I don't think it matters that Jesus disagrees, because I don't think Jesus is an authority figure for Free4free (though I might be wrong).
He was just trying to present a possible path for me, I doon't think this is the appropriate time or place for sectarian debate of this variaty. Rather, because this debate centers around someone who does not know who to trust (me) citations to authority (such as Jesus in the Gospel accounts) are probably best avoided...
Or I might not understand the situation at all, in which case please, continue as you were.
Perplexed wrote:Chai, you seem to think that just because I am in a group that I only speak to him THROUGH that group. That's a mistake; whether in a group or out, most communication between God and humans is on a one to one basis. Communal communication (as in the Mass, or Jumu'ah, etc) is less common, at least in my experience.
That wasn't what I was asking at all Perplexed, re-reading my post, I shouldn't have used the word through. Sorry.
I'll rephrase....Do you think that by belonging to a religion it is more likely God will speak to you directly, than if you don't belong to a religion?
If so, why?
I'm not advocating one or the other...it does seem though you have tried various groups, have you tried forging your own path?
If you don't mind me asking...You say you've been seeking since you were 16. How old are you now? How long have you stayed in various religions?
Perplexed wrote:I don't think it matters that Jesus disagrees, because I don't think Jesus is an authority figure for Free4free (though I might be wrong).
He was just trying to present a possible path for me, I doon't think this is the appropriate time or place for sectarian debate of this variaty. Rather, because this debate centers around someone who does not know who to trust (me) citations to authority (such as Jesus in the Gospel accounts) are probably best avoided...
Or I might not understand the situation at all, in which case please, continue as you were.
'Twas only to dispute the notion that all religious paths lead in the same direction.
Not all would agree. If it were true, you would not continue searching.
I'm 22, and I'm a religion student. in chronological order (as best I can remember) I have been interested in:
Wicca, this is what got me looking into religions, before this I was basically atheist. It was interesting, but seemed too wishy-washy for me.
Buddhism, still a huge influence on my thinking.
Hinduism, The religious expressions of this religion are beautiful, mantras and meditations and fire ceremonies and ritual dances and strange pujas of infinite variety.... *looks wistful*
Catholicism, it's just so.... Catholic! There's a mood to Catholicism I just can't describe, however, I knew from the beginning that I wouldn't likely stay.)
Pluralism, where I attempted to combine the pervious two religions, which lasted a long time and made me very happy except for the incongruence between the exclusivity of Catholicism and everytrhing else.
Thelema, This co-existed at the same time as Pluralism, and was just a source for new religious expression.
Islam, the most recent one, which I have only been a member of for a few months. I no longer feel like I'm straying into areas I shouldn't, "worshipping strange gods" etc. but I feel like my religious expression has been pruned too zealously, and I have little left. I miss the freedom of Pluralism, even though I don't miss the strange pervading guilt.
Well, I'm sure everyone thinks I'm some easily influenced idiot now, but this is the truth of the matter, as it has happened to me and within me.
you got me there neologist
I don't think you're an idiot.
I'm just wondering why you don't incorporate what you liked best of all these experiences and make them your own?
What is the reason you feel you need to belong to a particular one religion, since a combination of them seems to suit you?
Also, you didn't answer my question about God communicating directly to you.
I don't know what pluralism is, but I guess it's combining beliefs?
I don't know that you're easily influenced, it's more like you don't give time time. 7 religions in 7 years sounds like you're putting God on some kind of timetable.
Again, maybe God is waitng for you to settle down to talk to you.
What's that old joke - Lord grant me patience, and grant it NOW!
hehehe
In a word, guilt. I worry that that is not what God wants of me, because so many religions seem to say that he doesn't.
Also, no, I do not believe that God will be more apt to speak to somone based on whether they are a member of a religious group or not, UNLESS there is one RIGHT group, in which case it seems likely that he would be more apt to speak to members of that group.
in two words.....
Screw...Guilt.
You're looking too hard babe.
If you're seeking the right religion because of guilt, you're never going to find the right one.
Seek God through Love.
Give God a chance to come to you. He'll show himself when you stop worrying about doing it the "right" way.
How about just developing a few criteria to whittle down the great number of competing religions?
How about
1) Its members are not killing anyone.
2), 3) etc.
that's not very fair neologist, members of every religion have done violent things in the past, Christianity had it's crusades, Jews have fought Phillistines since the time of the old testament and are still fighting them (they just call them palestinians now), even Buddhists, there were Buddhist mongols that ruled very violently over the muslims in Iraq and Iran for awhile.
You can't blame the whackos within a religion on the religion itself.
I wouldn't suggest it if it were not possible.
Now I'm curious, what religions do you deem completely peaceful throughout their history?
Perplexed..I have a question.
In all your outward searching for an external god, have you ever considered instead looking inward?
Just a thought.
of course, I keep up a semi-regular meditation practice (after reading this thread it probably won't suprise you that I'm not the most disciplined person out there)
I mean..you seem really concerned with what 'god' wants and keeping 'god' pleased.
What if that god is yourself?
The existence of God can neither be proved nor disproved. But in another thread I showed the probabilty for the existence of God.
First there is nothing i.e. B.G. (Before God) as God precedes creation. If you assume there is no God then you have 0/0 which is mathematically indeterminate i.e. out of nothing there is no God. It is logically true as you get 'nothing out of nothing.' If you assume there is a God then you get 1/0 which is infinity. It is logically false as you cannot get 'something out of nothing.' It is improbable for a God to poof into existence out of nothing.
Despite all this logic and mathematics, if there is any comfort to you, I do belief there is a God but know nothing else regarding God.
talk72000 wrote:The existence of God can neither be proved nor disproved. But in another thread I showed the probabilty for the existence of God.
First there is nothing i.e. B.G. (Before God) as God precedes creation. If you assume there is no God then you have 0/0 which is mathematically indeterminate i.e. out of nothing there is no God. It is logically true as you get 'nothing out of nothing.' If you assume there is a God then you get 1/0 which is infinity. It is logically false as you cannot get 'something out of nothing.' It is improbable for a God to poof into existence out of nothing.
Despite all this logic and mathematics, if there is any comfort to you, I do belief there is a God but know nothing else regarding God.
I'm sorry, but that arguement had more holes in it than Rosie O'Donnel's underwear.
Do you want to know what Shirk is or are you trying to get closer to God?
"Let there be no compulsion in Religion: truth stands out clear from error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah (one God) has grasped the most trustworthy hand hold, that never breaks. and Allah hears, and knows all things."
(Qur'an, Al-Baqarah 2:256)
Islam means absolute submission to the Will of Allah and those who by choice submit to the Will of Allah are Muslims.
this thread has meandered far far far from it's original subject, don't worry about it.
Perplexed, you sound so much like my best friend! She's a religious studies major and has researched most of the religions you mentioned studying. You and she would have a lot to talk about, I should get her to join a2k and meet you.
