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coberst
 
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 01:19 pm
Sociology claims that we identify ourselves in large part based upon the world outside of the self.

Identity?-the sameness of a person or thing at all times or in all circumstances?-the condition of fact that a person or thing is itself and not something else; individuality, personality

I have never personally experienced an earthquake but have read that it is a very destabilizing experience. It is disorienting and it will cause a great deal of anxiety over and beyond what any ?'normal' catastrophe would cause. It apparently is caused by completely destroying our sense of certainty and solidity and permanence that we associate with the world outside of the self.

I am sure there are many reasons why religion is so pervasive within the population. I suspect one important reason is the comfortable sense derived when one is certain that there exists an anchor of stability outside of the self. I suspect this metaphysical certainty is somewhat like a night light in a child's bedroom. The human need for stability seems to demand some assurance that stability exists outside the individual.

In the 1950s sociologists and psychiatrists began to refer identity to a fluid reality "socially bestowed and socially sustained". Common understanding began to accept a person's actions and the public record of those actions no longer define identity. A person came to be identified by the social roles she performs and/or the reference group to which she belongs.

This began a change; there was deterioration between a conception of "association between identity and continuity of the personality". Both persons and objects lost their solidity, their definiteness and continuity. Persons began to lose a sense of fixedness; they no longer inhabit a world that exists independently of them. "Identity has become uncertain and problematic not because people no longer occupy fixed social stations?-a commonplace explanation that unthinkingly incorporates the modern equation of identity and social role?-but because they no longer inhabit a world that exists independently of themselves."

Those who study such things claim that with the receding of the common world?-the world shared by all, for example the notion that it takes a village to raise a child has had a detrimental effect on all of us. Our life now liberated from the "prying eyes of neighbors, from village prejudices, from the inquisitorial presence of elders, from everything narrow, stifling, petty, and conventional" has had a serious effect on private life as well. "It has freed the imagination from external constraints but exposed it more directly than before to the tyranny of inner compulsion and anxieties."

The fantasy of imagination nor longer becomes a force for freedom, it gives rise to hallucinations. We lose our sense of the practical and science gives us an ever rising sense of power to achieve our wildest flights of fancy. "By holding out a vision of limitless technological possibility?-space travel, biological engineering, mass destruction?-it removes the last obstacle to wishful thinking. It brings reality into conformity with our dreams, or rather with our nightmares."

There is an article in last Sunday's Washington Post that I think bears witness to this problem. The Post requires that the reader become a member but the membership is free if you wish to read the article at:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/18/AR2005111801778.html

The quotes are from "The Minimal Self" by Christopher Lasch.
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fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 01:50 pm
"One of man's most important mistakes, is his illusion in regard to his I.
Man such as we know him, the ?'man-machine,' the man who cannot ?'do,' and with whom and through whom everything ?'happens,' cannot have a permanent and single I. His I changes as quickly as his thoughts, feelings and moods, and he makes a profound mistake in considering himself always one and the same person; in reality he is always a different person, not the one he was a moment ago.
Man has no permanent and unchangeable I. Every thought, every mood, every desire, every sensation, says ?'I.' And in each case it seems to be taken for granted that this I belongs to the Whole, to the whole man, and that a thought, a desire, or an aversion is expressed by this Whole. In actual fact there is no foundation whatsoever for this assumption. Man's every thought and desire appears and lives quite separately and independently of the Whole. And the Whole never expresses itself, for the simple reason that it exists, as such, only physically as a thing, and in the abstract as a concept. Man has no individual I. But there are, instead, hundreds and thousands of separate small I's, very often entirely unknown to one another, never coming into contact, or, on the contrary, hostile to each other, mutually exclusive and incompatible. Each minute, each moment, man is saying or thinking, ?'I.' And each time his I is different. Just now it was a thought, now it is a desire, now a sensation, now another thought, and so on, endlessly. Man is a plurality. Man's name is legion."

P.D. Ouspensky "IN SEARCH OF THE MIRACULOUS" 1949
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 02:29 pm
fresco-

Yes-a shifting frontier.

But a bedrock of habit or preferred pathways I would add on.Would you exclude that.
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fresco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 04:33 pm
Spendius

This "system" would argue not. Those who actually attempt exercises in self observation are usually surprised by the extent of the dissonance.
That which we would see as "constant" is deemed to be "false personality" which masks "true essence". (Note here the etymology of "personality" from the greek persona - the mask worn by actors).

From my own persective such a system may overstate its case, but I certainly think that "the self" is much less cohesive than most people believe. It certainly has a social dimension as implied by coberst above, and it may be the case that each of us could occupy any position along the dimension "saint to murderer" according to prevailing conditions.
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 05:55 pm
Yeah I know fresco.But big tits.What do you think about big tits?
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