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ship carrying 1300 Muslim pilgrims goes down

 
 
oralloy
 
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 05:36 am
AP: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/egypt_cruise_liner&printer=1

AFP: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/egyptsaudimaritimeboat&printer=1


Note: These links update as more news comes in.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 1,887 • Replies: 29
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dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 05:46 am
Only THREE survivors seen, so far?


I wonder if any ships are close?


Awful....
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roverroad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 05:53 am
I heard there's a rescue ship on the way that can hold 1400 passengers, but they are already seing bodies. It's not looking good. I wonder what could have happened. I don't see how it could be terrorism since they were all Muslims on the ship.
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oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 06:54 am
Here is a Reuters link:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/egypt_ferry_dc&printer=1

And an updated AP link:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/egypt_ship_sinks&printer=1
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 07:55 am
roverroad wrote:
I heard there's a rescue ship on the way that can hold 1400 passengers, but they are already seing bodies. It's not looking good. I wonder what could have happened. I don't see how it could be terrorism since they were all Muslims on the ship.


Actually, while they are at war with the west, radical Islam is also doing a heck of job against its own kind. Don't underestimate them.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 11:31 am
I looked around outside today, and didn't see any Americans dancing in the street celebrating.

Egypt also turned down an offer of assistance from Israel.
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roverroad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 09:58 pm
cjhsa wrote:
Egypt also turned down an offer of assistance from Israel.


So, we turned down offers of assistance from Cuba after the hurricane, what is that supposed to prove?
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 10:06 pm
Not all terrorists are Muslims.

I am not presently guessing terrorism of any sort is involved.
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roverroad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 10:21 pm
ossobuco wrote:
Not all terrorists are Muslims.

I am not presently guessing terrorism of any sort is involved.


I don't think it is anymore either. It was just a first reaction. I guess the ship was old, one of the last of it's kind still floating and they said this kind of ship goes down fast when it takes on any water.

If I were Pat Roberson I'd be keeping my mouth shut. Anybody care to guess what he's thinking right about now? Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 11:04 pm
<deleted by author of post>
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Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 11:32 pm
Boy, this is a non-starter.

An old feeble boat took a bunch of ignorant Egyptian pilgrims from Mecca to Cairo.

A powerful wind blew and the boat capsized.

Roughly 800 people died.

Presumably these 800 dead are now n Paradise and therefore Allah blesses them.

And if they are not? So what? There are 800 tragic stories to tell which will effect 800+ people, but who really cares? So a son never sees his father again? Who really cares?
0 Replies
 
roverroad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Feb, 2006 11:59 pm
Nice attitude... I bet you're really fun at parties. Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 12:02 am
roverroad wrote:
Nice attitude... I bet you're really fun at parties. Rolling Eyes


Yeah, and the breath of your love overwhelms the likes of me. Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 12:14 am
Either some didn't read the news they were commentating or just ...

• most of the passengers were Egyptians working in Saudi Arabia, but some were said to be pilgrims returning from Mecca,
• the number of death is at least 900 [althought it seems to be more than 1,100],
• 35 years may seem to be old [but actually isn't at all for a ship], but the ferry had been inspected last year by the Italian classification firm RINA,
• there have been similar incidents in the same region of the Red Sea in the past, although this is feared to be the worst amongst the recent ones.


The Al-Salam Maritime Transport company that owns the ship said that 1,318 passengers were on board, including 1,200 Egyptians, 100 Saudis, six Syrians, four Palestinians as well as Omani, an Emirati, a Yemeni, a Sudanese, an Indonesian, a Jordanian, a Filipino and an American.


Quote:
Ferry hit by blaze before sinking

A fire broke out on an ageing ferry before it sank in the Red Sea with more than 1,400 people on board, officials said.

Only 324 of the passengers and crew have so far made it to safety and the others are feared dead, missing in cold waters.

Egyptian transport minister Mohammed Lutfy Mansour said investigators were still working to determine the fire's connection to the sinking.

He described the fire as "small" and said there was no explosion on the vessel, which went down before dawn local time on Friday.

Nearly 140 survivors have now been brought to the Egyptian port of Hurghada - the first significant group to come to shore.

They walked off a rescue ship down a ramp, some of them barefoot and shivering, wrapped in blankets, and were immediately put on buses for the hospital.

Many of the survivors claimed that the fire began early in the trip, but the ship kept going and the fire burned for hours.

"They decided to keep going. It's negligence," one survivor said before he was moved along by police. Another said it was "like the Titanic on fire".

Meanwhile, a shipping expert said the vessel involved in the disaster was a sister ship of the British Herald of Free Enterprise, which sunk off Zeebrugge in 1987 killing 187 people.

