Cloning

Re: Cloning

fdrhs wrote:

Is cloning Playing God?

Should a human being be your science experiment?

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I don't usually post a cut and paste; but this seems the more appropriate forum for this question:

How would you react if you cloned a human who, after being born naturally, displayed some terrible defect of health or character as a result of imperfect cloning, but had normal intelligence? What would you say to that person when they realized how they came to be?

I'm not commenting on the legal or theological implications; just what would you say?

Qwitcherbitchin Clonus
Yer a scientific bonus
And yer birth has made ya famous
(We're still workin on Uranus)

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ok
Thank you for your quick reply.

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Re: Cloning

fdrhs wrote:

Is cloning Playing God?

The way that human beings evolve is that they harness the environment, and make it work for them. If you did not realize it already, I do not believe in God. But, if you consider what is the generally accepted conception of a God, many things that we do in the normal course of events would be considered "playing God".

Using antibiotics, surgery and other medical procedures for the enhancing and prolonging of life

Using birth control

Heating and air conditioning our homes

Using technology to improve our lives

I think that you will catch my drift. If one were NOT to "play God", in the accepted sense of the term, one would be living like the primitives, at the mercy of any natural happening. Cloning is simply the next step in our evolution.

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Re: Cloning

Phoenix32890 wrote:

The way that human beings evolve is that they harness the environment, and make it work for them. If you did not realize it already, I do not believe in God. But, if you consider what is the generally accepted conception of a God, many things that we do in the normal course of events would be considered "playing God".

Using antibiotics, surgery and other medical procedures for the enhancing and prolonging of life

Using birth control

Heating and air conditioning our homes

Using technology to improve our lives

I think that you will catch my drift. If one were NOT to "play God", in the accepted sense of the term, one would be living like the primitives, at the mercy of any natural happening. Cloning is simply the next step in our evolution.

In what way is heating and air conditioning on the same level as cloning?

If you screw up your air conditioning installation and sweat a bit more, so what?

If you screw up your cloning attempt, you may produce a human who will be forced to live with whatever mistakes may have escaped notice of the scientists who 'created' him. And what if the mistakes include some deficiency in character like sociopathy? Who will be responsible?

Will it be the individual who can simply argue he murdered all those folks because Dr. Natas forgot some little snippet of genetic material. "Dr. Natas made me do it."

Or should we blame his parents, Mr. and Mrs. Beaker, who raised him from birth in their suburban laboratory? "I came from a broken flask."

Legal and theological considerations aside, cloning is an extremely scary procedure.

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Sure, it's scary. Any new technology is, especially one with serious ramifications. I would expect that ethical scientists will go very slowly on this. But if the pioneers in the world were not afraid to experiment, we might all still be living in caves.

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If cloning is playing God then so are medicines, operations etc yet we seem to be ok with them.

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Put yourself in the position of an individual produced by cloning. The chances of your having a serious flaw are extremely high.

How would you feel about the circumstances of your conception?

I would vomit.

I would vomit often.

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material girl wrote:

If cloning is playing God then so are medicines, operations etc yet we seem to be ok with them.

The gulf between medical procedures designed to help those already living and the creation of beings solely for scientific or 'evolutionary' advancement is huge.

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But medicine is 'playing' with a natural life.
Cloning is 'playing with a life.

How would you feel about the circumstances of your conception?
Not too happy but Id imagine its up there with being concieved in the back of a car whilst being as peed as a newt, like Id imagine, a high percentage of people have been concieved.

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Ok, suppose I'm the clone and you're the scientist:
Console me over my realization that I can't have a normal life because of my loathsome deformity.

Then tell me you are glad you took the responsibility and all I have to worry about are the consequences.

Talk about a wrongful birth suit!

OH; are clones entitled to equal protection under the law?

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Re: Cloning

Phoenix32890 wrote:

fdrhs wrote:
Is cloning Playing God?

The way that human beings evolve is that they harness the environment, and make it work for them. If you did not realize it already, I do not believe in God. But, if you consider what is the generally accepted conception of a God, many things that we do in the normal course of events would be considered "playing God".

Using antibiotics, surgery and other medical procedures for the enhancing and prolonging of life

Using birth control

Heating and air conditioning our homes

Using technology to improve our lives

I think that you will catch my drift. If one were NOT to "play God", in the accepted sense of the term, one would be living like the primitives, at the mercy of any natural happening. Cloning is simply the next step in our evolution.

Hi Phoenix,

Not one of these even comes close to a good analogy.

Heating and air? How is that even remotely like producing a human being thru experimentation? Why didn't you mention inventing Velcro?

Birth control? Birth control does the OPPOSITE of creating a human being. I kinda thought that was the point of it, anyway.

Antibiotics and surgery? Do we make people sick on purpose so that we can test surgical techniques and medicines on them?

Human beings should not be your science experiment. If you want to dissect a frog, go right ahead. At least you wait til he's dead. You want to experiment with a living person.

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Cloning, once perfected, is just another way of having a baby.

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edgarblythe wrote:

Cloning, once perfected, is just another way of having a baby.

Brain transplants, once perfected, will be just another way of becoming educated.

Surely you would volunteer to advance science?

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You have to be more specific to elicit a response, real life.

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Most of you folks are missing the point of what real and I are trying to say. How many broken bodies and psyches are you prepared to leave bobbing (perhaps literally) in the wake of this wave of technology?

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neologist wrote:

Most of you folks are missing the point of what real and I are trying to say. How many broken bodies and psyches are you prepared to leave bobbing (perhaps literally) in the wake of this wave of technology?

It is very interesting. Some people are appalled by the entire idea of cloning, because it might not be perfect, and might produce defective humans.

On the other hand, many of these same people are horrified that a woman, after her amniocentesis shows severe defects in the fetus that she is carrying, chooses to abort the pregnancy, and are attempting to deny the woman that right.

How do you explain that?

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I can't explain that, Phoenix.

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It's a ridiculous worry. They will not clone a human being before the safety concerns are as minimal as any other way of making women pregnant. If some nut chose to attempt it sooner than that, the world would disavow the scientists responsible. Nobody is advocating unsafe methods for humans.

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