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The Derek Chauvin Trial

 
 
hightor
 
  0  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 05:16 am
@glitterbag,
glitterbag wrote:
Yuppie????? Wasn't that a slang term in the 80's??

He's just an immigrant who learned English by watching old re-runs and he's not quite attuned to contemporary USAmerican culture.

He also participated in the Jan 6 insurrection!
longjon wrote:

Today was wild. I experienced tear gas for the first time, I saw people shot, and I can definitely confirm that Antifa was in DC causing violence for news cameras.


I've asked him repeatedly to show us some pics from the event, maybe a selfie from inside the Capitol, but he's grown strangely reticent about proving his masculinity and patriotism. Think maybe he's really just a snowflake?

I notice the thumb monkey was active last night. It's encouraging to see poor little longjon getting so many upvotes!
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 06:29 am
This from Twitter:
There's a reason they are valorizing George Floyd as some kind of martyr, rather than depicting him as the victim he was. This entire process is about exceptionalizing these events & these people, to separate your outrage about it from the everyday, violent realities of policing.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  0  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 06:48 am
I agree about the urgent need to see Chauvin’s conviction as a momentary skirmish win in a centuries old war, and not overburden its significance as if it, in itself means change.

(To keep perspective - Yesterday, as we were hearing the Chauvin case result, there was a 15 year old black girl gunned down by police in Ohio.)

But I don’t think it serves any good purpose to make the various shrines to George Floyd out to be some kind of nefarious plot to keep the people ignorant. Some people are just marking history the best way they know how. In this age of instant celebrity and empty fame, it’s a natural phenomenon for some (maybe politically unsophisticated) people to make a folk hero out of the victim.
0 Replies
 
revelette3
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 07:35 am
Derek Chauvin Trial Live Updates: Calls for Police Reform After Murder Conviction

Quote:
After the Chauvin verdict, will there be new accountability for American police?

The widespread celebration that followed the conviction of a former Minneapolis police officer for the murder of George Floyd left a lingering question for many: Would the verdict have any lasting impact on policing in America?

Derek Chauvin’s conviction on all counts — second-degree murder, third-degree murder and second-degree manslaughter — meant that the 45-year-old former officer, a nearly 20-year veteran of the Minneapolis police force, could face years in prison for the brutal encounter that ended Mr. Floyd’s life.

President Biden called the verdict “too rare” and said that it should serve as a catalyst for reforms in law enforcement. In the wake of the jury’s decision, there are broad calls in many cities for recalibrating the relationship between the police and the public.

The verdict brought some sense of closure in the death of Mr. Floyd, who died on May 25, particularly to those who were close to him. But on the larger issue of police killings and use of force around the country, there were challenges ahead. More than three people a day were killed at the hands of law enforcement during Mr. Chauvin’s trial.

Otis Moss III, pastor of Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, said the country has yet to reckon with the systemic problems that Black activists have pointed to for decades.

“Reckoning suggests that we are truly struggling with how to reimagine everything from criminal justice to food deserts to health disparities — we are not doing that,” he said. The verdict, he said, “is addressing a symptom, but we have not yet dealt with the disease.”

While some state legislatures have passed law enforcement reform bills, including bans on no-knock warrants and chokeholds, others have taken the opposite approach. Several states are considering bills that could effectively criminalize public protests.

Officials and law enforcement agencies across the country had braced for mass protests and possible civil unrest if the jury had found Mr. Chauvin not guilty of murder.

But after Mr. Chauvin was escorted from the courtroom in handcuffs, a crowd outside the Hennepin County courthouse in Minneapolis erupted in cheers. Most public gatherings nationwide were largely celebratory, with some activists Tuesday night calling for continued public attention on other recent police shootings.

People across the country expressed a sense of relief and hopefulness, from New York to Donna, Texas.

“That blue wall of silence may be finally cracking,” said Juan Carmona, the head of the social studies department at Donna High School in the border town of Donna. “Police officers are like anybody else, and they’re seeing what’s happening in the country.”


I sort of have my doubts, I am hoping it is not like gun reform, but I have a bad feeling it will be. When a new terrible police shooting takes place, attention and news stories will be front and center, but it always dies down. I am not sure about all of the shootings, I think all of them should be looked at before jumping to conclusions. But on the whole, I think police reform should be urgent, this disparity and plain discrimination and profiling against black or brown people needs to be solved. If there is a way to pass police reform without the GOP, then however controversial, we need to do it while we can.
izzythepush
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 07:49 am
@revelette3,
There is a big difference between doing something and appearing to do something and you’re right to be concerned.

I’m reminded of the case of Admiral Byng who was executed primarily to show the people who was in charge and that nobody, supposedly, was above the law.

It didn’t do anything to change the behaviour of the rich and powerful although it was made to look that way. Byng was a scapegoat for screw ups higher up.

“In this country it is considered useful now and again to shoot an admiral, to encourage the others.”

