What produces RUTHLESS DICTATORS?

Spendi took a shot at it. Do you agree with him?

Okie, I've indicated the points in the "25 Points" I FAVOR or OPPOSE--I do not know which if any are Republican or Democrat points:

FAVOR! 1. We demand the union of all Germans in a Great Germany on the basis of the principle of self-determination of all peoples.

FAVOR! 2. We demand that the German people have rights equal to those of other nations; and that the Peace Treaties of Versailles and St. Germain shall be abrogated.

OPPOSE! 3. We demand land and territory (colonies) for the maintenance of our people and the settlement of our surplus population.

OPPOSE! 4. Only those who are our fellow countrymen can become citizens. Only those who have German blood, regardless of creed, can be our countrymen. Hence no Jew can be a countryman.

OPPOSE! 5. Those who are not citizens must live in Germany as foreigners and must be subject to the law of aliens.

FAVOR! 6. The right to choose the government and determine the laws of the State shall belong only to citizens. We therefore demand that no public office, of whatever nature, whether in the central government, the province, or the municipality, shall be held by anyone who is not a citizen.

OPPOSE!We wage war against the corrupt parliamentary administration whereby men are appointed to posts by favor of the party without regard to character and fitness.

FAVOR! 7. We demand that the State shall above all undertake to ensure that every citizen shall have the possibility of living decently and earning a livelihood. NOT OK! If it should not be possible to feed the whole population, then aliens (non-citizens) must be expelled from the Reich.

OPPOSE! 8. Any further immigration of non-Germans must be prevented. We demand that all non-Germans who have entered Germany since August 2, 1914, shall be compelled to leave the Reich immediately.

FAVOR! 9. All citizens must possess equal rights and duties.

OPPOSE! 10. The first duty of every citizen must be to work mentally or physically. No individual shall do any work that offends against the interest of the community to the benefit of all.

Therefore we demand:

OPPOSE! 11. That all unearned income, and all income that does not arise from work, be abolished.

NOT OK! 12. Since every war imposes on the people fearful sacrifices in blood and treasure, all personal profit arising from the war must be regarded as treason to the people. We therefore demand the total confiscation of all war profits.

OPPOSE! 13. We demand the nationalization of all trusts.

OPPOSE! 14. We demand profit-sharing in large industries.

OPPOSE! 15. We demand a generous increase in old-age pensions.

OPPOSE! 16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a sound middle-class, the immediate communalization of large stores which will be rented cheaply to small tradespeople, and the strongest consideration must be given to ensure that small traders shall deliver the supplies needed by the State, the provinces and municipalities.

OPPOSE! 17. We demand an agrarian reform in accordance with our national requirements, and the enactment of a law to expropriate the owners without compensation of any land needed for the common purpose. The abolition of ground rents, and the prohibition of all speculation in land.

OPPOSE! 18. We demand that ruthless war be waged against those who work to the injury of the common welfare. Traitors, usurers, profiteers, etc., are to be punished with death, regardless of creed or race.

???? 19. We demand that Roman law, which serves a materialist ordering of the world, be replaced by German common law.

OPPOSE! 20. In order to make it possible for every capable and industrious German to obtain higher education, and thus the opportunity to reach into positions of leadership, the State must assume the responsibility of organizing thoroughly the entire cultural system of the people. The curricula of all educational establishments shall be adapted to practical life. The conception of the State Idea (science of citizenship) must be taught in the schools from the very beginning. We demand that specially talented children of poor parents, whatever their station or occupation, be educated at the expense of the State.

OPPOSE! 21. The State has the duty to help raise the standard of national health by providing maternity welfare centers, by prohibiting juvenile labor, by increasing physical fitness through the introduction of compulsory games and gymnastics, and by the greatest possible encouragement of associations concerned with the physical education of the young.

OPPOSE! 22. We demand the abolition of the regular army and the creation of a national (folk) army.

OPPOSE! 23. We demand that there be a legal campaign against those who propagate deliberate political lies and disseminate them through the press. In order to make possible the creation of a German press, we demand:

OPPOSE! (a) All editors and their assistants on newspapers published in the German language shall be German citizens.

