Homosexuality v. Christianity -- A FEW QUESTIONS:

I do read, but my reading is not 'biased' by any religious doctrin. c.i.

What are you smoking? Christianity -- and the Church -- probably set science back in western civilization by 1000 years. The damage the Church has done to science -- and the damage it continues to do -- is appalling.

"Between 1650 and 1750, four Catholic churches were the best solar observatories in the world. Built to fix an unquestionable date for Easter...."

I have provided enough evidence to, at least, raise a reasonable doubt about good ol' Frankie's story (however assertive he may be in telling it). I've brought to the court the independent testimony of a few reputable witnesses, and good ol' Frankie has only brought the weight of his own self-righteous indignation.

the only "Reasonable Doubt" clearly evident centers on the accredidation, probity and provenance of your witnesses...

...many of whom have been impeached in this very discussion by the introduction of evidence disclosing them to be proponents of minority and contrarian viewpoints wihin the scientific and/or academic communities at large.

As far as I can see, not one of your assertions has been validated, and not one of your rebuttals has had any negative impact on or implication for the challenges presented you.

And we already agreed that, in these issues, we need to rely on the evidence provided by historians. So the strength of the evidence depends on the accredidation, probity and provenance of my witnesses, plus the number of witnesses I'm able to bring. And I've brought a few reputable witnesses already. The other side has brought none.

[I'm getting a bit tired of having to explain the evident, or to explain again what has been already settled]

timberlandko wrote:

...many of whom have been impeached in this very discussion by the introduction of evidence disclosing them to be proponents of minority and contrarian viewpoints wihin the scientific and/or academic communities at large.

False. None of them have been impeached at all. No evidence against them has been brought to the forum. Could you mention one academic of comparable credentials that directly contradicts my witnesses points of view, mentioned by Frank, or you, or anybody? (unless you considere "evidence" calling them names). I've only heard the arbitrary declaration (that hasn't been corroborated using any reputable name) that today's historians of science maintain the same view of the middle ages as the historians of the Rennaisance and the Enlightenment.

timberlandko wrote:

As far as I can see, not one of your assertions has been validated, and not one of your rebuttals has had any negative impact on or implication for the challenges presented you.

Well obviously you cannot see very well. Neither can you read very well. It is called "prejudice", and it blinds. You have a severe condition of bias. Call your doctor.

So much for the "justice" you're capable of providing...

Vatican Slams Moves to Legalize Same-Sex Marriage
Thu July 31, 2003 07:36 AM ET
By Estelle Shirbon
VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - The Vatican condemned same-sex unions as deviant and a threat to society on Thursday in a fresh attempt to halt the growing momentum toward legalizing gay marriage in North America and Europe.

The Holy See urged Catholic lawmakers to vote against bills that would recognize gay marriage in a strongly worded document approved by Pope John Paul.

"Marriage exists solely between a man and a woman...Marriage is holy, while homosexual acts go against the natural moral law," said the 12-page document by the Vatican's Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.

"Legal recognition of homosexual unions or placing them on the same level as marriage would mean not only the approval of deviant behavior...but would also obscure basic values which belong to the common inheritance of humanity."

Gay rights groups were swift to hit back.

"This is just the latest move in their homophobic crusade," said Franco Grillini, an Italian lawmaker and honorary chairman of Arcigay, the country's largest gay rights group.

Abroad, the reaction was equally virulent.

"The new statement by the Vatican on same-sex partnerships is a sad document of close-minded fanaticism," said Volker Beck, parliamentary manager of Germany's Greens, junior coalition partner in the center-left government.

It was the second time this year the Vatican instructed Catholic lawmakers to vote against bills legalizing gay marriage, indicating the Holy See's great anxiety.

"Catholic politicians should protest against this paternalism and these hostile homosexual policies of the Vatican," Germany's LSVD association of gays and lesbians said.

"PROFOUNDLY DISORDERED MINDS"

Church authorities have also repeatedly condemned homosexuality in more general terms this year.

In March, the Vatican released a new glossary of sexual terms which said homosexuals were not normal and countries which allowed gay marriages were inhabited by people with "profoundly disordered minds."

Thursday's document also denounced gay couples adopting children: "Allowing children to be adopted by persons living in such unions would actually mean doing violence to these children."

Debate over legalizing gay marriage has intensified in North America since Canada took steps to do so. Hundreds of same-sex couples have tied the knot in Ontario and British Columbia since the two Canadian provinces gave them the green light.

And just last month, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down state sodomy laws that made it a crime for gays to have consensual sex in their own bedrooms.

Gay marriage is forbidden in the United States, although one state, Vermont, allows same-sex civil unions, and Massachusetts' top court is set to rule on the issue soon. President Bush on Wednesday rejected same-sex marriage.

In Europe, the Netherlands has recognized registered gay partnerships since 1998 and Belgium followed suit in January this year. The Netherlands also passed laws in December 2000 allowing same-sex couples to marry and adopt children.