Andrew Linington, of the National Union of Marine, Aviation and Shipping Transport Officers, said both ships were once part of the Townsend Thorenson fleet. He said there were eight ships in the series, however they were built at different European yards and had different characteristics.
source: Ananova
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 02:38 am
Fires don't cause a capsize.

The weather was bad, strong wind I believe.

Presumably the ship was overloaded, too many passengers, and they all went to one side when the fire took hold? The fire burnt for some hours before the capsize.

I think the news will be clearer today, concerning the cause. Quite a few passengers have been brought ashore, and hopefully some ship's crew too.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 02:48 am
Wow, it was a ro-ro vessel like the one which capsized in the English Channel

Sister ship of 'Herald of Free Enterprise' had been judged unsafe
By Barrie Clement, Transport Editor
Published: 04 February 2006
The ferry involved in the Red Sea sinking was the sister ship of the ill-fated Herald of Free Enterprise, which sank in 1987 off the coast of Belgium with the loss of nearly 200 lives. The Al-Salaam '98 was officially regarded as too unsafe to operate in European waters.

Originally called the Free Enterpise IV and one of eight similar vessels operated by Townsend Thoresen, it had been "pensioned off to the Third World".

Another sister ship of the Herald, the Al-Salaam '95, sank in the Red Sea in October after a collision with a Cypriot commercial vessel. A 16ft-wide hole resulted in the ship sinking within three-and-a-half minutes. In that case almost all of the passengers were rescued.

Andrew Linington of Numast, the British ships' officers union, said that, under European regulations introduced after the Herald of Free Enterprise sinking it would be illegal to operate either vessel in Europe. "This is a scandal. Passenger ships like it are not permitted to sail in European waters. If a ship is unsafe, it is unsafe wherever it operates."

The rules introduced in the late 1990s ensured that "roll-on, roll-off" ferries were redesigned. Stability was increased so that an initial ingress of water was not necessarily catastrophic.

Mr Linington said that, in developing countries, an average of 1,000 people a year had lost their lives in ferry sinkings over the past decade, largely because legislation was not as stringent.

"It's a roll-on, roll-off ferry and there is a big question mark over the stability of this kind of ship," said David Osler of the London shipping paper Lloyd's List. "It would only take a bit of water to get on board this ship and it would be all over ... The percentage of this type of ferry involved in this type of diasaster is huge."

Mr Osler said there was no indication that terrorism was the cause. "Bad weather is looking likely," he said, although Mr Linington pointed out that the vessel should be able to survive most sea conditions.

The Saint Catherine, another ferry travelling the same route overnight in the opposite direction, received a distress message in which the ferry captain said his ship was in danger of sinking. The agency did not say how the Saint Catherine reacted.

Mr Osler said a collision or a leak could be among the reasons for water to enter the vessel, which measures 118m (387ft) long by 23.6m (77ft) wide.

He said: "It only takes a relatively small ingress of water to set up a sort of rocking effect that gains momentum and tilts the ship. If water got on for any reason that is the sort of thing that could happen."

A structural survey last year had found there was "nothing significant to report," the company said. The ship had a stability refit in October 2003.

Mr Osler said the roll-on, roll-off type of ships were still in use in some places, but since 1987, stability had been "massively" increased. "This vessel predates all that and has been pensioned off to the Third World," he said. It had previously served as an Italian vessel from 1970 to 1999.

The company's owner, Mamdouh Ismail, said the ship was more than 25 years old and registered in Panama. It had received a safety management certificate from an Italian organisation in October 2005, covering safety drills and other on-board procedures.

The ship disappeared from radar screens shortly after sailing from the western Saudi port of Duba at 7pm local time on Thursday night. It was due to have arrived at Safaga at 3am.

Coastal stations received no Mayday message from the crew, said Adel Shukri, of el-Salam Maritime Navigation. The weather had been very poor overnight on the Saudi side of the Red Sea, he said. But visibility should have been good out at sea, he added.

Shipping disasters

* 2002: Joola, Senegal:

Almost 2,000 people died when the overcrowded Joola sank in a storm as it was sailing to Dakar.

* 1996: Bukoba, Tanzania:

The Tanzanian ferry Bukoba capsised on Lake Victoria, killing more than 800 people, many trapped in their cabins.

* 1994: Estonia, Estonia:

852 people drowned when the 15,000-tonEstonia ferry sank almost 20 miles from the Finnish island of Utoe.

* 1987: Dona Paz, Philippines: 4,375 people died when the Dona Paz passenger ferry sank after colliding with an oil tanker.

* 1987: M/S Herald of Free Enterprise, Zeebrugge, Belgium: The Herald of Free Enterprise ferry sank, killing 193 of the 539 people onboard.

