6
   

What was the leading cause of death for law enforcement last year?

 
 
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 26 Oct, 2021 03:36 pm
@bobsal u1553115,
This cartoon is strange, maybe even disturbing.

The joke here is that the police officer is now in the position of George Floyd. This officer is on his back, clearly not a threat, and being forced by the nurse to be jabbed violently with a needle.

I don't really get the message of this cartoon?

Is this a vengeance fantasy (yay! with the vaccine police officers will find out what it is like to be a black teenager?).

Am I supposed to feel sympathy for the police officer here? Is forced vaccination to be seen as an act of violence?

I really don't get it.
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 06:59 am
Federal judge rejects Southwest Airlines pilots' request to block vaccine mandate
Source: CNBC

A federal judge in Texas denied Southwest Airlines pilots union’s request to temporarily block a vaccine mandate for employees, which is a requirement under new government rules.

Dallas-based Southwest Airlines must require staff to be fully vaccinated against Covid-19 by Dec. 8 unless they receive a religious or medical exemption, according to rules for federal contractors that the Biden administration issued last month.

Southwest and other major airlines like Delta, United and American fly federal employees, U.S. mail and provide other services to the government.

The Southwest Airlines Pilots Association, which represents some 9,000 aviators, sought a temporary restraining order against the mandate. The union had argued that the mandate, as well as other Covid-related company policies, needed to be negotiated with the union.

Read more: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/26/federal-judge-rejects-southwest-airlines-pilots-request-to-block-vaccine-mandate.html


This judge is Barbara M. Lynn, a Clinton nominee to the Northern District of Texas.
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 07:05 am
@bobsal u1553115,
Damn Bobsal!

This is a story of a union losing a court case. The pilot's union got screwed in this case.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 07:05 am
@maxdancona,
Seriously? Because those four murdering cops were trying to aid George Floyd and that cartoon nurse is attempting to murder that cartoon cop, right.

Equal, right?

What do you hear from Hawkeye X these days?
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 07:08 am
@bobsal u1553115,
Huh???

What does the Southwest Pilot's union (the union in the story you just posted that was resisting vaccine mandates) have to do with George Floyd?

This thread keeps getting sillier.
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 07:20 am
@maxdancona,
Though not as silly as your claims and argument. The courts are backing masking and vax mandates, you and those snowflake cops need to get over it.
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 07:25 am
@bobsal u1553115,
Yes, in the Southwest Airlines case you are right.

The Union lost its case. The Southwest Airlines management won. Go Management! The court decided that the corporate employer does have the right in this case to force its workers to undergo a medical procedure even if they don't want it.

This is a loss for the union. Whether you think this is a good thing or not is up to you.

0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 07:49 am
What I am really asking for is intellectual honesty. If you are going to push a policy, then you should accept the consequences of your position

I am against vaccine mandates. I am particularly against vaccine mandates being enforced by employers. I am fully vaccinated, but I feel strongly that is my personal choice and none of my employers business.

I accept the consequences of my position. This will mean higher risk of covid, and very likely will result in more deaths. I will argue that this risk is lower than people are saying (and we can have this argument). But I accept that my position will probably lead to more deaths. I own that.

All I am asking is that you likewise accept the consequences of your position. Stop pretending like this is a simple issue. It is not.

Vaccine mandates enforced by employers are opposed by many unions. It leads to workers being fired. It can hurt employers economically (which is why my employer has stated firmly they will never have a vaccine mandate).

You are arguing that we should give corporations the power to force their employees to undergo a medical procedure against their will, and to fire employees who don't comply.

If you stand by this position with all of the consequences, then you have respect. But don't pretend that this is an simple issue and for God's sake, stop brushing the contradictions, difficulties and issues under the rug.

This is not the easy issue you are pretending it is.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 07:52 am
@bobsal u1553115,
It is a fact that many unions are opposing vaccine mandates.

You yourself posted an article about the Southwest Pilot's union opposing vaccine mandates.

And yet you still can't admit that many unions are opposing vaccine mandates.

