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Oz election thread #3 - Rudd's Labour

 
 
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Jul, 2008 06:12 pm
msolga wrote:
Just want to say how sorry I am about the demise of the Democrats. For quite a few years they were a positive force in the Senate & it's sad that they won't be around any more.

Too bad about their problems: Cheryl losing her head (over Gareth! Shocked Rolling Eyes ) & defecting to Labour, then Meg ( Evil or Very Mad ) & her deal with the devil over the GST. All really unfortunate, as the party never recovered from both those episodes.

So now it's just the Greens & some independents left in the Senate, along with the BIG 2.
Sad, really sad. <sigh>


Wow, I thought I had filed Aus politics away for awhile and could move on to the U.S. and some European races. The Dems self-destructed, huh?
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Jul, 2008 07:42 pm
realjohnboy wrote:
The Dems self-destructed, huh?


More like they died through a lack of interest on the electorate's behalf.

There was an internecine struggle - but ultimately they just became irrelevant.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 04:55 pm
Hmmmm, I reckon they self-destructed & became irrelevant directly as a result of their internal (post-Cheryl, post-Meg) upheavals. One thing I liked about the Dems was that their members seemed to have a real say (unlike the ALP, where the members' designated role seems to fun-raising & handing out the "how to vote" tickets on polling days). I think the Dems must have lost many of their most active (especially left) members as a result of their internal "troubles", which probably affected their policies, then relevance to the voters. Ah well, it's all history now.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 05:03 pm
Greetings, RJB!

I understand you still have 4 months to go before your election. Wow, what a long, gruelling ride it's been already! Good luck in surviving this last bit!

Fingers crossed for Obama!
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 05:30 pm
One last thing: I know it's still early days, but I'd be interested in Oz A2Kers assessments on the Rudd government's first 8 months in office. Strengths & weaknesses, the major challenges .....
How do you think the Labour government is faring so far?
0 Replies
 
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 06:32 pm
msolga wrote:
Greetings, RJB!

I understand you still have 4 months to go before your election. Wow, what a long, gruelling ride it's been already! Good luck in surviving this last bit!

Fingers crossed for Obama!


Ah, yes. 4 months left in what has been a long, long process already. As you know we elect not by a popular vote system (who gets the most votes overall) but by an electoral vote system (with the popular vote winner in each state getting a certain number of points). It gets pretty complex.
But I have stated publically on another thread that Virginia, my state of Virginia, will go for the Democrat for the 1st time since 1964. And Obama will win.
0 Replies
 
dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 06:47 pm
The Rudd government seems to be getting done the things they said they would.

Action on climate change is proceeding apace and I am really impressed with Penny Wong. Garrett wont last past the next election.

Iguanagate is a nusiance but I feel Rudd is doing the right thing in waiting for the police to finish the investigation.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 07:51 pm
dadpad wrote:
The Rudd government seems to be getting done the things they said they would.

Action on climate change is proceeding apace and I am really impressed with Penny Wong. Garrett wont last past the next election.

Iguanagate is a nusiance but I feel Rudd is doing the right thing in waiting for the police to finish the investigation.



Re Iguanagate:

It makes me wonder if these people had always been like that, or if the power has released something nasty?


Mind you, anyone who abuses someone in a position like waiter etc is scum to me. Boy, can you see the true character of a lot of people when you are working jobs like that.
0 Replies
 
dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 4 Jul, 2008 08:20 pm
dlowan wrote:
dadpad wrote:
The Rudd government seems to be getting done the things they said they would.

Action on climate change is proceeding apace and I am really impressed with Penny Wong. Garrett wont last past the next election.

Iguanagate is a nusiance but I feel Rudd is doing the right thing in waiting for the police to finish the investigation.



Re Iguanagate:

It makes me wonder if these people had always been like that, or if the power has released something nasty?


Mind you, anyone who abuses someone in a position like waiter etc is scum to me. Boy, can you see the true character of a lot of people when you are working jobs like that.


I've never believed the maxim Of "The customer is always right"
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 5 Jul, 2008 12:08 am
realjohnboy wrote:
msolga wrote:
Greetings, RJB!

I understand you still have 4 months to go before your election. Wow, what a long, gruelling ride it's been already! Good luck in surviving this last bit!

Fingers crossed for Obama!


