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So Why Then Did Jews Reject Muhammad?

 
 
Fri 27 May, 2022 10:20 pm
They clearly rejected Jesus as the Messiah.

But here was a (1) warlord leader, (2) who rebuilt a temple on Temple Mount.

It occurred to me when I was watching a movie about Islam that if the Jews were so hellbent on only accepting a conquering warrior, here is an example. He doesn't eat pork, he is staunchly a non-Trinitarian monotheist, and on the surface is a perfect Jewish messiah.

Why didn't they like this guy either?
 
View best answer, chosen by bulmabriefs144
bulmabriefs144
 
  -2  
Sat 28 May, 2022 04:59 pm
Huh. Absolutely zero response.
0 Replies
 
PoliteMight
 
  -2  
Sat 28 May, 2022 06:23 pm
@bulmabriefs144,
Judaism, Christianity, and Islam describes religion that responds to the same god and have various forks of the same religion.

Judaism does not accept Christ because of the Roman empire usage of Christ. You have to think about the time-line and how life was via

Old Rome
New Rome
Post Rome
Renaissance
Dark Ages
Midevil Times
Enlightenment
Age of Exploration
Etc.

During through those hundreds, upon possible thousands of years Jews was still seen as the enemy ( even today for other reasons ). The Romans went from Evangelism into Christianity. With the biblical recordings alongside historical events. Most of these recordings itself could also be traced to various belief systems including the Greek idea of God or Roman idea of Goddesses ( which were all representations and mistranslations ).

Again Jews was attacked for not accepting Christ.

Islam on the other-hand did accept Christ as a prophet. Also through that transitional period much of Europe has much to be thank from Islamic scholars, students, and educators in terms of the Mathematics. But again Europe was much of a forced empire ( forcing people to get along ) and beyond that came ideas of ethnic cleansing.

Those Jews was about survival and the reality that they were enslaved and if any that came to power was in a type of Chinese-checkers warfare, just to preserve Jews within Europe and the world.

The reality we are in same stupidity from then.

Christian X ( Being consistent of the Roman Empire and Greeks ) v. Judiasm X ( Being between Africa, and Asia ) v. Islamic X ( Ottoman Empire consisting of trade routes like the Silk Road ), v Han X ( Mainland China empire ).

It is like Chinese-Checkers ( that game we played as children ).
.....................................................

Again

Judaism rejects anything that is Rome including Christ because many of the recordings and writings are questionable along with the fact that Islam accepts Christ as a prophet.

That being said beyond the Judo-Christian age, many modern Jews do accept Christ being real, but again it is a problem with education ( brainwashing ) rather then accepting Muhammad. So it would make sense not to accept Muhammad as a prophet. Especially with the history involved.

Muhammad came to "power" only when a city was under attack. If those leaders knew what they were doing then he would have not came to any form of military leadership at all.

You have to look at young Muhammad and what he was exposed to.
You have to look at any history of religion in general.
You have to think what was going through his mind.

A great example is that film "Life of Pie". The kid was exposed to so many religions, and so many advances and changes of society around him. Put that into your mind and then put the fact that whatever Muhammad was doing ( actually gaining followers ) .

Again parts of Islam existed before Muhammad.
.............

Do not look at Muhammad and the sword. That was an accident. That was somebody falling into power due to circumstances. Look at Muhammad the seeker of truth. Look at him like Mosses, Jesus, Abraham, Elisha, Joseph, or any other prophet.
bulmabriefs144
 
  -2  
Sat 28 May, 2022 10:03 pm
@PoliteMight,
I'm not convinced I agree with that premise though.

While the Western world is influenced by Rome, the Muslims are actually thoroughly un-Western. Oh sure, they pretend to be modern, and pretend to be just like Christian but they have basically nothing to do with Christianity. They're not governed by Rome, in orher words. They're not influenced by the Christian message. They are anti-science (most of them consider it heresy, and steal credit for inventions instead) to the extent where they believe that the sun sets in a pool of water, they still believe in magic and djinn, and have a very non-Western view of the world that hasn't budged in 1400 years. You may object to this, but what you've likely seen is taqiyya, smokescreen. Muslims pretending to be more civilized than they are. Further, Muhammad never at any point claimed to be Jesus. Though some Jews might have thought he was THEIR Messiah.

