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I can't date you because you're not

 
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2007 06:03 pm
jespah wrote:
Foofie wrote:
...And, if we use the term "Jewish," which means like a Jew, but not quite a Jew (like windyish, sort of windy, but not quite windy), ....


Uh, no. Now we're just changing definitions. If you must make a word, say (Gawd) Jew-like. But not Jewish. That's a word with a very specific meaning and what you stated above ain't it. Thanks.


The word "Jew" has historically had too often just a pejorative meaning. Can I coin the term Hebraish?
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Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2007 06:08 pm
Miller wrote:
Quote:


According to the National Jewish Population Survey, only 17 percent of marriages involving Jews in the United States prior to 1970 were intermarriages. From 1996-2001, 47 percent of marriages involving Jews in the United States were intermarriages. Overall, the U.S. rate of intermarriage for all married Jewish couples is 31 percent.


Wikipedia.com


The 50% rate for young Jews marrying this year is anecdotal. But, I would think I'm not off by a percentage point or two, based on the look of concern Jewish mothers have every time a son or daughter says they met someone new.
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jespah
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2007 06:22 pm
I am a Jew. Of course the word doesn't offend me and I doubt it offends the other Jews on this forum. Yes, I've had the word spat at me. But why should I care what fools say about me? Why should I let it color the perception? Jewish is my religion. I am a Jewish person. I am a Jew. Hell, I'm what used to be called a Jewess way back when, and that's a really wacky word when you really think about it.

I do find dancing around the word and finding that folks in my faith can often be treated like exotic specimens to be more than a little offputting and weird. I'm not putting words in your mouth but that is how I feel about things. I suspect I'm not the only one feeling that way, either. Being treated kindly should not mean being treated as if I'm going to break in half at the smallest breath. I won't.

As for the 50% figure, well, got facts to cite? Or is that just a 50% intermarriage figure for a mythical Hebraish group of people? Smile

Gotta go. Have a nice evening.
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Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2007 06:43 pm
jespah wrote:
I do find dancing around the word and finding that folks in my faith can often be treated like exotic specimens to be more than a little offputting and weird.


I believe your feeling like Jews can be treated like exotic specimens more often is the case when the "treater" is a WASP. Other ethnics usually don't do that; especially Italians, I believe. Italians and Jews have been crossing paths for over two thousand years. We understand each other, I believe.

I believe many WASP men have a certain attraction to Jewish females, in that many WASP's don't like to make heads turn when entering a restaurant, so an exotic woman of another race may be a bit much (not for white ethnics, including Jews, I believe). However, for a WASP to date a Jewish woman allows the WASP to have his cake and eat it too - an exotic woman (by WASP standards) that doesn't make people stare at the couple.
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JPB
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2007 08:19 pm
Foofie wrote:
I believe many WASP men have a certain attraction to Jewish females, in that many WASP's don't like to make heads turn when entering a restaurant, so an exotic woman of another race may be a bit much (not for white ethnics, including Jews, I believe). However, for a WASP to date a Jewish woman allows the WASP to have his cake and eat it too - an exotic woman (by WASP standards) that doesn't make people stare at the couple.


This is actually quite laughable, Foofie. It's no great stretch to assume that 'many' of any group would have a certain attraction to any other group. Basically, you've just said that you believe at least some WASP's have an attraction to Jewish females. You've also said that at least some WASPs don't like to draw attention to themselves. Replace WASP and/or Jewish with any other category of your choosing and you would still have an accurate statement. What's your point?
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Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2007 09:07 pm
I guess to some I have no point.
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 13 Aug, 2007 09:28 pm
I gotta say it sounds like you recently were enamored of a jewish man and are revelling at your insights. Some of this is sort of good news, that you think jewish men are/can be cool, especially if they are cool, but much sounds eye-rolling material..
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real life
 
  1  
Reply Fri 17 Aug, 2007 01:53 pm
Re: I can't date you because you're not
joefromchicago wrote:
Tolerance is more important than any particular spiritual or religious belief. I hate intolerant people.

Laughing yer killin' me

joefromchicago wrote:
And the Belgians.



But not the French? How do you tolerate the French?
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real life
 
  1  
Reply Fri 17 Aug, 2007 02:13 pm
It would be interesting to see the question reversed.

I wonder how many of the atheists on A2K would ever consider dating/marrying a Christian?
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anton bonnier
 
  1  
Reply Sat 18 Aug, 2007 08:53 pm
I'll go one better than that RL...
I wonder how many little children born into a religious family think their God is a joke after a childhood spent being brainwashed into believing whatever version the parents believed.

