Chinese Symbols = Genesis Story

This is interesting...glad you brought it up. Seems like this story has a begining in all the worlds oldest religions. I heard that they attached XYZ coordinates to the Egyption heiroglphs and came out with fantastic mathematical formulas .

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What I find interesting is that the symbol for garden is a square verion of the greek symbol for Phi. So close and both done around 5000BC

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I'm just curious to see what opponents of the validity of the bible have to say.

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Reading

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chinese symbols
You know, you can go back to ancient sumeria and find all sorts of history of the flood, creation and so forth. There are many ancient texts that tell of the flood and many other things. (A really good read is The Earth Chronicles by Sitchin. 6 or 7 books. His theory is very plausible)
Also research the Enuma Elish and The Epic of Gilgamesh. This should not come as a surprise to anyone who has done any kind of research into ancient history. The bible was only a starting poing for me. It made me think to myself that "Hey, there must be somethng more behind all this..." The bible is like a condensed book, a reader's digest. It is really just a tool of the church.

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This seems like an over-simplification with the express purpose of proving the Bible. Something I have never EVER understood is the continual search for verification when your faith charges you to believe without proof. It seems so rude to your Lord... but then, most Biblical converts needed miracles in order to believe despite what the Christ said. Maybe people will never change. Just remember a few words here:

John 2
[23] Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
[24] But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
[25] And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.

John 3
[11]...We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
[12] If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

John 4
[48] Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe.
And he didn't say that as though it were a Good Thing!

John 5
44] How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?
[45] Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
[46] For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
[47] But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Nevertheless... as I said, this thesis is vast over-simplification. For example, here are some Chinese words for garden -- you'll have to go to this link:
China Language words for Garden

Even the Chinese word which seems closest to the one you mention has an additional character on top which your history lesson doesn't note. One has to wonder why... could it be that it won't fit nicely into the theory?

Here is is the Chinese word for paradise... music + garden:
樂園

How does this give you some proof? I don't see it.

As for... devil... first off, remember, the Chinese word for garden is, in fact, different from what the Morgenstern essay says. I'd also like to point out to you (just for a little twist) that this word "devil" is also used in combination with man or woman to mean Caucasian. See here.

The Chinese word for human is simplified, see here as is the word for secret. See here. It just boggles my mind that Morgenstern would use false logic to try to prove a faith that requires belief without proof... and especially to teach it the young.

Go ahead and look up the rest of the words mentioned in Morgenstern on any Chinese dictionary and see for yourself how this has been oversimplified into a sad facsimile of false proofs. They ought to be ashamed.

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Quote:

Something I have never EVER understood is the continual search for verification when your faith charges you to believe without proof.

There are certain things that we must have faith about, but the whole idea doesn't come from blind acceptance of a made-up story. Why would God be offended by his creation searching for him?

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thunder_runner32 wrote:

There are certain things that we must have faith about, but the whole idea doesn't come from blind acceptance of a made-up story. Why would God be offended by his creation searching for him?

How about because according to the Bible , the god of the Bible get offended by almost anything that humans do.

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That garden and symbol for music are a truely fantastic comment on what makes a place devine. Earlier I saw a program where the music enhanced the size and taste of grapes.So music and location go hand in hand.

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Humans can create meaning out of anything.

If you're looking for 4's, you'll find 4's everywhere you look.

I fail to see anything other than a cute attempt to connect-the-dots.

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Piffka wrote:

This seems like an over-simplification with the express purpose of proving the Bible. Something I have never EVER understood is the continual search for verification when your faith charges you to believe without proof. It seems so rude to your Lord... but then, most Biblical converts needed miracles in order to believe despite what the Christ said. Maybe people will never change. Just remember a few words here:

John 2
[23] Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did.
[24] But Jesus did not commit himself unto them, because he knew all men,
[25] And needed not that any should testify of man: for he knew what was in man.

John 3
[11]...We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.
[12] If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

John 4
[48] Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe.
And he didn't say that as though it were a Good Thing!