This is the very definition of cognitive dissonance. All I am asking is that you admit that this is not an easy issue, and that there are real consequences for the position that you are defending.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  0  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 09:14 am
NO ******* UNION HAS TAKEN AN OFFICIAL ANTI VAX POSITION, WHETHER THEY HAVE OFFERED ASSISTANCE TO FIRED MEMBERS OR NOT.

NO COMPANY THAT HAS FIRED EMPLOYEES OVER VAX OR MASK, UNION REPRESENTED OR NOT, HAS BEEN COMPELLED TO REHIRE FIRED EMPLOYEES.

YOUR OPINION OTHERWISE IS PURELY YOUR OPINION. WHY DO YOU CONTINUE TO CONFUSE YOUR OPINION WITH FACT?

CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW?
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 09:36 am
@bobsal u1553115,
Yes, you are correct. Although, I think you are missing the point.

Many unions are against vaccine mandates. No unions (I know of) are against vaccines.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 09:37 am
@bobsal u1553115,
The question is this...

Should corporations be able to force their workers to prove their vaccination status and fire workers who don't comply?

I would appreciate if you could answer this question "yes" or "no" directly. Hopefully you can understand why many unions (who represent worker rights) are opposed to this.
Mame
 
  0  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 10:42 am
@maxdancona,
Yes, of course they should. It's their damn company. If Southwest decides that all employees must be fluent in English and Spanish, offer courses and give a timeline, that's their right. It's also their right to notify of firings for anyone not willing to learn both languages. I think proper notice would be required for the institution of any new rule, with consequences clearly set out, no matter the rule.
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 11:12 am
@Mame,
How far are you willing to go with that, Mame? Is that a general principle, or just a special case for Covid?

Does a company have the right force its employees to get birth control and fire employees who don't comply?

(I am trying to make a distinction between the "companies can do whatever they want" argument, and the "covid is really bad" argument. These are two very different arguments.)
Glennn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 12:29 pm
@maxdancona,
If I have natural immunity, and they ignore that fact, then the employer should have to accept responsibility for a needless injection. That seems fair.
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 12:39 pm
@Glennn,
Glennn wrote:

If I have natural immunity, and they ignore that fact, then the employer should have to accept responsibility for a needless injection. That seems fair.


Just to make it clear... I am not making an anti-vax argument. I think the anti-vaxxers are insane. I am not going to get into the anti-vaxxer bullshit here.

I am arguing against vaccine mandates. That being said, since I am arguing against forced vaccinations, than this case would be covered (even though medical experts suggest that you should still get the vaccine).

My girlfriend had covid. She had one shot (out of two) before she contracted the virus. She is fine now, but she had several miserable days. She is planning to get the second shot (after a waiting period). She will do this because that is what her doctor told her to do based on science and medical expertise. My girlfriend is not an idiot.

That being said, human beings have the right to be idiots. Doctors can't force their patients to take their advice, even if their advice is medically necessary. Corporations shouldn't be able to force their employees to take their medical advice either. That is what I am arguing.
Glennn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 12:46 pm
@maxdancona,
Quote:
even though medical experts suggest that you should still get the vaccine

Are you aware of the many studies showing that natural immunity is superior to the experimental injection?

I believe I've posted a link to every one of them! So, what does logic dictate in this instance? How can one avoid being an idiot in light of the facts?

Can you post a link to the study used to convince your doctor to ignore all of the the other studies that show it for what it is?
roger
 
  2  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 12:57 pm
@Glennn,
You can prove you have been vaccinated. How to you prove a natural immunity?
Glennn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 01:00 pm
@roger,
Anyone who has ever tested positive for covid will know that they're immune.

Wouldn't it be great if someone would let the people in on this little tidbit of information?
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2021 01:02 pm
@Glennn,
1) The advantage of the vaccine is that you don't have to ever contract covid.

2) Experts are suggesting that even if you have suffered covid, the vaccine is still recommended.

If you are suggesting I go out and make myself sick... you are nuts. I am defending your right to be crazy (and I hope you are grateful for that). But, I still think you are crazy.
 

 
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