Anton the humanist.
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Miller
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2007 02:51 am
real life wrote:
It would be interesting to see the question reversed.

I wonder how many of the atheists on A2K would ever consider dating/marrying a Christian?


Probably 100%, why the question?
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Miller
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2007 02:53 am
anton bonnier wrote:
I'll go one better than that RL...
I wonder how many little children born into a religious family think their God is a joke after a childhood spent being brainwashed into believing whatever version the parents believed.

Anton the humanist.


Significance to interfaith marriage? Cool
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2007 03:39 am
real life wrote:
It would be interesting to see the question reversed.

That's not a reversal of the question. "I can't date you because you're not my irreligion" is the same bigotry as "I can't date you because you're not my religion". That said, I'm an atheist; I wouldn't have a problem dating a religious woman, and neither would any of the atheists I personally know.
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nimh
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2007 06:08 am
Foofie wrote:
The 50% rate for young Jews marrying this year is anecdotal. But, I would think I'm not off by a percentage point or two, based on the look of concern Jewish mothers have every time a son or daughter says they met someone new.

Umm, no. A number (such as yours) apparently based on one individual's impressions of how Jewish mothers react is anecdotal evidence. A number based on the statistical data about the annual total of marriages in the United States is not.
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Miller
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2007 07:29 am
Quote:
the look of concern Jewish mothers have every time a son or daughter says they met someone new.


How can you differentiate between a "look of concern" and a "look of interest"?
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Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 19 Aug, 2007 08:59 pm
Miller wrote:
Quote:
the look of concern Jewish mothers have every time a son or daughter says they met someone new.


How can you differentiate between a "look of concern" and a "look of interest"?


Strangely, I don't seem to be receiving email alerts of new responses on this thread?? I saw this continuing thread by pure chance.

Secondly, the thought I made, that the above quote is taken from, I actually made no sense. Possibly it sounded nice. But there is no logical connection I made between any 50% rate (approximately?) of inter-marriage and a Jewish mother's feelings.

But, to answer just the one quoted sentence above, I was referring to the East Coast, probably New York Metro area, ethnic Jewish mother that would usually (historically) want her child to marry within the faith.

Naturally, in this big country there are plenty of Jews, who say they are Jewish, but care less who is dating, or marrying her child. It really is an individual thing. But for purposes of sociological type statements, I was thinking the reaction would usually be "concern" (from a NY area ethnic Jewish mother).

Digressing slightly, I believe (again in the NY area) a child can come from an inter-faith marriage and both parents would then more likely have less feelings as to who that child marries.

However, when a child comes from two Jewish parents (all four grandparents were Jewish), then I believe the child will be aware that his/her parents would usually like to see that child marry another Jew. Not for the sake of the religion, necessarily, I believe. Nor, based on any negative feelings towards any other religion, necessarily, I believe, but, I believe, based on that whole Jewish survival thing. I truly believe, the Holocaust had a collective effect on many Jews, so Jewish survival reverberates in many Jewish heads, like a night watchman.

I believe marrying a non-Jew, for a Jew in Israel, is not allowed by law. They can marry in another country and live in Israel, but they can't have a Jewish ceremony in Israel, I believe. That, I believe, reflects the concern with Jewish survival.

I personally believe, after WWII and the Holocaust, other religions should have attempted to dissuade their congregants from marrying Jews. Sort of like putting a ban on fishing in a lake where the fish have diminished. At least until the fish have gone back to their original numbers.

I say this based on comments I've heard from Jews occasionally that what Hitler couldn't do with bullets and gas, will be done through inter-marriage (end the existence of Jews as a people living in many countries).

I don't think marrying a Jew reflects a plot to eliminate Jews. I just think a non-Jew can be attracted to someone who is Jewish, and Jewish survival would not be on his/her mind. No malicious intent on the part of the non-Jew, he/she would be just trying to find someone nice to marry.

I think the whole question of Jewish assimilation is fascinating, since Jews always had the option to assimilate, and for a few thousand years most chose not to. Actually, over the centuries, cumulatively many did. Let's not talk about that, since some people don't want to think they can have a Jewish ancestor somewhere in his/her family tree.
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