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Sat 12 Aug, 2006 10:23 am
I wonder if anyone out there asks himself or herself this question only to find they don't like the answer. Are we supporting Israel in killing those around them? If they kill innocent lives with our weapons are we also held responsible by the world? I think it is like the drug dealer who supplied the drugs to the man who killed someone while high. Why would we not be responsible?
READ
First of all, I am hispanic, born in the Dominican Republic. Why do I disclose this data? Simply to say that as a nonJewish man, I have enough sense to know that Iran started this war even after Israel's kind action of granting Gaza to killers. In 1948, Israel became a nation and if you are smart, you will realize that the whole trouble with Israel began in 1948. The whole world would like to see the Jews destroyed not knowing that the Jews are God's chosen people. Just read the Bible and you will see what I mean.
Re: what is America becoming?
Mc Cobb wrote:I wonder if anyone out there asks himself or herself this question only to find they don't like the answer. Are we supporting Israel in killing those around them? If they kill innocent lives with our weapons are we also held responsible by the world? I think it is like the drug dealer who supplied the drugs to the man who killed someone while high. Why would we not be responsible?
I think you might have overlooked the part of the equation where Palestinians firebomb an Israeli schoobus or some other civilian target frequently, something only an absolute monster would do. The Israelis, by contrast, do not attack non-combatants deliberately.
The title of this thread is terribly misleading. You don't want to talk about "what America is becoming" but, rather, about whether America should be backing Israel in the latter's attempts to stay viable and remain a member of the world community. Your premise is that Israel is wrong in defending itself and that the USA has no business supporting it. Rather a disingenuous way of starting a debate.
Re: READ
shark wrote: the whole trouble with Israel began in 1948.
"The problem predates 1948 by a good bit. The issue central to the dispute is the existence of a Jewish Homeland in the Middle East, and has been been around, essentially in its current form, since the 1880s.
I'm surprised that you've responded at all, Big Bird, given that the member Shark has written this pathetically delusional drivel: The whole world would like to see the Jews destroyed not knowing that the Jews are God's chosen people. Just read the Bible and you will see what I mean.
I was bored. I'm sure the author of the drivel has no concept of what the collapse of the Ottoman Empire wrought upon the times in which we live today.
Re: what is America becoming?
Mc Cobb wrote:I think it is like the drug dealer who supplied the drugs to the man who killed someone while high. Why would we not be responsible?
Yep, last time I smoked pot I had this gnawing urge to run out and kill someone. Good thing I didn't or Israel may have collapsed right then and there.
Or something like that.
I'm always interested when people bring in the Bible to debates. The Bible is a debate onto its self. I prefer to stay inside a more open history lesson, but it is very interesting to hear that God gave the land to His Chosen people. Seems to make their occupation less problematic. I know America was taken from Indians that where lied to and eventually starved into submission. Many people fight wars with great honor because of ideas, only to find out they didn't always know the true story. This post was meant to challenge each of us (including myself) as to what my country's actions do to innocent lives around the world. America the idea is the best in the world, having said that we must question true motifs of our countries actions.
Mc Cobb wrote:I'm always interested when people bring in the Bible to debates. The Bible is a debate onto its self. I prefer to stay inside a more open history lesson, but it is very interesting to hear that God gave the land to His Chosen people. Seems to make their occupation less problematic. I know America was taken from Indians that where lied to and eventually starved into submission. Many people fight wars with great honor because of ideas, only to find out they didn't always know the true story. This post was meant to challenge each of us (including myself) as to what my country's actions do to innocent lives around the world. America the idea is the best in the world, having said that we must question true motifs of our countries actions.
What do you mean by our country's motifs??? Why did you not respond to my post about the almost continuous sequence of atrocities committed by the Palestinian butchers for decades?
Brandon, I believe McCobb is talking about 'motives', not 'motifs.' But that's just my opinion. He's not easy to understand.
Merry Andrew wrote:Brandon, I believe McCobb is talking about 'motives', not 'motifs.' But that's just my opinion. He's not easy to understand.
I realized that within the first half second of seeing his malapropism.
I dunno -"motif", as in a dominant or recurrent theme or idea, an overal tone, setting, or direction, works just fine in that statement, IMO. In that sense, "motives" would procede from, be dependent upon, be causally subordinate and perforce consequent to, in short, be the result of, "motifs".
timberlandko wrote:I dunno -"motif", as in a dominant or recurrent theme or idea, an overal tone, setting, or direction, works just fine in that statement, IMO. In that sense, "motives" would procede from, be dependent upon, be causally subordinate and perforce consequent to, in short, be the result of, "motifs".
You're such a good apologist for bad English, Tmber.
Okay, okay, let us not slip into a political debate about how the Palestinian terrorists are wrong and the Israelis are acting disproportionately (I'm a British citizen that lived with the threat of IRA bombings by the way).
What we want to ask is what is the US becoming?
As far as I can tell, it's becoming hugely dependent on the Middle East, which is hampering efforts to get on with its supposed agenda of making the world a better place.
Of course, it's also hugely dependent on China, which doesn't really help matters much either.
Merry Andrew wrote: Your premise is that Israel is wrong in defending itself and that the USA has no business supporting it.
I am asking you, are you comfortable with paying for Isael's war? Why not give another country as much military power. Who would you give it too? How much would you give? Why? If they started to target innocent lives would you stop giving them free weapons, or would you still give them and turn your back at the people who will die because you gave weapons to someone who knowingly targeted( or had a history of) killing sivilians. (
Keep in mind we cannot change what people do with other peoples weapons and this is why I'm asking about Israel and the weapons we gaive them) I seems like we can directly save innoccent lives by our own actions and this places their blood on our hands too.
Mc Cobb wrote:Merry Andrew wrote: Your premise is that Israel is wrong in defending itself and that the USA has no business supporting it.
I am asking you, are you comfortable with paying for Isael's war? Why not give another country as much military power. Who would you give it too? How much would you give? Why? If they started to target innocent lives would you stop giving them free weapons, or would you still give them and turn your back at the people who will die because you gave weapons to someone who knowingly targeted( or had a history of) killing sivilians. (
Keep in mind we cannot change what people do with other peoples weapons and this is why I'm asking about Israel and the weapons we gaive them) I seems like we can directly save innoccent lives by our own actions and this places their blood on our hands too.
The Palestinians have made an exact science of targetting non-combatants. Look at Leon Klinghoffer. I mean throwing a cripple in a wheelchair over the side of a ship? Firebombing school buses? Blowing up marketplaces and dischotheques?
Brandon 9000 wrote--
The Palestinians have made an exact science of targetting non-combatants. Look at Leon Klinghoffer. I mean throwing a cripple in a wheelchair over the side of a ship? Firebombing school buses? Blowing up marketplaces and dischotheques?
Exactly.
and we must never forget that we are not in a war with Palestine, or Iraq or Iran or Syria or Afghanistan but rather in a war with militant Islam. They want to kill us because we are not Muslims. They hate our country and our civilization. And they do not express it with letters to the editor but rather with suicide bombers somewhat like the Kamakasi in World War II.
BernardR wrote:...but rather with suicide bombers somewhat like the Kamakasi in World War II.
I'm trying to improve my English but you guys do not help:
Kamikaze!
Brandon9000 wrote:Blowing up marketplaces and dischotheques?
Discotheque!
That's where our dichotomy comes from...
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