Maya- energy- illution- and where's the powerplant.

Have you been drinking, Cyracuz?

No, I've been thinking... But both drinking and thinking leads to the same result. A dizzy head.

Organize your thoughts Cyracuz, that might lessen the headache. Also, have a cup of tea nearby. Why? I don't know, tea is always good...

You're the new wave of ommistic mystics.

Organize this, organize that. Thoughts come at their own good time, and to organize would be to lie.

But I'll try to clarify:

As I'm sitting here the sun comes into my room. Well, not really. If it did I'd be incinerated in a split second. It's only the sun's energy, the sunlight that comes into my room. So, I can say that it is the sun, and I can say that it is not. Both are equally true.

In the same way you can say about everything ( because everything is energy in some form or other) that it is god (read: everything and the interaction therein, omm), and at the same time it is not god. What I'm saying is that if there is energy, then there is a source. To deny god is to deny the source, and that is when the initial quote applies. "Only a fool accepts energy as the energetic".

If you look at it this way it becomes clear that the foundation of science is a blind trust in god. Before anything can be studied it needs to be there for studying. Scientists study atoms, but where do atoms come from? They have to come from somewhere.

I have been locked away in jail for some weeks now because I refused to serve in the military, and during that time I had good oportunity to think and write, wich I did. I just got out this morning. Now I'll edit some of it, and then I'll share with whoever is interested. It is relevant to the topic.

Cyracuz, Are you jesting or is that story true! Stunned. I was concerned about you.

Welcome back to the land of the living, Cyracuz. It is good to have the courage to stand up for one's principles.

As for your thesis, I tend to largely agree. The problem, really, is not ontology but semantics. Depending on one's definitions (semantics), to deny the existence of God is to deny one's own existence. I realize that there is a greater power (energy, if you will) operative in the universe which surpasses anything that the human mind is capable of understanding. There are self-professed atheists who agree with that. Their problem is also semantic -- they simply don't like the word 'God.'

Well letty, the part about jail is true. When it comes to the rest of it.. I don't know. Seems likely

But don't worry. I'm right as rain on a silent night. No big black guys named bubba in there waiting for me to drop the soap.

Merry andrew, atheism is the pride of ignorance. Atheists tend to define the word god so that it makes absolutely no sense. What I'm trying to do is to define it so that it does make sense in any context you put it in. Because in the end it is merely a word. So you're right, it is more about semantics. But we need to nail that part first in order to make up from down in anything.

What I was trying to show here was that there is a difference between the energy and the source. The ideas I am presenting here have their roots in krishna consiusness. Krishna is also a just a word. It means all-attractive, wich basically sums up all the qualities of "everything".

I can agree that the word god has too many false notions connected to it for it to be much use anywhere. But I am at a loss for what else to call it.

I use the word 'god', Cyrcuz, simply because it is such a simple word, so easy to say. Of course, what I mean by 'god' is probably completely different from what a devout Christian or Jew means by that word. (See? Semantics, again.) Most people who say they are atheists, who maintain that they believe in no god, really mean that they don't believe whatever it is that they were taught in church Sunday school when they were kids. But then you find them speaking confidently of 'the Big Bang' and Black Holes and quantum theory, as though these things could somehow exist independently, without a unifying energy source. It is this source, all pervasive, which exists, independent of space and time, that I call god. It's such a simple, short word.

It seems we are in agreement Merry Andrew. Well said.