John 5
44] How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?
[45] Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
[46] For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
[47] But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Nevertheless... as I said, this thesis is vast over-simplification. For example, here are some Chinese words for garden -- you'll have to go to this link:
China Language words for Garden

Even the Chinese word which seems closest to the one you mention has an additional character on top which your history lesson doesn't note. One has to wonder why... could it be that it won't fit nicely into the theory?

Here is is the Chinese word for paradise... music + garden:
樂園

How does this give you some proof? I don't see it.

As for... devil... first off, remember, the Chinese word for garden is, in fact, different from what the Morgenstern essay says. I'd also like to point out to you (just for a little twist) that this word "devil" is also used in combination with man or woman to mean Caucasian. See here.

The Chinese word for human is simplified, see here as is the word for secret. See here. It just boggles my mind that Morgenstern would use false logic to try to prove a faith that requires belief without proof... and especially to teach it the young.

Go ahead and look up the rest of the words mentioned in Morgenstern on any Chinese dictionary and see for yourself how this has been oversimplified into a sad facsimile of false proofs. They ought to be ashamed.

Yeap.
Peter Seebach on talk.orgins:
"The word for "ship" does not mean "boat with eight people on it".

This also shows that the authors of this analysis did not know Chinese well
enough to recognize the basic numerals. "

http://groups.google.com/group/talk.origins/browse_thread/thread/d65d4c0445bfd612?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&%5Crnum=1

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thunder_runner32 wrote:

Quote:
Something I have never EVER understood is the continual search for verification when your faith charges you to believe without proof.

There are certain things that we must have faith about, but the whole idea doesn't come from blind acceptance of a made-up story. Why would God be offended by his creation searching for him?

YOu are exactly wrong -- it does come from blind acceptance.

I'll try to explain this one point. Humans can never fully understand the workings of the universe. Any human trying to describe "GOD" will fail -- humans trying to prove the existence of "GOD" show that their faith is not strong at all but relies on proofs, which are guaranteed to be faulty. When your "proofs" are shown to be wrong -- doesn't that shake the validity of your faith?

I've tried to show you that Morgenstern is not giving you the entire story, but picking and choosing to make things fit. Why, one has to wonder? Is their faith that fragile? Trying to force the Genesis story out of mis-represented Chinese words is just sad.

Hi Algis -- yep, a garden with music does seem like a little paradise. I liked it, too.

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Hi P,

on the cover of Mysteries Magazine they have an article on how sound affects H2O. This then would probably happen in a certain natural space as well.

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Hey Algis -- I think I've seen that... not sure I believe that water is affected by sound but the photos are sure pretty. I had a friend in Sonora a long time ago who had a lot of dealings with the Yaqui Indians. He said they believed water was the best conduit for spirit. I know that watching the sparkling water as it moved along the Gulf of California shoreline could make a believer out of just about anybody. Wink

Hi PauliGirl -- Thanks for backing me up. I thought that was as really interesting link and written by people with a lot more knowledge than I have. I don't know much about the Chinese language(s) but I knew enough to recognize bogus logic when I see it. So, thanks, M'am, looking forward to seeing you around the forum.

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Algis.Kemezys wrote:

Hi P,

on the cover of Mysteries Magazine they have an article on how sound affects H2O. This then would probably happen in a certain natural space as well.

Algis, have you seen these? Liquid Sculpture

http://www.liquidsculpture.com/img/free_fall_drop_hi.jpg

http://www.mercola.com/ImageServer/Public/2005/september/9.20liquidsculpture.jpg

http://www.liquidsculpture.com/Beads/content79595.jpg

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thunder_runner32 wrote:

Quote:
Something I have never EVER understood is the continual search for verification when your faith charges you to believe without proof.

There are certain things that we must have faith about, but the whole idea doesn't come from blind acceptance of a made-up story. Why would God be offended by his creation searching for him?

Well...Mesquite beat me to it, but...

....why would the god of the Bible not be offended by humans searching for him? The god is offended by almost everything else humans do except when they are grovelling before it.

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You tell me why he would be offended.

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thunder_runner32 wrote:

You tell me why he would be offended.

Why would he insist we have "faith" and "believe" if he were just going to give us ways to prove he existed? Seems like that'd be bucking his plans a bit.

Chinese Symbols = Genesis Story

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