My theory is that this is exactly why the Jews rejected Muhammad. Muhammad was a camel trader, and got most of his religious training secondhand. The problem with secondhand knowledge is that you're at all trying to defraud or trick people, claiming to be their Messiah will not work. The holes in your story begin to add up, they know that Moses wasn't a Muslim, and that Isaac not Ishmael was put to be sacrificed. That and the fact that Jews were probably beginning to hear stories from other Jews of invasion and slaughter. Taqiyya meant he was caught in his lies.

As for Christianity, yes there does seem to be some rabbinic brainwashing. I've talked to Jews only to finally give up as they refused to question their rabbis.

But for Islam, it seems more like he was trying to trick them rather than sway them with new teachings. Much like Bahai did (it went to some groups, and claimed to be their chosen one).
All the same, I think it was a miracle that they did so at all, as here was a person who built a temple on Temple Mount, appeared to be a great warrior king, and other stuff. Almost like God said "Is this your standard for Messiah? Then I'll bring it to you (but you won't like it!)" He was basically a self-proclaimed messiah, and claimed he had the credentials they demanded. So the question remains about how they decided this though. It seems the sorta thing thar would trick all the Jews. And most of the Jewish sites like Chabad are oddly silent about it.
PoliteMight
 
  -2  
Sun 29 May, 2022 04:25 am
@bulmabriefs144,
Islam is the west and no different then Christianity and Judaism. During the fall of Rome it spread to South Europe. Italy and Spain have high influences of Islam. That being said many scholars ( Mathematicians, Architects, and other sciences ) was responsible for the Gothic architect that greatly influence many structures all the way into the post WWII era and contemporary dawn. Europe itself is and was highly diverse via Midevil Times as well. Only via ethnic cleansing ( 30,60, hundred years war ) and various political religious movements did Europe became less Islamic. That being said what you are seeing now is a result of modern refugees, tourism, and etc educational to living standards of acceptance.

Bare in mind the Roman Empire and Holy Catholic Roman Empire all fell and failed in time. Why? most of the citizens was being held hostage, and while there was freedom there was slavery. It is not what modern western cultures are based on. That being said the Enlightenment is where the modern world started via the age of exploration, like "The King and I", "Lois and Clark", "101 Knights", "Larence of Arabia", and "Japonese Style". Things like that influence modern culture. Blazes India contributed to most of the European beauty and mentality via food, clothing, and dance.

Seriously you full of $#$@#. No matter what religion you are your living up to day standards and many people of X religion or not are very up to date in methods of beliefs and functionality.

The Christian message has nothing to do with Rome. Christianity ( Catholicism ) was abused and religion itself was abused. Like the missionaries who bashed statues in India to missionaries who forcefully took over Hawaii and attempted to convert the more respectable Hawaiians while abusing the lesser. Even now religious activity is abusing people mentalities and ability to see clearly and function correctly. Please do not put religion next to Rome. It has nothing to do with that failure of an empire.

Again most of what you are saying is racism if not a mistake of information.
Well what about black magic ? What is the difference ? Same with Volcano being god among other ideas. Did you know people in the US can study witch craft? Literally I have seen many Witch-craft books going for sale for hundreds of dollars if not thousands. Books that looks like a child wrote them, to even bottles of souls. Seriously it takes all kinds of ________

The point being is that people in Judaism does not accept Christ and in Islam they accept Christ so Judaism rejects Islam.

Muhammad had many influences, what he did with his life in terms of income had nothing to do with the religious practice he promoted. He came to "military" power when the city called upon him during war time as a resolution. That being said his belief system spread. Him being a trader, and commanding peoples troops have absolutely ( positively ) nothing to do with Islam at all but the result of dealing with human nonsense like money and war. Ignoring that factor and actually focusing on his before and beyond that is method of thinking you should have..