Ah, yes. 4 months left in what has been a long, long process already. As you know we elect not by a popular vote system (who gets the most votes overall) but by an electoral vote system (with the popular vote winner in each state getting a certain number of points). It gets pretty complex.
But I have stated publicly on another thread that Virginia, my state of Virginia, will go for the Democrat for the 1st time since 1964. And Obama will win.


Yep, it does sound pretty complex, especially for a person living in a country with an entirely different system, RJB, but it sort of makes sense!

I hope you're right about Virginia. If you are, things are looking up .. not just for Virginia & the US ... but for all of us on the planet! Very Happy

Go Obama!
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 5 Jul, 2008 12:30 am
dadpad wrote:
The Rudd government seems to be getting done the things they said they would.

Action on climate change is proceeding apace and I am really impressed with Penny Wong. Garrett wont last past the next election.

Iguanagate is a nusiance but I feel Rudd is doing the right thing in waiting for the police to finish the investigation.


Thanks for your input & for getting the discussion rolling, dadpad.

I am genuinely interested about what Australians think, at this stage. I'd also love to hear from Wilso, dadpad, Deb, Vikorr (sp?) & hinge (plus any other Australians here - you are most welcome!)

I've deliberately refrained from commenting at this point. Simply to keep the discussion open, rather creating a situation where people are responding to just one opinion - which can be quite limiting.

I think we're distanced enough from <shudder> the Howard years to start forming some opinions about how Rudd's Labor (got the spelling right this time! :wink: ) is doing, in its own right.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sat 5 Jul, 2008 12:48 am
dlowan wrote:
dadpad wrote:
The Rudd government seems to be getting done the things they said they would.

Action on climate change is proceeding apace and I am really impressed with Penny Wong. Garrett wont last past the next election.

Iguanagate is a nusiance but I feel Rudd is doing the right thing in waiting for the police to finish the investigation.



Re Iguanagate:

It makes me wonder if these people had always been like that, or if the power has released something nasty?


Mind you, anyone who abuses someone in a position like waiter etc is scum to me. Boy, can you see the true character of a lot of people when you are working jobs like that.


I feel very uncomfortable about the Iguanagate stuff, Deb. Because it has that unpleasant witch-hunt whiff about it.
I don't like political witch-hunts, via the media, not at all. I strongly suspect that the subjects of this witch-hunt have a lot to answer for, but this is not the right way for the ALP to deal with them.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sat 5 Jul, 2008 02:35 am
msolga wrote:
dlowan wrote:
dadpad wrote:
The Rudd government seems to be getting done the things they said they would.

Action on climate change is proceeding apace and I am really impressed with Penny Wong. Garrett wont last past the next election.

Iguanagate is a nusiance but I feel Rudd is doing the right thing in waiting for the police to finish the investigation.



Re Iguanagate:

It makes me wonder if these people had always been like that, or if the power has released something nasty?


Mind you, anyone who abuses someone in a position like waiter etc is scum to me. Boy, can you see the true character of a lot of people when you are working jobs like that.


I feel very uncomfortable about the Iguanagate stuff, Deb. Because it has that unpleasant witch-hunt whiff about it.
I don't like political witch-hunts, via the media, not at all. I strongly suspect that the subjects of this witch-hunt have a lot to answer for, but this is not the right way for the ALP to deal with them.





Letting the police do their thing, or starting to put them out in the cold?




Yes...a media baying for blood is an unlovely sight.


Meanwhile.....I have been disappointed (very) at the speed with which Rudd began to demonise the public service.


I agree Penny is doing good....but you can begin to see the poor dear age. Being a minister is SO tough.

The River Murray seems like a good start, though I am terrified it is too late.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Jul, 2008 05:50 am
I share your concern about the Murray, Deb. I hope it's not too little too late.

OK, my turn. The high points so far for me have been the Apology (at last, at last!) & the Kyoto catch-up (finally!) The "symbolic" gestures. Very important ones.

Overall I agree with dadpad, Labor seems intent on meeting most of its election commitments. (Strange though, what a passionless process it's sometimes seemed. I read an AGE article the other day suggesting that if the government wanted to convince Australians about the necessity & urgency of Garnaut's proposals, then the arguments needed to be put much more "passionately", more forcefully. And that the prime minister was the one who should do this.)

I was very pleased to see Australia's lowest paid workers received their rise in the Fair Pay Commission (I think that's what it's called. :wink: )today. Quite an improvement on the last episode, when the Libs were in power.

