11
   

Afterlife?

 
 
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 03:52 am
@bulmabriefs144,
bulmabriefs144 wrote:


Much of religion is a blind guess, yes.


Much?

What part of religion is not a blind guess?

The spelling of the word?

Quote:
But there are certain laws of logic that have to be observed, or we cannot take you seriously. Suppose again we are talking about a bakery. All of a sudden, the ummmm baker's union is on strike. The manager and a few scabs try to bake the bread, but they all get killed in the fight (and this is why you should hate unions, all that delicious bread is not being made). We know that bread doesn't bake itself. Likewise, you can have a bakery in addition to tables and chairs (a place where the universe is ). You can dry ingredients, wet ingredients, starters, and preservatives (physical matter and subatomic stuff). You can have rolling pins, measuring cups, mixing bowls, even electric whisks (the laws of the universe such as gravity, magnetism, etc).
But none of that does any good if there aren't any bakers!!! But, you say, surely bread can arise spontaneously from the flour being left on the counter. If flour was able to stay in a jar with not reaction, more likely weevils (entropy) will do away with the flour long before it gets the chance to spontaneously turn into bread.

It may not have to be a conventional notion of God here. For the record, I am also willing to accept:
1. An unknown Will of Magic, or Force.
2. Human beings created themselves. Then everything else.
3. UFOs from another universe created our universe, and other UFOs created their universe, and other other UFOs created their universe...
4. Universe was eternal, it had not creator, but there was some sort of driving force.
5. Reapers or fairies run all mechanistic forces of the universe.
6. Not one God but many gods.
7. The Earth was constructed as a model. Also the meaning of life is 42.


Thank you for sharing what YOU are willing to accept.

If you are going to argue that the only stuff that can be true are the things YOU are willing to accept, please do so.

I will consider it without laughing, if I am able.

Quote:
I am not willing to accept a creator-free creation.


Then stop arbitrarily calling it a "creation."

The only reason you are looking for the "creator" of this "creation" is because you are arbitrarily defining it as a creation.

Quote:
That is stupid.


I agree...so stop doing it.


Quote:
And anyone trying to sell me on that is either also stupid, or a willfully ignorant con-artist trying to deconvert people because they hated Catholic school. So which are you?


I do not do a lot of hating; I am not stupid; I am not a con-artist trying to "deconvert" people (whatever that means).

Although I was raised Catholic, I did not go to Catholic school. I did eventually learn to serve Mass, though, and, as an adult, I once served Mass in St. Peter's Basilica in the Vatican.

I have nothing against people who insist there is at least one god...nor against people who insist there are no gods. I have nothing against people who insist it is more likely that there are no gods...or against people who insist it is more likely that there is at least one.

BUT...the only thing all of those people are doing is sharing blind guesses, because there is no way one can come to any of those conclusions by logic, or reason, or science, or math.

You are doing what hard atheists are doing...trying to sell your guesses as some sort of reasonable logic.

They are all fails.
izzythepush
 
  3  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 04:02 am
@Frank Apisa,
What Bulmabrief fails to point out is that if nobody can bake, then why are people going to all the time and effort in milling flour in the first place?
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 06:13 am
@farmerman,
You are welcome to ignore me if what i say bothers you.
Frank wisely did so when he had no answer either.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 07:40 am
@Leadfoot,
I dont lack for scientific answers, I tend to READ alot, you should try.

When your arguments boil down to a single baseless proposition I can understand why folks may not wish to deal with you. I surely woouldnt try to teach partial derivatives to my cat.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 07:45 am
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:

Then stop arbitrarily calling it a "creation."
small "c" Frank, it can be the origin of life but that sounds a bit stuffy. Just as computer folks have absconded with many of our tim tested words, "creation" doesnt automatically defer to some religious dogma.

Religion has no evidence at all. Science has evidence on the key questions of lifes first appearances .To deny that is merely accepting a lack of knowledge as important input, when a lack of knowledge should really spur us into doeing our homework
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 08:10 am
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:

Quote:

Then stop arbitrarily calling it a "creation."
small "c" Frank, it can be the origin of life but that sounds a bit stuffy. Just as computer folks have absconded with many of our tim tested words, "creation" doesnt automatically defer to some religious dogma.


My comment was to Bulma, FM. He calls what we humans call "the universe" a creation...and then attempts to identify a creator.

Suggesting this has to be a creation...is as problematic as suggesting there is a creator.

I agree that the word "creation" does not defer to any religious dogma. But I do think ASSUMING what we humans call "the universe" to be a creation...creates a problem no matter that we agree on that.

Quote:
Religion has no evidence at all.


Religion has no UNAMBIGUOUS evidence. If there happens to be a GOD or gods...EVERYTHING is evidence of that GOD or gods.

There just is no way we can know.