A Rabbi is similar to a Priest. All men are considered to become a type of Rabbi. Again this is not true for the modern world but many do practice this.
The problem is that your not understanding how Judaism ( not all ) differs from Christianity ( not all ) or Islam ( not all ) functionality.

In most cases ( lesser ) many Jews literally leave their flocks and associates with the gentiles and then return to raise families within their community.
In other cases many people are not welcome to return to their communities despite being welcome back into their homes or raising families to live in.
You need a room of Jews of different generations to understand this.

Chabad movement is where Jewish people were pushed into the idea removing themselves from the gentiles ( non-Jews ) and keeping link to anybody from a Jewish upbringing to later recruit them in order to produce ideal pure Jewish families. It is literally segregation of Jews from gentiles, and is the reason why neighbors are messed up. Basically racism via using Judaism as a crutch.
bulmabriefs144
 
  -3  
Sun 29 May, 2022 05:33 am
@PoliteMight,
No, that's what they're eager to tell us Westerners.

But it's not so. Islamic Shariah law is about 3000 years outdated, and behaves like the Magna Carta never existed.

Quote:
As for the thief, the male and the female, amputate their hands in recompense for what they earned (i.e. committed) as a deterrent from Allah.


When Christianity was busy telling the rest of the world that God's creation could be known and understood (there's a reason why the Western world excelled in science), and to drop silly superstition,
https://www.str.org/w/how-christianity-created-science-and-why-atheism-wouldn-t-have-
https://billmuehlenberg.com/2006/12/17/christianity-reason-and-the-rise-of-the-west/
Islam still to some extent believes in sorcery (and has punishment for it) today!
https://www.islamreligion.com/articles/5246/viewall/sorcery-in-islam/
In 2009, they still have people teaching that the west is successful because they practice sorcery.
https://www.thebereancall.org/content/sorcery-islamic-world
While the Western (Christian) world did what they could to abolish slavery, the Muslim world still has slavery. Today!
https://www.israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/24430

I am saying this not to mock them but to prove that they did nor follow any part of the Western tradition, and are not subject to the decisions of Rome. Rather most of their alliances seem to be with the Eastern world (during the Ottoman Empire, the East started with Muslim borders, and ending with China and such, calling the former the "Near East"). The point being, they are more closely aligned with the deeply religious theocratic structure of countries like Israel and Saudi Arabia (actually Saudi Arabia is a bad example, but you get the idea). Not Western at all, only pretends to be. Why then did the Middle East not accept Islam, particularly the Jews?

Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Sun 29 May, 2022 06:14 am
@bulmabriefs144,
bulmabriefs144 wrote:
Islamic Shariah law is about 3000 years outdated, and behaves like the Magna Carta never existed.
Before someone takes your claims seriously:
- Sharia is a body of religious law that forms part of the Islamic tradition
- Magna Carta was the basis for English common law. But already Henry II (1154-1189) established many features of common law, jury trial, legal uniformity by judicial circuits.

For the main part, the 63 clauses in Magna Carta do not deal with legal principles but instead relate to the regulation of feudal customs and the operation of the justice system. There are clauses on the granting of taxes, towns and trade, the extent and regulation of the royal forest, debt, the Church and the restoration of peace.

Sharia acts as a code for living that all Muslims should adhere to, including prayers, fasting and donations to the poor.


Just to mention, too: the first modern Western legal system and the oldest continuously functioning legal system in the West is Canon law.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Sun 29 May, 2022 06:27 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Agreed, the Magna Carta is an English document, it's got **** all to with America, and when a creature like Bulmabriefs talks about it, it makes it sound dirty.

You're also right that Henry II also codified already existing Saxon laws, but it's a bit complicated and requires more than a two word response.
bulmabriefs144
 
  -3  
Sun 29 May, 2022 06:29 am
@Walter Hinteler,
The point being that Muslims would wholly agree with the sentiment that a monarch is absolute, and the citizens have no rights. Therefore it predates such a law. You can similarly predate all other legal manuscripts, until you get back to Code of Hammurabi or Lex Talionis.

Arm severing for thieves?

