Increasing child support without lawyers help.

Just watching.

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Montana,
I'm going to start making phone calls next week. Hopefully I'll follow through because I'll be out of town for 10 days through labor day

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What is the basis for the increase? What are your state's laws regarding the criteria for an increase, or for any of the other changes to your parenting plan? Are there child support guidelines to follow, and do they support your requested increase? Will the father be contesting your motions? Have you called the family law court to inquire? Does the family law court provide motion packets that help pro se litigants? When does the court hear these types of motions? Is there a motion filing fee?

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So, I just want to know where to start. My daughter will be driving in 5 months, could use a car and gas money, insurance, and the other overall needs that a teenager has. My son will be 14 too, they are getting more expensive to raise than 2 years ago.

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Quite honestly though, I think he'll agree to support this without having it in writing, however, I want to know what my options are.

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No. Please. Get. It. In. Writing.

I already answered on the venting topic but I'll follow up here.

There is nothing wrong -- absolutely nothing -- with getting everything in writing. Your increased needs. Any agreement from him. Receipts. Psychologists' evaluations if necessary. Etc. etc. In writing.

While courts will accept oral testimony it will be considerably easier to prove things if they are in writing. It will also be far easier for you if things are in writing in case there is any reneging on the agreement.

It's easy to get into a situation, where everything is friendly and you bend way over backwards but the reality is that you can be taken advantage of. If your ex remarries and if he has more kids he will be pulled in that financial direction. That's why you need to clearly stake your financial claim here.

It will help, as Tico says, to know your state as the laws vary. It does not mean that there cannot be an out of court agreement between the two of you but I would get it signed and notarized before relying on anything.

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Your state's Attorney General may have a child support division that's in charge of collecting child support on your behalf. If your children's father is willing you and he can establish an agreement without having to take it to court by which he would be ordered to pay child support according to a percentage of his net income.

If he isn't willing then you would probably have to sue him for child support, get a lawyer and take him to court.

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martybarker wrote:

So, I just want to know where to start. My daughter will be driving in 5 months, could use a car and gas money, insurance, and the other overall needs that a teenager has. My son will be 14 too, they are getting more expensive to raise than 2 years ago.

Keep in mind that, while you can go to court without a lawyer, getting a car just because a child turns 16 isn't a "need" (unless there is some extenuating circumstance that you haven't mentioned.) Clothing, shelter, food, education, etc... are needs. A car is a "want".

From what I've seen, getting an increase to cover car and insurance costs is a crapshoot.

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Fishin,
I hear what you're saying. My daughter is going to need to get a job and need transportation to such job if she is going to support her entertainment needs and save for her future.
I work 4 days a week but cover on-call hours too. A second car at the house would be extremely helpful next year.

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martybarker wrote:

Fishin,
I hear what you're saying. My daughter is going to need to get a job and need transportation to such job if she is going to support her entertainment needs and save for her future.
I work 4 days a week but cover on-call hours too. A second car at the house would be extremely helpful next year.

I understand that part of the situation. (Been there, done that! :p )

You sholuld be aware however, that in many states the courts have no authority to order an increase in child support to cover those sorts of expenses. Food, clothing, shelter, child care, medical care and basic education are, for example, "needs" that are covered by child support.

Summer camp, cars, entertainment, and life insurance policies are things that the courts either can't or often won't get in the middle of. They are "wants" and fall outside of the scope of child support. College tends to fall in between teh two end sof that. Most states can order support payments to help cover the cost but they aren't required to.

The overall point being that what you are asking for is a "deviation from the Uniform Child Support Guidelines". It is possible to do but it adds complications - some of which, IMO, you should talk to a lawyer about before trying to file the paperwork yourself. The process is different.

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First, get ready to document all of the expenses for the children.

(I should mention that I was one of the first, if not the first, male to win child support payments in Oklahoma some thirty year ago. )

Have receipts, copies of checks and credit card statements showing exactly how much it costs to support the children. You should have at least a year's totals in hand, if not two. (You should have been keeping this sort of thing over the past years in order to claim the deduction on your Federal Taxes)

Fishin is right, unless you can show that is a necessary expense to have a car, you're not going to get any court to award you the increase. Having said that I'm sure you can find a way to describe it as a necessary item (The schedule at the high school conflicts with your work schedule and the daughter must be home in time to oversee the care of her younger brother.)

In my case, both the court and I were amazed at how much I was spending on school clothes and supplies, camp fees and general crap needed to be a kid.

Joe(it never stops)Nation

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Agreeing with others. I also see the car as a want as well, so I believe the courts do too.

As Joe said, save all your recipts and dig up whatever you can find pertainting to needed expenses for the kids.