OPPOSE! (b) Non-German newspapers shall only be published with the express permission of the State. They must not be published in the German language.

OPPOSE! (c) All financial interests in or in any way affecting German newspapers shall be forbidden to non-Germans by law, and we demand that the punishment for transgressing this law be the immediate suppression of the newspaper and the expulsion of the non-Germans from the Reich.

OPPOSE! Newspapers transgressing against the common welfare shall be suppressed. We demand legal action against those tendencies in art and literature that have a disruptive influence upon the life of our folk, and that any organizations that offend against the foregoing demands shall be dissolved.

OPPOSE! 24. We demand freedom for all religious faiths in the state, insofar as they do not endanger its existence or offend the moral and ethical sense of the Germanic race.

OPPOSE! The party as such represents the point of view of a positive Christianity without binding itself to any one particular confession. It fights against the Jewish materialist spirit within and without, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of our folk can only come about from within on the pinciple:

COMMON GOOD BEFORE INDIVIDUAL GOOD

OPPOSE! 25. In order to carry out this program we demand: the creation of a strong central authority in the State, the unconditional authority by the political central parliament of the whole State and all its organizations.

OPPOSE! The formation of professional committees and of committees representing the several estates of the realm, to ensure that the laws promulgated by the central authority shall be carried out by the federal states.

OPPOSE! The leaders of the party undertake to promote the execution of the foregoing points at all costs, if necessary at the sacrifice of their own lives.

So here we are, oe and Walter apparently hung up on one detail, what Hitler actually meant when in regard to parliamentary issues. It really doesn't matter much in the grand scheme of things, as most of the remainder of the document is clearly leftist.

I think if you would read Mein Kampf, you would recognize Hitler's disdain of the parliamentary activities. I think he viewed them as a waste of time, and calling them corrupt was his way of dismissing the entire process of open and honest government working out solutions through discussion, argument, and procedures dictated by parliamentary activities. It would be similar to a politician marginalizing Congress because they don't like "partisanship" and things like "lobbying" that have been known to include some corruption.

So yes, I think the point is leftist. Clearly so.

Because Hitler had a disdain of the parliamentary activities, a point in a party program that vows to fight corruption is leftist?

That's quite a stretch there.


So, when McCain vowed to fight lobbyism in Washington, he was running on a Nazi/Socialist platform?

No, it goes beyond corruption in my opinion. McCain has no disdain for Congressional procedures and negotiation, it is part of our system of government.

oe, I don't know if you really don't know some of this and can't see the difference, or you are purposely trying to cloud the issue when you know better. I am happy to debate people that want to be honest, but I don't feel that you are, so the debate with you is growing very tiresome.

Walt-- Foxy wrote--

Quote:

Spendi took a shot at it. Do you agree with him?

Are you not going to answer that?

If I had to venture a guess, I would say that the intention of this point in the party program was to emphasize the party's focus on nation and citizenship and to announce that the party would aim to introduce a meritocracy for public offices in lieu of appointment by quotas and party membership.

I don't find the it particularly surprising to see an emphasis on the legal status of people, issues of citizenship and some kind of proposed German-only legislation in the platform of a right-wing, nationalist party.

I would say that it's a bit more difficult to evaluate the lament about the corrupting circumstances of a parliamentary party system. Taken at face value, I would probably interpret it as a staple in a party platform - kind of like every presidential candidate in the American primaries will promise you to fight waste and bureaucracy in Washington. If you want a more fanciful interpretation that doesn't stick that much to the actual text, I'd say that it could also be seen as code for an opposition to a parliamentary system or a multi-party system in general.... but that's kind of reaching.

I'm not sure I would have read as much into it as Okie did and probably wouldn't have coded it as pure leftist doctrine as Okie did. But I can also see where he is coming from and since none of us seem to be sure about the intent of the phrase, his perception is as good as anybody else's.

I would like to discuss all the concepts on the list more in depth and would find discussion of the various principles presented interesting. We might all come to agree that the coded red points are in fact 'left of center' as that is defined in America, or not. At any rate it could make for a good discussion.