The Quran is not a document influenced by Western culture.
Walter Hinteler
  Selected Answer
 
  4  
Sun 29 May, 2022 06:33 am
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:
Henry II also codified already existing Saxon laws, but it's a bit complicated and requires more than a two word response.
Sure, that's why I didn't mention Saxon law. (The Sachsenspiegel's Latin edition is known to have existed, but only fragmented chapters remain. Thus, we have to rely on the first comprehensive law book not in Latin, but in Middle Low German from about 1220.)
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  3  
Sun 29 May, 2022 06:52 am
@bulmabriefs144,
Bullshit, generalised, ignorant, racist bullshit.
PoliteMight
 
  -3  
Sun 29 May, 2022 04:23 pm
@bulmabriefs144,
There is no us or them $#@$$. It is the same god with slightly different belief systems. In my area I am surrounded by Islamic, Jewish, Hindu, Catholic, Protestants, Lutheran, etc neighbors nobody cares about that. Just respect my property, and privacy.

You need to get that low-life mentality out of your mind. Even modern day Hitler would put you in your place. Everybody has to get along.

Britain caused Iran to not be US friends. Britain caused Desert Storm to happen. Britain caused the 1982 oil crisis to occur. Britain released Hong Kong only for it to be dominated and taken over by China via force resulting in deaths. Britain caused the war of 1812 because of retaliation of the Boston Tea Market. Britain caused Gandhi to rise to power. Britain further more caused the formation of Pakistan and further more the problems that Egypt had to face dealing with Zionist Israel. All the while maintaining this clean happy go lucky cheery image displayed from media outside of gangster and pro Irish/Scottish rights movies. Yeah Britain caused Irish Terrorism to be a real thing. Britain invented the word Terrorism/Terrorist when in reality it was rebellion.

Beyond that USA and USSR ( Russia / Former federation ) to play a ball of back and forth with places like Afghanistan, Korea, Ukraine, and other nations.

Korea should be a Japanese influenced peaceful nation right now.
Ukraine should have just released all the journalists and keep a positive mental state.
Afghanistan and Iran should be like New York, Tokyo, Naples, Mulan France, or anywhere else that is diverse.

Most of the bs image of negative is caused by the planting of the flag by the British, and other European nations.

9/11 was inside job just to give the excuse to use force via Afganistan and Iraq should have never happen.

.......................................................................................................................

It is called the middle-east because of some white guys in Europe ( possible England ).

You believe in god then you also believe in anything else your senses do not access to. It is like saying "This coin prevents tigers from attacking me" do you see any tigers attacking me ? It is the same logic and notion.

Christianity has nothing to do with science. Roman Empire, ( especially the earlier Greeks ) was coming up with these ideas. Egypt, Myans, Aztechs, and even the Incas to far east Asia have shown access to technologies and ideas.

Most of the technology you see all came from the cradle of life and or was invented over time by various peoples.
0 Replies
 
jcboy
 
  3  
Mon 30 May, 2022 10:55 am
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

Bullshit, generalised, ignorant, racist bullshit.


Yep, watching a monkey playing with a Bic lighter would be more interesting and entertaining then reading posts from this clown Razz
izzythepush
 
  2  
Mon 30 May, 2022 10:58 am
@jcboy,
He's antiSemitic, Islamophobic and boasts of his association with convicted paedophiles.

Just repulsive.
PoliteMight
 
  -3  
Mon 30 May, 2022 12:06 pm
@izzythepush,
I know there are people out there with various views but we need to work with them in order to have a better tomorrow. We need to find the root of their view and not cast them into oblivion.

Like at one point I believed that Indian people was that it. However over time I had to learn they are not and their is a reason why American Orientalism ( art / culture movement ) in the west occurs. The fact that it is in plain sight. Now I see their are many people of many flags and various differences.

Like how somebody in the far-east ( via MMORPG ) basically told me they believed for the longest everybody in the USA owns a gun. Like something out of a drama like "Lexx" season 4. I had to explain to them that is not the absolute case.
izzythepush
 
  2  
Mon 30 May, 2022 12:17 pm
@PoliteMight,
You're no bloody different, first 'innocently' claiming Israel acts no differently than other white colonists, then going about Jewish money lenders.

