Writer/ illustrator attribution

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I am closely collaborating with a graphic designer on a children's book. The concept is all his. When I first saw it it was going to be a workbook for K-3, with activity pages, illustrations, and informational pages. With my input, it's become a storybook -- I've contributed a lot of the plot and about 90% of the actual text.

But it's a very close collaboration, and the guy I'm working with has provided some of the text, a lot of the names, and a lot of the plot. He also definitely has the final say -- I'm doing the writing, but he is the one who approves or nixes a plot point or direction.

What he has right now on the title page is:

Story and Illustrations by Graphic Designerguy [in smaller font]Writing and Editing by Sozobe Lastname.

That doesn't seem right, but I'm not sure what IS. Editing is the easy one to get rid of (that's how things started out, I was just editing and then had some suggestions and he liked the suggestions...) But it doesn't feel right to have just plain "Illustrated by Graphic Designerguy/ Written by Sozobe Lastname," or, worse yet, "Sozobe Lastname/ Illustrated by Graphic Designerguy." (The latter seems to be the standard attribution, to have just the writer's name with no prefix, and then "illustrated by" and the illustrator's name.)

What I'm thinking is:

Concept and Illustrations by Graphic Designerguy Written by Sozobe Lastname.

:-? Not crazy about it.

Ideas? (Carlotta, would particularly like your take...)

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How about:

Written by Graphic Designerguy and Sozobe Lastname
Illustrated by Graphic Designerguy

I think it is asanine to separate all the aspects of writing such as plot design and writing and editing...you both put a lot into it, so just say that you both worked on the writing. And then it's just a matter of who's name comes first.

In a picture book its really the pictures and the concept that make the book. This book was his idea, so even if you did 90% of the actual writing, I think he should still be first author.

But, I'm not so sure how much writing there is...not sure how much 3rd grade kids read...is this a short novel like the hardy boys or more like Go Dog Go!? If it's more of a book like the Hardy Boys and you wrote all that, then you should be first on the author and you should make the distinction that the concept was his.

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Oh, definitely agreed that he should be first. There is definitely a lot of work involved -- making the story fit a certain number of pages, contain a certain amount of factual information without being boring, have a good pace, have a good rhythm, etc., etc. Carlotta said it's kind of like writing a poem, I'd agree with that (as in, just because it's shorter doesn't mean it's so much easier -- having written lots of different forms I'd say this is one of the harder ones). BUT, I totally agree that the concept counts for a whole lot.

I like your idea!

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How about:

................Title

......Graphic Designerguy

........Sozobe Lastname

With a break down of who did what inside?

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stuh505 wrote:

...is this a short novel like the hardy boys or more like Go Dog Go!

Go Dog Go! I absolutely loved that book!

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The most correct form of authorship would be:

story and concept by (Designer Art Guy) and you (sozobe)
illustrated by Designer Art Guy

His name should come first, but both of you get equal credit for the writing

(no credit for editing - publisher will be editor)

Good luck

What kind of a publisher will you be sending this semi-educational book?
Do a lot of research and save yourself some time.

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I'd leave the final decision up to him, just make it a point that you feel credit may not be given where needed. In the end he is the only one who knows what part you had in the book as it was his idea to begin with, theres no way for you to know how much your work effected the overall story from original conception. Trying to label a standard layout cheapens the entire project down to publisher and writer rather then a creation involveing two individuals, in the end you know what you did so what does it matter whats writen on the cover

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Quote:

...what does it matter whats writen on the cover

Professional recognition, for one thing.

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You are welcome to your opinion on this for yourself, deler, so I don't mean to argue you out of it.

"He is the only one who knows what part you had" - a good reason for taking business notes, with quotes. Not to get frantic about this kind of thing, but notation is useful.

In this case, I gather sozobe's client is not antagonisitc to her idea of the impact of her participation - she was just asking about wording.

In ordinary human discourse - aside from the writing professions - one's ideas are often absorbed by another and then used by that other person, who will not remember where he or she got the idea, although occasionally they do and give credit. It happens in offices all the time, and other arenas of life, and is not entirely mysterious, it has a lot to do with the way we absorb information. Some are users and some just don't really remember how they synthesized their new ideation. Some people even direct information this way, so that the next person will think it is his and promote the idea.

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Yep.

In this case, most of the discussion was via email, so it's actually fairly easily tracked.

But Osso has it right, this guy wants to give me credit, and was in fact giving me credit (in the form of putting my name in the layouts) much earlier than I was comfortable with (at that point, I hadn't done much -- have done much more since). The only issue is how to best say it.

However, Noddy is also very right in that while it was his idea and I didn't push for it, having my name on the cover has many tangible benefits. Being able to say that I'm a published children's book author opens a lot of doors. (I could certainly say so even if I didn't receive credit, but it'd look pretty iffy. "No, really, I wrote most of it! I swear!")

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Given your agreement on your participation, I think you two - well, ok, you - will come up with right words.

With no idea myself what those words might be, I'd opt for simple but clear. As in don't give away the house, but don't claim the house if it ain't yours.

So, we could get back to that if you'd like, soz, or have you already worked it out?

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We sort of have. Where things are now is:

Story, Illustrations and Design by Graphicdesigner Guy

[smaller font]Written by Sozobe Lastname

It's OK. I had a lot to do with the story, too. Missed Carlotta's post somehow, that looks good, thanks. We're at the point where we're sending out dummies to publishers (lots of research on which ones are most appropriate, yep), so will get to that in the next phase. (If there is a next phase -- hope so.)

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Good.

Not that you should listen to me, saying the word good, re publishing. But, good, from me.

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Writer/ illustrator attribution

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