If you divorce agreement states that this can be reviewed every 2 years, then to me this means that the support can be adjusted for any pay increases he may have had since the agreement and any funds needed should your childrens expenses increase.

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This is all driven by your state's laws. Very often the court is restricted to increasing only when there has been a material change of circumstances that merit an increase following the child support guidelines. For instance, if the children have gotten older and moved into a new column in the guidelines, or if the father's income has grown such that there is a 10% increase in support, these are considered a "material change" in some states. You aren't necessarily seeking a deviation from the child support guidelines ... you may simply be looking for a child support payment consistent with those guidelines. A family law attorney could look at your case and advise you in those particulars.

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I'm in Washington state. Here we have a grid thing where you take the mothers income and the fathers income and join at that point. This is what support the kids get. However, the grid only goes to a certain point, because according the the WA state courts there is only so much money needed to raise a child. So in my case, even though my ex's income exceeded the chart the kids only get the highest allowable amount. Therefore, his income minus child support is still higher than mine with his support.

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You are describing the standard calculation, based solely upon party net income: http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=26.19.020

But are there sufficient reasons for the Court to deviate from that standard calculation? http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=26.19.075

RCW 26.19.065: "When combined monthly net income exceeds seven thousand dollars, the court may set support at an advisory amount of support set for combined monthly net incomes between five thousand and seven thousand dollars or the court may exceed the advisory amount of support set for combined monthly net incomes of seven thousand dollars upon written findings of fact." http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=26.19.065

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When I start hearing legal jargon my head swirls. I read the attachment. I'm wondering if my kids were deserving of more support based on our combined incomes or if my lawyer gave me the right information. He basically said"You can only buy a child so many horses" Meaning, it only takes a certain amount of money to raise a child. But what about the case of someone making a lot of money. I don't understand this.

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martybarker wrote:

When I start hearing legal jargon my head swirls. I read the attachment. I'm wondering if my kids were deserving of more support based on our combined incomes or if my lawyer gave me the right information. He basically said"You can only buy a child so many horses" Meaning, it only takes a certain amount of money to raise a child. But what about the case of someone making a lot of money. I don't understand this.

The laws cover that:

"(3) Income above five thousand and seven thousand dollars. The economic table is presumptive for combined monthly net incomes up to and including five thousand dollars. When combined monthly net income exceeds five thousand dollars, support shall not be set at an amount lower than the presumptive amount of support set for combined monthly net incomes of five thousand dollars unless the court finds a reason to deviate below that amount. The economic table is advisory but not presumptive for combined monthly net incomes that exceed five thousand dollars. When combined monthly net income exceeds seven thousand dollars, the court may set support at an advisory amount of support set for combined monthly net incomes between five thousand and seven thousand dollars or the court may exceed the advisory amount of support set for combined monthly net incomes of seven thousand dollars upon written findings of fact."

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=26.19.020

What your lawyer worked with was the 1st option - they picked a number from the standard chart for incomes between $5,000 and $7,000.

What you now appear to be thinking is that you should be working under the 2nd option.

In other words, if you think the amount paid should exceed the maximum listed in the table (based on total income exceeding the $7,000/month limit in the table) you have to document the reasons - i.e. you need to keep your reciepts and track every expense and show them to the court.

In most states there is an upper limit that the Courts will work with. In NC, for example, if the combined income exceeds $200,000/year then the court tells the parents to work it out and then the court reviews and approves the final plan. They don't even attempt to apply the standard charts.

But bascially what it all boils down to is that the State of WA has determined that the maximum cost to raise 2 children in your state is $1,892/month. That amount is split between both parents based on the proportion of their net incomes. If you think child support should exceed that amount then it is up to you to prove it with valid needs (and documentation of those needs!). Once you provide that documenattion to the courts, the judge decides if the numbers are legitimate and reasonable.

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fishin wrote:

martybarker wrote:
So, I just want to know where to start. My daughter will be driving in 5 months, could use a car and gas money, insurance, and the other overall needs that a teenager has. My son will be 14 too, they are getting more expensive to raise than 2 years ago.

Keep in mind that, while you can go to court without a lawyer, getting a car just because a child turns 16 isn't a "need" (unless there is some extenuating circumstance that you haven't mentioned.) Clothing, shelter, food, education, etc... are needs. A car is a "want".

From what I've seen, getting an increase to cover car and insurance costs is a crapshoot.

i was gonna say something about that lol, i was like when the **** did a father have to pay for a car again? ****, i wish my mom would have taken out child support if it meant id get car money.

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My kids aren't spoiled by all means. A car is not a need but a convenience for both myself and the kids. What I'm wondering is if my kids are getting what is fair in regards to the fact that my ex's salary exceeds $200,000/year with perks.

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Increasing child support without lawyers help.

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