The fear is that this case will be shown as proof that things have changed and no further action is needed. The racists are already saying as much.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  0  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 08:29 am
I tried to hurry up and edit my last post after I found out the details of that Ohio shooting. The cop appears justified in this case.
The teenager looked as if she was about to stab another teenager when the officer opened fire.
I didn’t want to make the mistake of lumping all cops together.
This time it looks like he really tried to “protect and serve”.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/ohio-police-kill-teenaged-black-girl-say-media-family-2021-04-21/
Rebelofnj
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 08:44 am
The Fraternal Order of Police, the largest police union in the US with over 355,000 members, released a statement supporting the verdict:

Quote:
Our system of justice has worked as it should, with the prosecutors and defense presenting their evidence to the jury, which then deliberated and delivered a verdict. The trial was fair and due process was served. We hope and expect that all of our fellow citizens will respect the rule of law and remain peaceful tonight and in the days to come.

As I said yesterday, our First Amendment freedoms are sacred. The men and women serving their communities—law enforcement officers from numerous agencies as well as the National Guard—are there to protect you and defend your rights as Americans. We urge you to regard them as guardians of the peace and we urge members of all of our communities to be safe and to make good decisions when making their voices heard.

Please, stay safe.

https://fop.net/2021/04/statement-of-national-fop-president-on-verdict-in-chauvin-trial/

If I were to guess, the FOP is hoping that the trial would not lead to major police reforms, and wants to use the trial to show the current system works, with Chauvin being their sacrificial lamb.
hightor
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 08:54 am
@snood,
Quote:
I didn’t want to make the mistake of lumping all cops together.

The ugly truth is that cops are going to have to continue making split second decisions which sometimes end up in the loss of life. These events are tragic but often unavoidable. They shouldn't be confused with the killing of suspects who are disarmed, handcuffed, and in police custody.
revelette3
 
  0  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 09:00 am
@Rebelofnj,
I would think the Union would want police reform, wouldn't it better both for the police and the public and the minority community all around to have police reform with firm universal rules and remedies in place? That needs to happen because right now the younger generation and poorer neighborhoods have no trust in the police and for good reason.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 09:04 am
@revelette3,
I think the Floyd killing was so high profile and so well documented that it will cause incremental changes in police departments everywhere. The knee on the neck thing is a good example. I'm sure there were lots of policemen who echoed Chauvin's "If you can speak, you can breath" mentality. I don't think they do anymore. After this, if you put your knee on someone's neck and they die as a result, you are looking at murder charges and I think that will have a result. (Interestingly, I saw where a police officer who lost her job 20 years ago for insisting a fellow officer remove his knee from the neck of a suspect finally got a judgement in her favor). It will also be interesting to see what happens to the other three officers involved in the arrest. Not sure when their trials are, but if they are convicted as accomplices, it will send a message out the complicity of other officers at the scene. Any one of those officers could have saved Floyd's life just by standing up to Chauvin. Convicting them will send a message as well.
snood
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 09:10 am
@hightor,
Yeah, but those “split second decisions” all need to be looked at individually. I think a lot of folks have died needlessly because police have been able to hide too easily behind “fearing for their lives”.
Philando Castille comes immediately to mind.

If closer examination of each fatal police shooting is one reform result of this latest business, that’s a good thing.

0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  3  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 09:14 am
@engineer,
engineer wrote:
...It will also be interesting to see what happens to the other three officers involved in the arrest. Not sure when their trials are, but if they are convicted as accomplices, it will send a message out the complicity of other officers at the scene. Any one of those officers could have saved Floyd's life just by standing up to Chauvin. Convicting them will send a message as well.

Hey, why even have a trial, since you've got the verdict already? It's not as simple as you're presenting it. If you're one of several cops at a crime scene and one of them uses a dangerous technique to restrain a suspect and you don't actively stop him, are you a murderer? Surely, at least, you're less guilty. What if the cop doing the questionable restraint is senior and you're a rookie. Are you still a murderer for not actively stopping it? A lot is lost in your simplistic determination that everyone present is guilty. That's why we have trials, so both sides can present their stories. The truth is usually complicated. For example, Floyd had a possibly lethal amount of fentanyl in his system. Is that any factor at all in any aspect of the situation? I have no idea and neither do you.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 10:05 am
@Brandon9000,
The other cops will go on trial and some of your queries may be answered.
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Linkat
 
  0  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 10:26 am
I have not read through all the responses so please forgive me for repeating anything. I did not because I am avoiding the political rants and racist rants – like how the h*ll does it make sense first off to say conservatives look at mass murder of school children as freedom? Be honest with yourself – do you think anyone thinks this way? And what does that have to do with this case?

Anyway I was trying to avoid this sort of inane rant because it is plain old stupid and causes more divides and I would have hoped that discussing something like this should bring people together.

