German Jews to split over Russian immigrants?

Foofie wrote:

And there are threads on A2K that are so involved in Jews, to the exclusion of all the other people in the world? What makes Jews so interesting, or is it that obsessing about Jews just seems to be a perennial favorite pastime of many a Gentile?

Many times it's not done in a philo-Semitic way, but either in the classic anti-Semitic way, or the subtler Judeo-phobic way (what are they up to?).

Frankly many of these threads are started and maintained by you and other advocates of Israel or related issues. Moreover contemporary American politics and national security are directly affected to issues arising from Zionisn far out of proportion to the number of Jews, either here or in the world. I think you are, in this instance, merely projecting your own obsessions on others.

Foofie wrote:

Like I alluded to in another post, if one is American, British, or Danish, I enjoy listening to their comments about Jews, since all three countries have a sterling (modern) history of allowing Jews to live with freedom and opportunity. But if someone wants me to listen to someone from Germany, or France (I hear the crowd, "hang Dreyfus"), or Spain, or Russia, or Poland, or any number of Balkan states, or Middle Eastern States, I can only respond, "Do you think I'm stupid or naive?"

Now, let's all say the Pledge of Allegiance, and God Bless America!

I think all that residual hatred is both wrongheaded and very tiresome. Why don't you include the Italians (whose forebearers destroyed Israel), or the Egyptians, or the Iraqis (Babylonians)? With respect to historical grievances, what ever became of the original inhabitants of Jerico? The unfortunate Philistines and Cananites (one could argue they are still there, and still suffering for it.)?

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That's not foofie's topic, George. He's more on a personal, censoring crusade against me (at least, he's doing it on my threads) and others:

Foofie wrote:

There's plenty of other news that Germans can bring to the forum threads about Germany's economy, international politics, employment/unemployment, etc., etc. But, "Jews"??? Please, that word should be stricken from their vernacular!!

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georgeob1 wrote:

Foofie wrote:
Like I alluded to in another post, if one is American, British, or Danish, I enjoy listening to their comments about Jews, since all three countries have a sterling (modern) history of allowing Jews to live with freedom and opportunity. But if someone wants me to listen to someone from Germany, or France (I hear the crowd, "hang Dreyfus"), or Spain, or Russia, or Poland, or any number of Balkan states, or Middle Eastern States, I can only respond, "Do you think I'm stupid or naive?"

Now, let's all say the Pledge of Allegiance, and God Bless America!

I think all that residual hatred is both wrongheaded and very tiresome. Why don't you include the Italians (whose forebearers destroyed Israel), or the Egyptians, or the Iraqis (Babylonians)? With respect to historical grievances, what ever became of the original inhabitants of Jerico? The unfortunate Philistines and Cananites (one could argue they are still there, and still suffering for it.)?

No hatred. Just giving you the facts. Also, time heals all, so Italians, Egyptians, Babylonians are not part of the modern Jewish world view, in my opinion. And, for your information, only 400 years after the Romans destroyed the Second Temple, one-fourth of Rome was supposed to be a big Jewish neighborhood at the time that Constatine converted to Christianity. Four-hundrend years, not 60+!

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Well the Spanish expulsion of the Jews occurred more than 400 years ago so perhaps they should come off your list. Moreover most of them went to the Ottoman Empire where they were welcomed and prospered. Perhaps that, too should count for something.

You are offering only some of the "facts" - none I requested and none I didn't already have.

Just what is the logic of your temporal limitations of group memory and presumed accountability? 60+ years is presumably longer than you have lived, and the events for which you so jealously harbor lingering resentment very likely didn't affect you directly. There have been innumerable events involving horrible cruelty and extermination in human history, and they have involved the forebearers of nearly all the nations identifiable in the world today - from Joshua's extermination of the inhabitants of the Promised land to the enslavements of Jews by Egypt and others; the Greek, Persian and Macedonian wars; Rome, the Goths, Huns & Vandals, etc; the Moslem explosion; the slaughter in Europe and (particularly in the Moslem world) due to the Mongul incursions; the suppression of the Gnostic/Albagensian heresy in France -- and many others - a list too long to enumerate. Shall the hatreds from all of these be preserved and remembered? What good would come of it?

Frankly, Germany has far exceeded historical norms in confronting its misdeeds and internalizing the painful lessons attendant to them. It seems to me that it is time for those who themselves didn't experience the evils to which you refer, to let go and forgive those who themselves didn't perpetrate them.

Finally, you should consider that no one is immune to evil. One can make a very good case for the proposition that the IDF, in its treatment of Palestinians in the occupied territories, is similar in some respects to the very things for which you refuse to forgive Germans and others.

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George, o George! Who do you think you are talking to?

Someone reasonable and with sufficient historical and hard learned knowledge?

No, sir! You are talking to infused knowledge foofie.

In other terms, talking in the wind...

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Well, Francis, just as I criticize Europeans, I hold out both affection for them and hope for their restored wisdom -- and indeed hope for their tolerance of my own excesses.

Foofie is a smart and generally well-informed guy, and I have read some interesting posts of his. I didn't fully appreciate his single-minded obsession on this kind of stuff, but I do recognize that it is understandable, if not at all defensible. I have now said my piece to him.

"...talking in the wind." I've done that before, as you know. :wink:

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George,

I developed kind of tolerance towards your, (very scarce), excesses.

For the very same reason, I reproach foofie.

Your comments are well thought, though not always right.

They are based on a pretty good knowledge of what you are talking about.

I really abhorr people who talk their guts out, without an ounce of common sense or knowledge.

I even tend to believe that you are a friend.

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Francis wrote:

Your comments are well thought, though not always right.

They are based on a pretty good knowledge of what you are talking about.

Well, thanks, I think! (goddamn French!)

Francis wrote:

I even tend to believe that you are a friend.

Indeed you are a friend. Smile

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George, you should meet Walter, he's much more mellow than I am. :wink:

As for Foofie: one cannot change his opinion of how he looks upon the
world and the Germans. All what I wanted him to understand is that
he's neither a spokesperson for the Jews nor giving any facts.

It would be a sad day in history, if after 60+ years, people still would display such hatred as we see from Foofie. Luckily, he's an isolated case.

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CalamityJane wrote:

George, you should meet Walter, he's much more mellow than I am. :wink:

Most people are, Calamity dear. Cool

CalamityJane wrote:

As for Foofie: one cannot change his opinion of how he looks upon the world and the Germans. All what I wanted him to understand is that he's neither a spokesperson for the Jews nor giving any facts. ... Luckily, he's an isolated case.

In my experience such attitudes do more to poision the minds of those who cling to them than to harm those against whom they ostensibly are directed.

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German Jews to split over Russian immigrants?

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