The Derek Chauvin Trial

@edgarblythe,

edgarblythe wrote:

Georgia Supreme Court rules that you CAN use force, and damage property, to resist an unlawful arrest
https://www.thenorthstar.com/p/georgia-supreme-court-rules-that

Unless you believe that the police officer that is falsely arresting you means to murder or rape you (or any similar level of crime), I advise letting them arrest you and having your lawyer sort it out.

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Wtf are you talking about?
Who has lynched a police officer?
Who have the police accused of trying to lynch a police officer?

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@oralloy,

If police aren’t doing anything wrong, their recordings will show that. Then, like you say, the lawyers can sort it out.

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@snood,

But, only if the cameras are turned on and available.

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@oralloy,

Quote:

Unless you believe that the police officer that is falsely arresting you means to murder or rape you (or any similar level of crime), I advise letting them arrest you and having your lawyer sort it out.

While it is good that you can lawfully resist and unlawful arrest, and it appears even unlawful use of force...I agree on this quote. The other option is way to risky for a person in the US. Plus I don't know of many cases where people successfully resist, so it also seems pointless / achieves nothing at the time.

Besides, if they are wrong, you can ask for a payout.

This didn't help George Floyd, but fact is, none of it would have.

2 Replies

@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

Quote:
Unless you believe that the police officer that is falsely arresting you means to murder or rape you (or any similar level of crime), I advise letting them arrest you and having your lawyer sort it out.
While it is good that you can lawfully resist and unlawful arrest...I agree on this quote. The other option is way to risky for a person in the US. Plus I don't know of many cases where people successfully resist, so it also seems pointless / achieves nothing at the time.

Besides, if they are wrong, you can ask for a payout.

this didn't help George Floyd, but none of it would have.

That part where you said you don’t know of many cases where people successfully resist? The only ones who can’t count on resisting and living to talk about it are black.

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Judge Cahill has now postponed the trial of the three accomplices until March of 2022. He says because of the federal charges that were brought against them, it would make more sense to let them stand trial in federal court first.

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/13/996562538/mpls-trial-for-former-police-officers-lane-thao-and-kueng-is-pushed-back-to-2022

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@snood,

I'm not so certain about that, for a number of reasons:
- there aren't many numbers to draw a conclusion from, and
- the only people likely to sue for such are rich/educated/connect people. (and we both that here the percentages favour white people)
- any statistics would then have to be looked at in terms of police interactions %

I suspect that you may be mostly correct, but am not certain about it.

However, it is still moot, as I agree with oralloys advice here - have your lawyer sort it out afterwards (and yes, I understand I just pointed out wealth/education/connectedness as an issue. It is not a perfect world by any stretch of the immagination)

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@snood,

I didn't read this the last time it was posted, as I presumed the Federal stuff was a civil law suit of some type. I presumed you couldn't be tried criminally at different levels for what is essentially the same set of actions - the actions that lead to the killing of George Floyd.

Does anyone know the answer to this? Am I not reading it correctly?

2 Replies

@vikorr,

You can be tried at both the state and federal level for the same act if that act is a crime in both jurisdictions.

If you are acquitted in your first trial, they can use the second trial to try again.

If you are convicted in your first trial, I don't think they are allowed to try you a second time and double your sentence. If I'm wrong and such double convictions are allowed for the same act (I've never heard of such a thing happening), the sentences would have to be served concurrently.

1 Reply

@snood,

snood wrote:

Wtf are you talking about?
Who has lynched a police officer?

Black Lives Matter has lynched a number of police officers.

1 Reply

@snood,

snood wrote:

If police aren't doing anything wrong, their recordings will show that. Then, like you say, the lawyers can sort it out.

Unfortunately, right and wrong doesn't matter to Black Lives Matter lynch mobs.

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@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

Besides, if they are wrong, you can ask for a payout.

Qualified immunity prevents payouts unless the violation is grievous.

There is of course an effort (that I support) to abolish qualified immunity.

vikorr wrote:

This didn't help George Floyd, but fact is, none of it would have.

"Not resisting arrest, and instead allowing the police to put him in the back of the squad car" would have worked for him.

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@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

I'm not so certain about that, for a number of reasons:
- there aren't many numbers to draw a conclusion from, and
- the only people likely to sue for such are rich/educated/connect people. (and we both that here the percentages favour white people)
- any statistics would then have to be looked at in terms of police interactions %

I suspect that you may be mostly correct, but am not certain about it.

However, it is still moot, as I agree with oralloys advice here - have

your lawyer sort it out afterwards (and yes, I understand I just pointed out wealth/education/connectedness as an issue. It is not a perfect world by any stretch of the immagination)

Just so I’m clear, are you saying you’re not sure if white people could successfully resist police more easily than black people? In this United States?

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Thank you for the clarification

0 Replies

@vikorr,

vikorr wrote:

I didn't read this the last time it was posted, as I presumed the Federal stuff was a civil law suit of some type. I presumed you couldn't be tried criminally at different levels for what is essentially the same set of actions - the actions that lead to the killing of George Floyd.

Does anyone know the answer to this? Am I not reading it correctly?

They wouldn’t be charged with the same crimes on the federal level.

For instance, the state might try a cop for assaulting someone in custody. The feds can charge the same cop with depriving that person of their constitutional rights.

Same event. Different charges.

0 Replies

@oralloy,

oralloy wrote:

snood wrote:
Wtf are you talking about?
Who has lynched a police officer?

Black Lives Matter has lynched a number of police officers.

Show me one.

1 Reply

@snood,

snood wrote:

Show me one.

Darren Wilson.

1 Reply

@snood,

I think we may be confusing terms.

Successfully resisting can mean:
- resisting and on the spot being successful (I don't know of any cases of these, other than people who escaped, in which case we don't know if it was lawful or not)
- resisting, being arrested, and going to court to show that it was unlawful, and therefore being 'successful' in resisting arrest
- some other definition that an individual thinks of when they think of what 'successfully resisting' means to them.

-------------------------------------------------

In the 2nd one - within the limited number that exist - I presume there will be a great deal more examples of white people than black people ( don't know the numbers or the percentage)

------------------------------------------------
Numbers can't give a complete picture - only percentages of successful resistances do that. The % of successful resistances requires other calculations to be conducted, including population %'s, interaction %'s, equal context calculations (eg comparing poor with poor then dividing by colour).

It is this where I don't know what the outcomes would be. I've no doubt they will be weighted in favour of white people - I just don't know by how much, nor whether the numbers (of people successfully resisting) are significant enough to enable an accurate statistical outcome.

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@oralloy,

Darren Wilson was tried and cleared of any charges. Is that what you call lynching?

Or was it like lynching even to try him?

Maybe you need a better descriptive word for what you’re trying to say. If someone gets lynched, they die.

1 Reply

The Derek Chauvin Trial

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