, is essentially a sociological murder mystery -- the outcome had very little to do with science.

Reading a lot of science fiction earlier in my life, I found much of it stories using advance technology merely as a background and not a driving force of the story. This is the sci-fi that rarely gets made into movies as there's no motivation for grand special effects. "Seconds" was one of those films.

I ask again, what movie would replace "A Clockwork Orange" in particular . Now I recall last evening that I really was expecting "Close Encounters of the Third Kind."
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joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 04:48 pm
Lightwizard wrote:
I ask again, what movie would replace "A Clockwork Orange" in particular . Now I recall last evening that I really was expecting "Close Encounters of the Third Kind."

I'm not really the person to ask: sci-fi isn't exactly my cup of tea. If you want sci-fi satire, I'd put Sleeper in there.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 06:10 pm
edgar, I also feel that Ratatouille was a superior animated flick to many of those aged "classics" of Disney.

In fact, most of the upper echelon of each of the AFI catagories Id find hard to include in my list. Im not fond of including movies "just" because they are made before 1960.Many such movies were on that AFI list, IMNSHO.
For example, where was "Inherit the Wind" or "The Bank Dick"
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farmerman
 
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Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 06:11 pm
"SLeeper" was, IMNSHO, the 2nd best Woody pic after "Zellig"
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edgarblythe
 
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Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 06:45 pm
"Inherit the Wind" or "The Bank Dick"


Lots of really fine ones overlooked for films I can't even sit through.
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Lightwizard
 
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Reply Thu 19 Jun, 2008 05:51 am
"The Bank Dick" would have likely shown up in a top ten comedies, but instead the comedies were mixed into the ten genres. This is more than ridiculous considering how many great comedies are in film history. So, no "Sullivan's Travels," "Some Like It Hot" (where would that have fit in -- romantic comedies? Laughing ). Or maybe Gangster Laughing

Another glaring genre left by the wayside is musicals. How can anyone compile a list of genres and leave out musicals. I guess they put "Chicago" in gangster (or courtroom???) but it didn't make the grade. "Chicago" is based on a true story, and "Cabaret" was based on Christopher Isherwood's
"Berlin Stories" which were part real history and autobiographical.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jun, 2008 06:00 am
What, no Porky's?



My point is, these lists are pointless. Who looked at Rolling Stone's "top 300 rock songs"? It's a horrible list.

Nugent isn't in the RRHOF either, because Jann Wenner is a douchbag.
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Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jun, 2008 07:16 am
I'm not quite sure your serious about "Porky's." The user rating on IMDb is 5.7 -- so that's just the movie watching couch potato's vote.

These lists aren't pointless, they're subjective opinion. AFI did get it about 70% right, but that's my subjective opinion. I'd like to find out how they came up with the ten genres and if they are considered the most popular.
It's probably on their site at www.afi.com
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Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jun, 2008 07:26 am
I'm disappointed that "Psycho" did not make the list. As far as I am concerned, it is a superbly crafted film, as well as a great mystery.
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Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jun, 2008 07:42 am
Hitchcock had four films in the Mystery genre -- "Vertigo," "Rear Window" and "North by Northwest," and "Dial M for Murder." I'm sure "Psycho" was on the short list, but it's another reason why just 10 genres didn't make it very comprehensive. "Psycho" would definitely appear in a top ten list of horror films.
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mac11
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Jun, 2008 09:23 am
Perhaps they'll do another show and come up with ten more categories.

I wondered about musicals and non-romantic comedies too.
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Lightwizard
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jun, 2008 08:30 am
My thoughts on a best of anything list that manages to omit "Casablanca," "Jaws" but includes "The 10 Commandments" and the silly, unwatchable "Cat Ballou" which isn't even in their top 100 (among others).

ANIMATION
1 SNOW WHITE AND THE SEVEN DWARFS 1937
2 PINOCCHIO 1940
3 BAMBI 1942
4 THE LION KING 1994
5 FANTASIA 1940
6 TOY STORY 1995
7 BEAUTY AND THE BEAST 1991
8 SHREK 2001
9 CINDERELLA 1950
10 FINDING NEMO 2003

"Cinderella" out, "Ratatouille," likely the best written animation film ever produced, in.

FANTASY
1 THE WIZARD OF OZ 1939
2 THE LORD OF THE RINGS: THE FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING 2001
3 IT'S A WONDERFUL LIFE 1946
4 KING KONG 1933
5 MIRACLE ON 34th STREET 1947
6 FIELD OF DREAMS 1989
7 HARVEY 1950
8 GROUNDHOG DAY 1993
9 THE THIEF OF BAGDAD 1924
10 BIG 1988

All three LOTR movies are deserving of being on a top ten fantasy film list, and "Fellowship" over "Return of the King?" Not. Fantasy films are rather a scare genre but both versions "Heaven Can Wait" certainly beats out "Groundhog Day."

GANGSTER
1 THE GODFATHER 1972
2 GOODFELLAS 1990
3 THE GODFATHER PART II 1974
4 WHITE HEAT 1949
5 BONNIE AND CLYDE 1967
6 SCARFACE: THE SHAME OF A NATION 1932
7 PULP FICTION 1994
8 THE PUBLIC ENEMY 1931
9 LITTLE CAESAR 1930
10 SCARFACE 1983

One too many Cagney films in this list. "Little Caesar" or "The Public Enemy" out, "Mean Streets," "Miller's Crossing," "Once Upon a Time in America" or "The Untouchables" in. This heading is off-base to begin with -- it should be "CRIME" and "LA Confidential" would easily push out the 1983 "Scarface," more of a bloodbath spectacle than a story. "LA Confidential" could also be in the MYSTERY category and push out "Laura," or "Blue Velvet." If it were a CRIME category, "Fargo" could also be in the list.