And no, we don't need to work with such creatures, that's why we have a sense of smell.
PoliteMight
 
  -2  
Mon 30 May, 2022 01:20 pm
@izzythepush,
Zionist Israel is a problem for that area of the world. Zionist ( people who believed in a physical state of Judaism origin ) was going to make Timbuktu into neo-Israel but they shifted the site to Palestine. They started out innocent like via artists, craftsman, rich, and other people and was welcome. However things went south when Jews ( Europeans....white people ) was fleeing Hitler. They were turn back because they started to over-take the population of original people living there ( these are literally undocumented immigrants ). Zionist with support of the UN troops ( various nations ) took control over parts of Palestine and broke in the Israeli flag. Not even Palestine had a flag representing religion itself. It even caused bad blood between Egypt as well.

What else could have gone wrong? Again this was a plan by the rich and powerful influences of their time. Not for the poverty stricken or refugees before Hitler and after WWII. Literally hundreds if not thousands of WWII refugees was dump like trash into this area and given weapons and told to fight for their land. Many of them who was also loyal to Europe.

The result was the same as post Black Slavery in the United States. Segregation. They divided sides, built up walls, and called it victory and the marketing of Zionist Israel was that of the UN-Troops victory and a victory for the league of nations ( United Nations ) choices. It all look good on paper. Now every religion had a site.

Reality people even till this day live in horrors. They are discriminated beyond horror because of elderly people rotting in their graves for an idea. They are White people who are European. Who cares if somebody in their family practice Judaism.

Okay great Hitler almost wiped out the European Jewish population. Great now get these European people back to their respective nations and rebuild their lives.

No. They dump them like garbage across the globe thus accomplishing Hitlers goal of removing Jews from Germany.

.................

It was not peaceful.

...................

That is another discussion. Jewish Money Lenders ( Central Banking Party ) is the reason why people left Europe to escape the war debt from France and England. It is the sole reason why people in the United States have any hate for modern Jews.

IT IS EXTREMELY HARD TO ESCAPE THAT MENTALITY. However that being said I realize a method of selfishness, and stupidity, was put on the US people.

About bad experiences. People want to work hard and be normal and not be part of trash or filth and yet their is something preventing that
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  2  
Mon 30 May, 2022 03:14 pm
People like you are the reason it's next ti impossible to discuss the political situation in Israel and the Middle East.

When I first came on here I was called an anti Semite by the likes of Foofie and Oralloy just because I supported Palestinian self determination.

That didn't stop me talking about Palestinian rights.

Now, the mere mention of Israel attracts the most repulsive antiSemites with conspiracy theory bullshit lifted straight out of the Protocols of Zion, and no right thinking person wants to associate themselves with that disgusting ****.

https://able2know.org/topic/173822-438#post-7232384
PoliteMight
 
  -2  
Mon 30 May, 2022 04:04 pm
@izzythepush,
The term anti-semite nowadays used as an excuse. If this was real life and I was at work or home or outside enjoying a drink or meal I would drop the whole the thing.

However as US citizen or any nation that burnt tax dollars, man-power, and human lives on the physical nation of Zionist Israel has all the right to read, research, observe, and have an opinion.

Guess what? take the president of Poland. He is being called Anti-semetic because
1. He sign into law that sets back people from recovering property retaining to WWII.

He is absolutely correct. You can not step forward and say "I am a Jew and I want this property back for another Jew". You can say "This is my property from this time, I have the deed and paper-work". This makes sense.

People are tired of using their religion as a crutch called a minority. People of the world are tired of it.

You have Jews who literally ran a cult in South America, pushing for members to commit suicide.

https://www.jpost.com/Diaspora/Ultra-orthodox-Jewish-cult-raided-in-Guatemala-over-suspected-child-abuse-467800

Non-Jews, Practicing Jews, non-practicing Jews are tired of it. We are harvesting the problems that will not have a good end at all. We are fueling people to use other people as human shields for there wars and their so called ability to live.

People are tired. Just let everybody have a chance to be normal and live hand in hand. Not spew rubbish
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