I would like to see some serious effort put into improving public health & education, which are in a diabolical state across the country. Though it's early days, I guess .... & would mean addressing government funding of these institutions. Which would mightily upset a lot of the "pro-private" folk who consider the windfalls of the Howard years an entitlement. Perhaps Labor is concerned about scaring the horses at this early stage of government? But something must be done about about the sorry state of public health & education funding at some stage in Rudd's term. Rudd talked about the importance of education so much during the election campaign, but it seems (so far) that the "revolution" is only about computers in schools. Rather disappointing.

I was very surprised at the mileage that the Libs made over the "petrol price issue" a few weeks back. The Libs weren't actually offering all that much to motorists but appeared to gain a fair bit of ground, anyway. I don't think Labor handled that debate very well & this worried me. I hope they perform better on more important issues.

Just a few thoughts, as they've come to mind. I'm sure more will come to mind.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Jul, 2008 06:12 am
The Australian's take on Kevin Rudd's current (post-budget) popularity with voters. Not knowing too many older, wealthier conservative voters & "the elite" :wink: , I can't vouch for it's accuracy ... But interesting.:

Voters begin to shift on PM
George Megalogenis
July 07, 2008

KEVIN Rudd has suffered double-digit falls in his popularity among higher-income earners, full-time workers and people aged 35-49 years as the superstar ratings of earlier in the year returned to more mortal levels in recent weeks.

A special analysis of Newspoll shows that the Prime Minister has lost support among all demographic groups - male and female, rich and poor, and households with and without children - since the May budget.

But he still has almost 85 per cent of Labor voters satisfied with the job he is doing as prime minister.

The hard numbers reinforce focus group polling detailed last week to The Australian that shows the electorate is increasingly disappointed with Mr Rudd - although not yet disillusioned.

Both Newspoll and the research from the Ipsos Mackay group pinpoint the May budget as the moment Mr Rudd's job satisfaction rating began to sour.

Interestingly, Mr Rudd didn't do as badly among households with children - they trimmed his rating by 7.7 percentage points to 60.9 per cent, while those without children cut it by 10.7 points to 56.8 per cent.

The most worrying part of the Newspoll research for Mr Rudd is it suggests a window may have already closed on his leadership because he no longer commands the respect of older, wealthier conservative voters.

Mr Rudd's satisfaction rating among Coalition supporters generally averaged 40.9 per cent between March and early May. But in the four Newspolls taken since the May 13 budget, it slumped by 12.4 points to 28.5per cent.

Coalition voters appear to be behind the double-digit falls in Mr Rudd's standing among those households on more than $70,000 (down 12.2 points to 59.9 per cent), full-time workers (down 11.6 points to 58.8 per cent) and people aged 35-49 years (down 12.1 per cent to 57.2per cent).

Labor strategists may not be fussed by the shift in sentiment among the elite, but will be more concerned about the wobble among the middle-aged.

It will be harder from here on for Mr Rudd to appeal to the Coalition for bipartisanship in the same way that he had earlier in the year.

The danger for Brendan Nelson is if he reads the drop in Mr Rudd's standing among Coalition voters as a wider trend, when it may be nothing more than a return to partisan politics as normal.

Mr Rudd enjoyed an unprecedented honeymoon in his first year-and-a-half as Labor leader - beginning with his rise to the Opposition leader's job in December 2006, and accelerating since winning the November election last year.

He already holds the top five satisfaction ratings as prime minister in the 23-year history of Newspoll. Tellingly, these benchmarks were set before the May 13 budget, which was geared towards so-called "working families", who received tax cuts and rebates for education and childcare, while higher-income earners lost family benefits.

Mr Rudd's popularity peaked at a record 71 per cent in mid-April. He still had 68 per cent of voters satisfied with the job he was doing on budget eve - a figure John Howard never reached in 11 1/2 years in office.

Since the budget, however, Mr Rudd's fortnightly rating has zig-zagged south - to 63 per cent, then 56 per cent, then 59 per cent and, at the end of last month, a relatively modest 54 per cent.


When the proportion of people who are satisfied with Mr Rudd's performance is subtracted from those who are not, the mood shift becomes more dramatic - his so-called net satisfaction tumbled from 56 per cent in mid-April to 22 per cent at the end of last month. Yet none of this backlash has transferred across to the Opposition Leader's column. Dr Nelson's net satisfaction rating has gone into reverse over the same period, from plus 2 per cent to minus 6 per cent, even though he ran a populist campaign against rising petrol prices.

