The "religion" of non-religion! A discussion!

All the way through this discussions and others currently going on in A2k, I keep picturing the blind men and the elephant -- a fable which tells the true story about truth, god, and anything else we are so dang sure about.

I've always liked that fable and felt sorry for that elephant being prodded and poked.

Our lives are so short. We can't experience much and we aren't that good at passing on real knowledge. It's a little frightening to consider how much like children we of the human race are.

Pifka, What you say is so true; we are only babe in the woods. Even people with a good education usually have skills in very few subjects even when they've earned several PhDs'. Most of the people in this world can't even read or write their own name. We have not learned about history that war is hell, and we continue to build powerful "smart" bombs. What a oxymoron! If they don't agree with your type of government, bomb them to smithereens. Yeah, we're really smart animals, and the most powerful man in the world today happens to be one of the most dangerous humans in history. c.i.

Thanks, CI, I imagine you have a particularly good perspective on this from your travels.

"What a piece of work is man! How noble in reason! how infinite in faculties! in form and moving, how express and admirable! in action how like an angel! in apprehension, how like a god! the beauty of the world! the paragon of animals! And yet, to me, what is this quintessence of dust?" W.S.

I don't know that anyone is inherently more or less moral based on a system of beliefs. After all, Hitler was a Christian and look what he did.

However, all things being equal, I'd say that non-theists have a better basis for a system of morality than theists do. Theism is based, at least in general, on "you'd better be good or you'll get punished". A lot of non-theists, myself included, base their morality on "be good to others because you want them to be good to you in return". In other words, do good because it's the right thing to do, not because some father-figure in the sky is going to get you if you don't.

You made an excellent point, Cephus, and I couldn't agree with you more. As I keep protesting in other threads, why do we equate Christianity or any other religion with morality? And when it comes to that, when I do any reading about Jesus, why do I become so certain that "christians" would not be among his favorite people?

Cephus, Tartarin

Right on!

Ya know, whenever I see the phrase "What would Jesus do?", I get this mental picture of somebody in stunned disbelief, sadly shaking his head and mouthing over and over "How could it all have gone so wrong?"

Here's my take on the whole subject of religion; most did not choose their religion, their ancestors did. To claim that any religion is superior to anything else is tantamount to saying they don't belong to the human race. Humans have a 'nature' as does all animals. It doesn't group good and bad based on religious belief; we all belong to the mix of good and bad. No man-made group is superior in any way. Trying to prove superiority based on religious belief as maliagar attempts to do is a waste of time; he can't show all the good AND bad of all the members of his religion. That's impossible. Naming individuals of good will proves nothing. There are many in this world that never get recognized for their life-long good deeds. Doesn't mean they don't exist. Doesn't matter if a individual is christian, muslim, buddhist, jew, agnostic, or atheist. What counts is the individual's ethics, morals, and respect for all fellow humans, and other living things. Nothing else matters. c.i.

Timber, you and I picture the poor man in the same way.

Ci
You got that right. I owe you a beer.

edgar, I think we're even.

Actually, if we look at the Bible, we find that God isn't such a nice guy to begin with. After all, he's depicted as being a murderous, cheap, sadistic bastard in much of the Old Testament. He gave Adam and Eve free will, then punished them for exercising it. He genocided virtually the entire planet. He commanded that the Hebrews, when attacking the inhabitants of Palestine, kill them all to the last man, woman, child and animal. God had bears maul children for laughing at the bald head of his prophet.

So exactly where is all this much-claimed morality of God that we keep hearing about?

Right. A true God would not have created such a mess at all.

You are being too kind, Cephus.

The god of the Bible is a vengeful, vindictive, quick-to-anger, ego driven, tyrannical, murderous, jealous, petty barbarian who is less god-like than Zeus or Wodin.

But I like that "cheap." Hadn't thought of that. What brought that one in? If its good, I'll use it in the future.

All gods in history were complete bastards....that's the point. Cephus, I hope the "cheap" reference wasn't anti-semetic.... :wink:

Point is, if you choose to believe in religion, you accept that humans were created in god's image, and god is a total ****. Always was, always will be. The stories were meant to get people to wake the f--k up and say to themselves: "Oh, we believe in this god, and he is such a nutbar...and we are made in his image...we are nutbars too....yet god also wants us to prosper and get along....hmmm....perhaps we should learn to not make the same mistakes god did." That's my

Also, I agree with c.i. as always on this subject.

Bookmark...

Ah.... cav is here.