SCIENCE FICTION
1 2001: A SPACE ODYSSEY 1968
2 STAR WARS: EPISODE IV - A NEW HOPE 1977
3 E.T. - THE EXTRA TERRESTRIAL 1982
4 A CLOCKWORK ORANGE 1971
5 THE DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL 1951
6 BLADE RUNNER 1982
7 ALIEN 1979
8 TERMINATOR 2: JUDGMENT DAY 1991
9 INVASION OF THE BODY SNATCHERS 1956
10 BACK TO THE FUTURE 1985

Right off, "Blade Runner" should be higher on the list, and "Aliens" was a better film than "Alien." "E.T." out, "Close Encounters of the Third Time" in.

WESTERN
1 THE SEARCHERS 1956
2 HIGH NOON 1952
3 SHANE 1953
4 UNFORGIVEN 1992
5 RED RIVER 1948
6 THE WILD BUNCH 1969
7 BUTCH CASSIDY AND THE SUNDANCE KID 1969
8 McCABE & MRS. MILLER 1971
9 STAGECOACH 1939
10 CAT BALLOU 1965

Oh, come on -- the unfunny silliness of "Cat Ballou" out, "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" or "The Treasure of the Sierra Madre" in.

SPORTS
1 RAGING BULL 1980
2 ROCKY 1976
3 THE PRIDE OF THE YANKEES 1942
4 HOOSIERS 1986
5 BULL DURHAM 1988
6 THE HUSTLER 1961
7 CADDYSHACK 1980
8 BREAKING AWAY 1979
9 NATIONAL VELVET 1944
10 JERRY MAGUIRE 1996

"Hoosiers" is still too formulaic, "Caddyshack's" humor has gone terribly stale. "North Dallas Forty" "Seabiscuit," "A League of Their Own," "Friday Night Lights," are just a few which should not only bounce "Caddyshack" but also "National Velvet," really too sticky with sentiment.

MYSTERY
1 VERTIGO 1958
2 CHINATOWN 1974
3 REAR WINDOW 1954
4 LAURA 1944
5 THE THIRD MAN 1949
6 THE MALTESE FALCON 1941
7 NORTH BY NORTHWEST 1959
8 BLUE VELVET 1986
9 DIAL M FOR MURDER 1954
10 THE USUAL SUSPECTS 1995

This is easy -- "Dial M for Murder" has an intriguing gimmick with the key under the stair carpet, incredible camera work in the attempted murder scene (thank gawd for sewing baskets!) but easily replaced by another Hitchcock, "Strangers on a Train." "Dial M" is less of an example of genius at work but a walk-thru for the director and "Strangers" is ingenious. "Casablanca" is essentially a mystery film, but again the limiting to ten categories leaves out dramatic ROMANCE, a huge genre with a long list of masterpieces including the recent "Atonement."

ROMANTIC COMEDY
1 CITY LIGHTS 1931
2 ANNIE HALL 1977
3 IT HAPPENED ONE NIGHT 1934
4 ROMAN HOLIDAY 1953
5 THE PHILADELPHIA STORY 1940
6 WHEN HARRY MET SALLY ... 1989
7 ADAM'S RIB 1949
8 MOONSTRUCK 1987
9 HAROLD AND MAUDE 1971
10 SLEEPLESS IN SEATTLE 1993

"Sleepless In Seattle" definitely out, "Sullivan's Travels" in.

COURTROOM DRAMA
1 TO KILL A MOCKINGBIRD 1962
2 12 ANGRY MEN 1957
3 KRAMER VS. KRAMER 1979
4 THE VERDICT 1982
5 A FEW GOOD MEN 1992
6 WITNESS FOR THE PROSECUTION 1957
7 ANATOMY OF A MURDER 1959
8 IN COLD BLOOD 1967
9 A CRY IN THE DARK 1988
10 JUDGMENT AT NUREMBERG 1961

A respectably good list but the courtroom section of "In Cold Blood" is really scant. I could easily replace "A Few Good Men" with "Michael Clayton."

EPIC
1 LAWRENCE OF ARABIA 1962
2 BEN-HUR 1959
3 SCHINDLER'S LIST 1993
4 GONE WITH THE WIND 1939
5 SPARTACUS 1960
6 TITANIC 1997
7 ALL QUIET ON THE WESTERN FRONT 1930
8 SAVING PRIVATE RYAN 1998
9 REDS 1981
10 THE TEN COMMANDMENTS 1956

Oh, easily, the Classics Illustrate version of "The Ten Commandments" with some of the worst dialogue and hammy acting ever committed to film. The special effects, amazing for the time, are now rather clunky.
Easily replaced by "Citizen Kane" and that film moved up to No. 1.


That's my response now, also just as subjective as a poll and polls are so often unreliable to begin with.
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wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Jun, 2008 08:44 am
What surprised me the most is that "Caddyshack" is considered the #7 sports movie of all time. (Did "Happy Gilmore" make the top 20?)
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farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Fri 20 Jun, 2008 08:51 am
I have a list that has a "ridiculous druggy comedy category" and the only entry (and by default, number 1) is THE BIG LEBOWSKI
gamingimitation
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Aug, 2008 02:33 pm
This seems like a pretty good solid list.
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Paaskynen
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Aug, 2008 03:52 am
@farmerman,
Another entry in that category would be Living High/Puff, Puff, Pass (2006), but it is much less funny.
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