Bowling for Columbine!

I think it's unreasonable and a bit silly to run around pushing attempts to stem the flow of firearms to people that shouldn't have them by passing laws that only prevent them from getting the firearm at the local convention center but still allows them to go out into the parking lot or over to another persons house and buy them.

Tighten the rules on all private gun sales and the gun show issue disappears along with it.

Here are the homicide rates, inside and
outside major metropolitan areas.

homicide handgun % with
rate homicide rate handgun
Canada 2.8 0.3 11
<1M 3.1 0.2 6
>1M 2.2 0.4 18
US 8.5 3.5 41
<1M 3.7 1.1 30
>1M 14.1 6.4 45

[The comparison of populations of over 1 Million show Canada with a rate of 2.2 (per 100,000) and the US with 14.1 . That's a rate over 11 times that of Canada.
The comparison of Toronto and Boston may be abnormal. I don't know. More]

"Comparing the regions outside the major metropolitan centres we see that the 0.6 higher US rate (3.7 vs 3.1) is associated with a 0.9 higher handgun homicide rate (1.1 vs 0.2). In the major metropolitan
centres, the difference in homicide rates far exceeds the difference in handgun homicide rates, so there are obviously other differences"

The variable would seem to be handguns.

fishin' I'm all for tightening up the private sales. I happen to thik the gun shows an impediment in and of themselves because of their lobbying ability.

As long as the gun nuts can be convinced, I support any law making gun ownership more closely regulated. I think that curbing the unregulates gun bazaars might be a nice first step.

I tend to agree with just about everything Fishin' has said. On the other hand, we've gotten away from one of the original questions -- why are Americans seemingly more paranoid than, say, Australians? The reason Americans like their guns is no mystery. It's historical. From the Minutemen on Lexington Common, toting muskets, to the settling of the West with the help of Colts and Winchesters, the wntire history of the country is based on firearms. But, to a large extent, so is Australia's, especially the settlement of the Outback. And, to an even larger extent, so is Canda's. So why do we think we need guns more than the Aussies or the Canajuns? I don't know. I own several firearms, including three handguns, but I've never thought of them as being solely for 'protection'. Protection from what? There 's a large and fairly well-regulated police force here in Boston to protect me. I happen to like firearms, enjoy target practice, etc. etc. Is there really a culture of fear here? I don't know but I'll stay tuned.

MA - I thought that there was research ('twas a book?) showing that the whole image of the sturdy pre-revolutionary and such fella with his gun and his plough, able to form a citizen militia at the drop of a hat was a myth - and that such weapons were very scarce? The west I have no comment on. I wish I could remember where I read that - I cannot give a cite, dammit!

I am sure many of our settlers had guns - they are very useful to such folk - but we do not seem to have formed a gun culture, as such. There is now a body, doubtless modelling itself on your NRA (is that right?) which says much the same stuff - sometimes, clearly, from the net, since the loonier fringe of it quote their constitutional right to arm themselves - which does not exist in our constitution! (We also have a venerable sporting shooters' association and a woodsy/fieldy lot). Perhaps our relative lack of big, furry, things that can eat you has played a role? Damned if I know - I mean, the average Ozite is fearful of crime - but not feeling that they need a gun to protect themselves.

Fishin' - I am unsure how regulating private sales would keep guns out of crims' hands any more than you think regulating shop sales has?

This in from Spinsanity:


Moore alters "Bowling" DVD in response to criticism (9/2)
By Brendan Nyhan

In the newly-released DVD version of "Bowling for Columbine,"
filmmaker Michael Moore has altered a caption that he
fictitiously inserted into a 1988 Bush-Quayle campaign commercial
- one of a number of misstatements and deceptive arguments we
criticized when the film was released last year. Ironically, on
the same day the DVD was released, Moore issued a libel threat
against his critics, saying, "Every fact in the film is true.
Absolutely every fact in the film is true. And anybody who says
otherwise is committing an act of libel."

http://www.spinsanity.org/post.html?2003_08_31_archive.html#1062477905999081
1

[alternative short URL: http://tinyurl.com/lxa8 ]

There is such a book. "Arming America: The Origins of a National Gun Culture " by Professor Michael Bellesiles of Emory University. The author however, fabricated much of it and the award he was given for the book was revoked. Turns out most of the "facts" in the book were fabrications.

http://www.etherzone.com/2002/antl011102.shtml



As much as the state of MA gets critized for it's gun control policies they are pretty effective. To possess a firearms in MA you have to get a permit from your local Police Chief after they've completed a background check and all firearms are required to be registered with the State Police. The permit also states right on it any limitations of what types of firearms the holder can possess. To conduct a private sale the seller must confirm that the buyer has a permit and must report the sale and transfer registration with the State Police within 48 hours. If all states had such a system that covered private sales then the occurances of firearms transfers to criminals would be reduced because people would have a way to verify that the buyer is legit and there would be complete traceability of the firearm. These same permits are required to purchase anything at a gun show in this state.

The possibility still exists that someone could evade the law but knowing that they would easily be caught transferring a firearm to someone that doesn't hold a permit would be a significant deterrent. If they choose to evade the law and the firearm is found to be used in a crime the police are going to follow the trail of registrations. The last person who had the firearm registered in their name is going to have some 'splainin to do.

Both interesting comments, Fishin'! I will look at your link tomorrow.

So the thread is about why Americans are more paranoid about crime than other nations.

A study done a couple of years ago found a correlation between how much television Americns watch and their perception of crime in America. It goes without saying that the more hours they watched, the greater their perception of crime.

must have been all the roadrunner cartoons i have watched.

Bookmark

The film pushed the idea that Americans are more paraniod about crime and attempted to use the firearms issue to demonstrate that point. (there were some other things used to...)

Personally, I think we're just plain more paraniod about just about everything.

Really? Why do you think that (if you are serious!) and why do you think it is so?

Which part there bunny? The comment about the movie or the one about us 'mericans in general?

I saw it tonight for the first time and was surprised at how much better it is -- deeper, more interesting -- than I'd expected. He's right about fear and the use of fear. And so much more. The firearms issue was really not as central to the film as I expected -- it was a device.

Sorry Fishin' - didn't see your question there - the one about Americans in general.

No problem lil bunny!

I was totally serious. I think we Americans are highly paraniod when compared to most of the rest of the world. It seems to be pretty apparent in out politics but it's there in our daily lives too.

It's pretty striking when an American travels overseas. The daily rush and stir just aren't there at the same level of intensity in other parts of the world. We (collectively) are way to suspicious of the motiviations of others, we have little or no patience, we are way to self-absorbed and we attach to little significance to "value".

In the end I think what that gets us is a lot of rash decisions that bring about concequences never intended. Then we make more rash decisions to deal with the new problems.

I think most of teh European countries in particular, have a much more thought out national objective setup and they plod slowly along towards that objective. In the US, we change our objectives every few years and then make drastic changes in policy and law in an effort to get the new objective as far along as possible in a very short period of time.

We are the proverbial chickens running around with our heads cut off.

Note that at times it seems like we invented the conspiracy theory.

Nowhere else on earth will you find so many people who have been probed and otherwise violated by aliens and such.

In other nations where complex conspiracies actually did occur in assasinations etc you will find little of the All-American stir that the JFK conspiracies bring.

The paranoia in America is almost palpable.

And why do the aliens alaways probe and violate wierdos who live in trailer parks? I realize its hard to get a date sometimes, but menthol smoking toothless trailerbabes? Give me a break!

Trailer parks are in and of themselves quite an American phenom.

Chicken or egg.
Alien or trailer park.