@parados,
parados wrote:
Asherman summed it up quite nicely in one of the first posts here.
http://able2know.org/topic/66117-1#post-1758639
Quote:A bit of a problem is that countless multitudes share the same "profile", yet only a very, very few become infamous despots or even serial killers.
Several people have tried to point out the same thing. Okie starts with a logical fallacy. Correlation is not the same thing as causation.
Okie then compounds that starting logical fallacy by adding other logical fallacies to it. If people can't point out the logical fallacies then we can't have a rational discussion on the topic. A rational discussion would be one where we try to avoid fallacies.
To address this point again. Before doing so, I wish to say that I find Asherman to be a pretty reasonble guy and logical. In this case, my point stands, and is simply common sense. I did explain, I thought very well, that the conditions that produce ruthless dictators are present in many many people. I will quote what I said in my opening post of this thread, which essentially debunks what Asherman said, and what Parados has just asserted.
okie wrote:One observation I would like to make here. Such personalities can be found in abundance in every culture, but obviously there must be conditions whereby such people can gain an audience and eventually gain political power. I think such potential dictators with their inherent politics can only gain traction in a society that also has more of a preponderence of the mindset similar to that of the potential dictator. This mindset would include a general feeling of failure and personal feeling of powerlessness, unfairness, and resentment, coupled with an increased lack of faith in God or religion. Such a collective mindset then takes on an increased hope that "government" can right the wrongs and create some kind of system that is more fair. Business and free enterprise becomes more demonized and viewed more as unfair, thus something needs to be done to correct it. An important component in this cultural mindset is the condition of the family unit, whereby children grow up in happy, balanced conditions, so that they can grow into being happy adults without some axe to grind, and they are happy to work and bear the fruits of their own labors. Also a belief in God rather than a belief in government is important in keeping a culture away from dictators, at least that has been true for the first 200 years of this country. If too many people in our culture begin to have more axes to grind, then the seeds of some ruthless dictator or government gaining traction becomes a very real danger.
I will try to explain the obvious with an analogy, certain weather conditions and certain kinds of storm clouds produce tornados and destruction, so it follows that almost all destructive tornados are produced by such conditions, but such conditions do not always produce tornados, and if produced, are not always destructive. It depends upon when and where and how large the tornados are, and which path they take. But it is very logical to assume that if you see the weather conditions and clouds form, it is wise to observe the danger, to avoid the destruction if possible. It is also logical to assume that when such conditions and clouds are not observed, then the liklihood of no tornados and safety from them is far higher. The clouds and certain weather conditions cause tornados, which cause destruction by a percentage of the tornados. Not all tornados cause destruction.
Similarly, certain common denominators observed in politicians and political systems can and do indicate the most fertile ground for a ruthless dictator to arise and to eventually wreak havoc. That is not a prediction that such will happen, but it is an indication that we need to take notice and try to avoid it. So certain conditions in people may cause them to be dangerous personalities, but only a small percentage may end up dangerous, or have the opportunity to wreak havoc.
The point here is totally obvious and reasonable, and I wonder about people that cannot seem to grasp the point here, which is - if you observe some things about politicians, their personality, their upbringing, their experience, then add it to the political situation or system in which they may gain power, I think that is important. And if we pay attention, it would help us make better judgements about the people we elect and place into power.