The special Newspoll compared the four surveys before the May 13 budget with the four surveys since, and focused on Mr Rudd's satisfaction rating. There were statistically significant falls in Mr Rudd's popularity across all groups.

Before the budget, Mr Rudd had a satisfaction rating above 60per cent among every demographic except Coalition voters. Now most groups are below this figure. Apart from Labor voters, the only areas Mr Rudd retained popularity better than 60 per cent were among people aged 18-34 years (down 7.9 points to 64 per cent) and part-time workers (down 7.7 points to 63.8 per cent).

Like most Australians, Liberal voter Jon Warner was prepared to give the fresh-faced Mr Rudd a fair go when he replaced Mr Howard as prime minister.

The advertising director from Sydney's northern beaches was impressed by Mr Rudd's early move to ratify the Kyoto Protocol - a "nice bit of PR" - and the apology to the Stolen Generations. "His heart's in the right place," the 44-year-old Mr Warner said.

But over the past few months, he has grown increasingly sceptical of Mr Rudd's frenetic leadership style. "There's all the bells and whistles but not a lot of content - he's the master of the 30-second grab." His mate Luke Cook, 27, who also works in advertising, said the word on the street is: "Kevin 07, Mistake 08."


http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23979407-601,00.html
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Jul, 2008 10:53 pm
Am I alone in thinking Penny Wong might be Australia's first female prime minister? She's so dang reasonable and measured without waffling.

How proud would I be of a a lesbian prime minister of asian extraction!
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Jul, 2008 04:03 pm
Halleluljah!

While the Rudd government has been quietly getting people the hell out of mandatory detention, there are still people there.

Now an Inquiry.


Get-Up on this:


Dear Deborah,

Chances like this don't come very often - to end a regrettable chapter of Australian history that caused unimaginable suffering to some of the world's most desperate and downtrodden.

The Government has launched an unexpected but long-awaited inquiry into immigration detention - the system that gave us children in detention, sewn lips, the Cornelia Rau affair and condemnation from the international community.

We believe this Inquiry signals that the Government genuinely wants to put an end to Australia's inhumane detention regime, and for the first time they are asking us for our views. If ever you have despaired at the treatment of asylum seekers, put your name to GetUp's petition submission and help end this ongoing national shame:

www.getup.org.au/campaign/EndMandatoryDetention

So many times the community has rallied against mandatory detention and finally we have been given the chance to consign it to the dustbin of history. Now we must demonstrate to the Government that we demand a humane system.

For over a decade, governments have been so concerned not to appear soft on asylum seekers that they have denied basic rights and dignity and opted for the cheap politics of fear. This is our chance to stand up and demonstrate that Australians demand decency.

Together we will show that harsh treatment of the vulnerable is unacceptable in our community. Click here to give a mandate for a future of decency and respect.

www.getup.org.au/campaign/EndMandatoryDetention

This Inquiry is a moment we've been waiting for to show that what was thought to be popular in the electorate - to be seen as harsh on asylum seekers - is something we profoundly reject. Contribute to our submission, and show the world that our better nature is stronger than our fear. Speak up today to right over a decade of wrongs.

Help us hit our initial target of 50,000 signatures by forwarding this email to your friends.

Thanks for being a part of the solution,
The GetUp team.
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Jul, 2008 07:49 pm
Did anyone see Father Des on Denton last night?

He's a catholic priest who was assigned to the town of Port Hedland.

One or two of his anecdotes about immigration dept staff (and guards) would really get the inquiry off two a fine start.

eg The Sri Lankan guy who had his legs smashed by sledge hammers because didn't agree with the Tamil Tigers - sent back by the prev govt and no reason given 'We don't answer to you, Father.'
0 Replies
 
dadpad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Jul, 2008 12:59 am
hingehead wrote:
Did anyone see Father Des on Denton last night?


Father Des the Alcoholic?

I watched a little of it.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 Jul, 2008 08:46 pm
hingehead wrote:
Am I alone in thinking Penny Wong might be Australia's first female prime minister? She's so dang reasonable and measured without waffling.

How proud would I be of a a lesbian prime minister of asian extraction!


Yeah, I think that would be pretty terrific, too, hinge! (The lesbian/Asian bit)Very Happy

But I think she needs to work on her "appeal to the masses" a wee bit in the meantime, so that this big day actually eventuates. And sound a little less like she's addressing a very serious meeting whenever she speaks in public. :wink:
So you don't think Julia will become PM, down the track, then?
0 Replies
 
 

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