* 1954: Toya Maru, Japan:

1,172 people died when the freightliner Toya Maru sank during a typhoon in the Tsugaru Strait between the islands of Hokkaido and Honshu.

* 1948: Kiangya, China:

The Kiangya steamship struck a mine and exploded on Huangpo Jiang, killing an estimated 3,920 people.

* 1912: Titanic, UK:

TheTitanic superliner struck an iceberg and sank, resulting in the deaths of 1,496 people.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 03:05 am
McTag wrote:
Fires don't cause a capsize.

The weather was bad, strong wind I believe.

Presumably the ship was overloaded, too many passengers, and they all went to one side when the fire took hold? The fire burnt for some hours before the capsize.

I think the news will be clearer today, concerning the cause. Quite a few passengers have been brought ashore, and hopefully some ship's crew too.


The fire caused a panic according to survivers, the ship wasn't overloaded, if the numbers are given correctly, passengers crowded on one site of the ferry ...

McTag wrote:
Wow, it was a ro-ro vessel like the one which capsized in the English Channel


Some pics:
M/S AL SALAM BOCCACCIO 98 (registered for Pacific Sunlight Marine Inc., Panama)
http://www.faktaomfartyg.com/al_salam_boccaccio_1970_1.jpg

ex-Tirrenia (Navigazione SpA, Cagliari, Italy)
http://www.faktaomfartyg.com/boccacio_1970_2.jpg

http://www.faktaomfartyg.com/boccacio_1970_1.jpg
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  0  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 08:31 am
roverroad wrote:
cjhsa wrote:
Egypt also turned down an offer of assistance from Israel.


So, we turned down offers of assistance from Cuba after the hurricane, what is that supposed to prove?


Only that Fidel hasn't lost his sense of humor.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 10:10 am
Quote:

Egypt survivors say captain fled

Feb. 4 - Survivors of the Red Sea ferry disaster said its captain fled the burning ship by lifeboat and abandoned them as hopes faded on finding some of the 800 passengers still missing.


Some passengers plucked alive from the sea or from boats after the ferry caught fire and sank early on Friday (February 3) said crew had told them not to worry about a fire below deck and even ordered them to take off lifejackets.

Officials at el-Salam Maritime Transport Company, which owned the Al Salam 98, were not immediately available to answer the allegations.

Rescue workers have recovered 195 bodies from the Red Sea and saved 390 people but about 800 more, most of them Egyptian workers returning from Saudi Arabia, are missing.

The director of the Red Sea Ports Authority, Major-General Mahfouz Taha, said 378 survivors had come ashore on the Egyptian side. The Saudi authorities said they had picked up 22.

Survivors said a fire broke out below deck shortly after the 35-year-old vessel left the Saudi port of Duba on Thursday evening with 1,272 passengers and a crew of about 100. "The boat kept on sailing for 3 hours and a half after it caught fire. The fire started from the store room underneath." said survivor Nabeel Zekri. When asked when the fire started, an unidentified female survivor said, "after two hours. The captain refused to take it back."

The ship began to list but the crew continued to sail out into the Red Sea rather than turn back to the Saudi port, they told reporters in the Egyptian port of Safaga, where the ferry should have landed early on Friday.

Shirin Hassan, the head of the maritime section of the Egyptian Ministry of Transport, told state television that the fire seemed to have broken out in one of the vehicles on the the lower car decks. The crew thought they had put the fire out but it flared up again, he said, citing a preliminary analysis.

It was not immediately clear what happened to the captain, named as Sayyed Omar, or why coastguards did not appear to have received any distress signal from the ferry.

State news agency MENA said that on Friday morning a ship did pick up a message from the ferry's captain saying he was in danger of sinking. It did not say how the ship reacted.

Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, who has ordered an immediate investigation into the disaster, visited some of the injured in a hospital in the port of Hurghada on Saturday.

He ordered the government to pay 30,000 Egyptian pounds ($5,200) in compensation to the families of the dead and 15,000 pounds to each of survivor, MENA said.

A presidential spokesman said on Friday there may not have been enough lifeboats, although a shipping company official said the Saudi authorities had confirmed that everything was in order when the ship sailed.

MENA said the passenger list included more than 1,000 Egyptians, as well as other nationalities, including Saudis, Syrians, and a Canadian.

A sister ship of the sunken ferry, the Al Salam 95, sank in the Red Sea in October after a collision with a Cypriot commercial vessel. All but four of the passengers were saved.
source: reuters (video on that site, too)
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 4 Feb, 2006 11:44 am
It had 2 extra upper decks added, too.

These vessels would not get a licence to operate in Europe.
0 Replies
 
 

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