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British Parliament will "pray against" longer pub hours

 
 
Reply Sun 9 Oct, 2005 10:19 am
Quote:
MPs to 'pray against' longer pub hours
(Filed: 09/10/2005)

Opponents of relaxed licensing laws are to use a little-known parliamentary procedure in a bid to block the implementation of later pub opening hours next month, it emerged today.



MPs will tomorrow "pray against" the order implementing the Licensing Act - which was passed by Parliament in 2003 - in a bid to force a vote in both the Commons and Lords on whether it should be put into effect.

The Act is due to come into force on November 24, and around two-thirds of the 190,000 pubs and bars in England and Wales are understood to have applied to open later from that date, most of them seeking to keep doors open until midnight or 1am at weekends.

As the implementation of the Act has come nearer, police and doctors have spoken out over its implications for health and public order, and an estimated 30,000 members of the public have raised objections to longer opening hours for their local pubs.

Today, Liberal Democrat culture spokesman Don Foster explained the last-ditch move being attempted to prevent the change going ahead.

"Tomorrow we are going to use a little-used parliamentary technique to pray against the order that would bring the Licensing Act into force on November 24," he told BBC Radio 4's World This Weekend programme.

"In simple terms, we are going to try to force a vote in both the House of Commons and House of Lords to see if we can prevent the Act coming into force on November 24."

Mr Foster conceded that the move was not guaranteed to be successful, and predicted that the Government would use any available parliamentary manoeuvre to defeat it.

"In the House of Commons, quite obviously, the Government can stack the committee that will consider this with a majority and they are bound to win and defeat us," he said.

"The situation in the House of Lords of course will depend on whether or not we can get a coalition of Liberal Democrats, Conservatives and Crossbenchers and potentially some Labour rebels to support this move."

Government whips might try to neutralise the challenge by timetabling the debate on the "prayer" after November 24 or by holding a vote in the Lords in the middle of the night, predicted Mr Foster.

But Leader of the Commons Geoff Hoon insisted there would be no dirty tricks, telling The World This Weekend: "I accept that there are procedural devices, but I equally assure you that we will follow the rules.

"That's always the position as far as the Government is concerned. We will ensure that appropriate parliamentary procedures are followed."


The term "pray against" is used in the Statutory Instruments Act 1946, and means simply that Members may indicate their objection to a piece of subordinate legislation.
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Lord Ellpus
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Oct, 2005 01:40 pm
Walter, Bliar and co. have some wierd idea that relaxing the opening hours of pubs will somehow bring in a "cafe culture" where everyone will sit sipping a cocktail and enjoying a quiet chat until the early hours of the morning.
Then they will all escort their ladies home in a civilised manner, causing no disturbance to the local residents, sleeping peacefully in the adjacent streets.

I think you and I and possibly the rest of Europe knows that the British and German (Possibly Scandinavain countries?) drinking habits, and drunken behaviour, are FAR from peaceful.

I pity anyone who lives near an "extended hours" pub, should this law go through. Who wants drunken young men and women peeing up their wall, whilst singing and shouting at 3am?

Certainly not the Labour M.P's, who seem to be lodging their protests at the pubs that happen to be applying for longer hours in THEIR neighbourhood!

Not in my back yard, eh?
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Oct, 2005 01:51 pm
Well, I still remember that got old days back in the 60's:

- in Scotland, you started a left-handed binge drinking while collecting bottles/cans of McEwans with the right hand at a quarter to ten.

- in (rural) Dorset/Hamptshire/Wiltshire you reminded the landlord at 11 that he forgot to ring the bell/close the front door.

:wink:

Opening times in Germany have always been until 1 o'clock in the morning, and now unti 2, 3, 4, 5 - depending on the licence, like suggested for the UK.


Like you said: it may sound nice, especially for those, who remember the fine nights they had had in Lancarote, Biarritz or Alicante.

But for people living around there and not living from such drinking HERE in our part of Europe (and the one across the ocean in Great Britain), here it really isn't nice at all.


PS: 'praying in parliament' really is a fine expression. :wink:
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hamburger
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Oct, 2005 01:56 pm
well remember our first visit to a british pub. it was march 1979 and mrs hbg birthday. we stopped over in london for a few days before taking the overnight ferr to hamburg. we had come back from he theatre and were having ham and cheese sandwiches and "half-and-half" (?), when suddenly there was some shouting, running and a metal grid came down over the bar ... had to wait for the next day to arrive before ordering another beer(actually a porter, i think). hbg
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goodfielder
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Oct, 2005 07:21 pm
I have to admit I found the British licensing hours appalling. Loved the pubs and the beer (great beer) but the trading hours were ridiculous. I reckon those restricted hours have actually created a culture of binge drinking. I have said this before but in my state a pub can trade 24/7 if it wishes and some (cbd based) do. Not much call for it in the suburbs though. There may well be a time of over-carousing but it will settle. Main thing is for the Parliamentarians not to lose their nerve because of the behaviour of a few boofheads who haven't worked out that you don't have to have fifteen pints in the next twenty minutes before closing.

My state used to have 6 pm closing many years ago. It contributed to hyper-binge drinking. So much so that the closing time behaviour was described as "the Six o'Clock Swill". We even had a special police patrol duty (not me doing it I wasn't in the job then) where three coppers in a waggon would go around the pubs in the cbd (and there were very many pubs) chucking drunks into the waggon. Not very good.

Anyway we relaxed our licensing hours and the world as we know it hasn't come to an end. It's actually more civilised. You can get a drink in a restaurant or cafe without having to order a meal or you can just toddle off to your pub with its extended hours.

On my next visit to Britain I shall look forward to a leisurely couple of best bitters at lunchtime without the fear of being flung out on the footpath for the offence of being sober and wanting to do something about it Very Happy
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