Some people guess there is a GOD...or are gods. Fine...let 'em. Just as we should let people who guess there are no gods...be fine with us.



Quote:
Science has evidence on the key questions of lifes first appearances .To deny that is merely accepting a lack of knowledge as important input, when a lack of knowledge should really spur us into doeing our homework


In a way...YES. Science has traced back lots of things...and can say authoritative things about first appearances of life. But science cannot say that no gods were involved.

The question is still best answered by, "I do not know."

Obviously, it can also be answered with, "I do not know if any gods exist, but if they do, they set evolution in motion and allowed it to work out the kinks on its own."

Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 02:25 pm
@farmerman,
I though you were done talking with me. You are obviously conflicted.

At least Frank was a man of his word, as much as i wish he would make an exception for me.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 05:09 pm
@Leadfoot,
so im not allowed to interject wherever i please?


farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sat 19 Jun, 2021 05:13 pm
@Frank Apisa,
an Intelligent Designer who obviously needs some more tutelage in orgnic chem.
i remember tht Ledfoot or Lymn hd tried to insert a hypothesis that the Intelligent designer had purposely made evolution look like it was done by some moron so we would have to keep guessing.
I thought that about as funny as we could have in such a discussion
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 01:03 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
I dont lack for scientific answers,

Sure you do. You seldom if ever offer knowledge or wisdom. All you really offer is childish name-calling.

It's quite tedious.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 01:04 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
so im not allowed to interject wherever i please?

You are allowed. But since you never do much more than insult people, people don't tend to welcome those interjections.

People here prefer intelligent discussion to such name-calling.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 01:07 pm
@Leadfoot,
Leadfoot wrote:
At least Frank was a man of his word, as much as i wish he would make an exception for me.

I suspect that you'd not like it much if he made an exception.

If he is so unhinged that he puts people on ignore for trivial disagreement, then he would surely be subjecting people to savage name-calling if he couldn't put them on ignore.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 02:14 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
If he is so unhinged that he puts people on ignore for trivial disagreement, then he would surely be subjecting people to savage name-calling if he couldn't put them on ignore.

Frank doesn't strike me as so unhinged as he does hypersensitive. I'm just not sure what it is he's so sensitive about. It must have been a deep wound whatever it was.

It's farmer that I'd welcome an ignore from. His constant bleating lie of he/science KNOWING the origin of biological life is tiresome. Even CI's constant repetition of "There is no God" is less irksome. And closer to what their real hope is.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 04:29 pm
@Leadfoot,
Youre just trying tocover yr ignorance with some kind of justification. I never said I KNOW what happened. I did say that "we hve evidence about certain things that can be proved to have happened"

Yet you stubbornly involve anything to do with organic chem and molcullar bio , paleo, ages of the planet and defined occurences like the "great Oxygenation vent". Snowball Earth, and preEdiacaran life.

Genetics allows us to understand the mechanics of much evolution. It has NO bearing on the origins of life .
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 04:31 pm
@oralloy,
\
Quote:

Sure you do. You seldom if ever offer knowledge or wisdom. All you really offer is childish name-calling

Maybe Im talking too much in detail for you to understand??
and its not about guns or games. As far as "childish name calling" you oughta look in the mirror to see what a name caller looks like

farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 04:37 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:

People here prefer intelligent discussion to such name-calling.
When most folks (like you) have no clue what Ive talked about, I do expect them to use insults. Most however (hen they know of what they are speaking). Dont lead with insults like you o, they try to make an intelligent argument.
Do you know th importance of the paleochemistry of purines/ pyrimidines?

I thought so.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 04:41 pm
@farmerman,
You're lying. I do not lead with insults. And you do.

I make intelligent arguments. And you don't.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 04:42 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
Maybe Im talking too much in detail for you to understand??

You aren't capable of that.


farmerman wrote:
As far as "childish name calling" you oughta look in the mirror to see what a name caller looks like

I only engage in name-calling when I'm retaliating for name-calling that was directed at me first.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 05:41 pm
@farmerman,
Farmer to oralloy:
Quote:
When most folks (like you) have no clue what Ive talked about, I do expect them to use insults.

Is there anything you won't lie about?

I have never seen oralloy reply with an insult without being slandered first.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 20 Jun, 2021 06:02 pm
@Leadfoot,
he just , on another page admitted his propensity to insult. In this thread I hadnt been really adressing anything with him before he started on me. I really dont give a damn because Insult is a high art, the Huxleys were , all of the line, were as good at insult as they were scientists.

I know I get on Ollie's nerves cause he always quick to try his own kommen zurichs which are usually devoid of anything of quality or thought.

 

Related Topics

 
  1. Forums
  2. » Afterlife?
  3. » Page 13
Copyright © 2021 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.05 seconds on 07/27/2021 at 01:00:17