So my personal thoughts – I do support the police – however, I support the honest good police that are risking their lives (although we do know they sign up for this they do deserve some level of respect) to help protect others. At first glance I am feeling wow this is tough this guy was just doing his police work and is now going to jail probably for life – his whole life is ruined because of a bad mistake. Then I start looking deeper – no he knew better, there is little doubt there was hate behind his actions. It was not a quick reflex to try to protect himself or others. He had time to pull back. He was wrong and he knew better – that is murder. So I no longer feel “bad” for him. I feel he is a murder no less than if some random guy on the street hated someone else for no reason than what he looked at and did the same thing.

It can be hard to disassociate the police officer position (especially for someone who has had little negative dealings with them) as a murderer when on duty. But it can happen – they are human and some are bad people. Many are great men and women. This is not a conservative vs liberal; and it should not be racial in the sense that a bad police officer is a bad police officer. This situation is racial because of how particular races are viewed and treated by police, and the law and one particular bad police officer whose hate and the fact that this sort of behavior has been allowed far too long made a recipe for disaster.

I don’t care what Floyd did – at the time he was stopped and no threat. Why the h*ll would you continue to harm the man? Makes no logical sense.

The only positive I can see of this – is to waken people’s eyes. The police will have to change and realize the harm they are doing just by suspecting someone because of what they look like. We all need to take a look at ourselves and be kinder to others. Stop blaming others - right here on this thread we are the problem. Stop saying dumb crap like conservatives or liberals or black or white stuff like that is causing division. Yes, we will have differences of opinion, but that is ok – what is not ok is the cruelness and disrespect shown throughout. I, personally am sick of it and will try to ignore and not feed these individuals.

My rant is done – please go on and please rest in peace Mr. Floyd. I am sorry for you and your family.
revelette3
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 12:51 pm
Quote:
A jury convicted Chauvin of second- and third-degree murder and manslaughter, a development that Biden described as a “step forward” toward addressing systemic racism and police misconduct but “not enough.” Biden that when speaking with Floyd’s family he “assured them we’re going to continue to fight for the passage of the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act so I can sign the law as quickly as possible.”

The bill aims to end certain police techniques, including chokeholds and carotid holds, two forms of potentially deadly force. Such practices would be banned at the federal level, and federal funding for local and state police agencies would be conditioned on those agencies outlawing them. The bill also seeks to improve police training and invest in community programs designed to improve policing and promote equitable new policies.

Other provisions in the bill would:

Ban no-knock warrants in federal drug cases and, as with chokeholds, encourage local and state agencies to comply by tying prohibitions to federal funding. A no-knock warrant led to the fatal police shooting of 26-year-old Breonna Taylor last year in Louisville, Kentucky.

End “qualified immunity,” which protects law enforcement officers from most civil lawsuits.

Make it easier to prosecute police officers accused of misconduct by changing the legal standard from willfulness to recklessness.

Prohibit racial, religious and discriminatory profiling by law enforcement at the local, state and federal levels and mandate training against such discriminatory profiling.

Require local and state police agencies to use existing federal funds to ensure the use of body cameras, require all federal uniformed officers to wear body cameras, and require all marked federal police vehicles to use dashboard cameras.

Create a national police misconduct registry to prevent police officers who are fired or pushed out for bad performance from being hired by other agencies.

Use federal grants to help communities establish commissions and task forces to study police reforms.

Address police militarization by limiting how much military-grade equipment is awarded to state and local law enforcement agencies.

Enhance “pattern and practice” investigations of police departments by granting the Justice Department subpoena power and establishing grant programs for state attorneys general to conduct their own probes.


source
0 Replies
 
longjon
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 01:04 pm
@Linkat,
Quote:
I don’t care what Floyd did – at the time he was stopped and no threat. Why the h*ll would you continue to harm the man? Makes no logical sense.


What are the police supossed to do going forward? Now whenever a violent black attacks someone, the police aren't going to be allowed to do their job. Benjamin Crump started legislation to ensure that, and Biden called to pledge allegiance to Crump yesterday and promise to pass the law. So now, when a violent black is high out of his mind on crack or PCP, the police will be forced to stand down even if that black is raping a woman in broad daylight.
snood
 
  0  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 01:15 pm
So asking a cop to stop applying pressure on an unconscious person is just like asking them to ignore a rapist?
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 01:17 pm
@longjon,
Quote:
Now whenever a violent black attacks someone, the police aren't going to be allowed to do their job.

Reading comprehension isn't your strong point — that's not what the trial was about. The police still have the job of preventing crimes and apprehending people who are committing crimes. The trial only established that the police are not within the law when they brutalize suspects who are in custody — handcuffed and prone, at that — and kill them. Is that too difficult to understand? Crump, by the way, is an attorney, not a legislator.
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Rebelofnj
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 01:37 pm
@longjon,
This is also ignoring that the fact that several police officials, including the Minneapolis Chief of Police, testified against Chauvin in the trial and that the Fraternal Order of Police and other officials supports the verdict.

You are thinking something fanatical from the Turner Diaries.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 21 Apr, 2021 02:36 pm
A couple of considerations.
I think we would be wise to watch to see exactly what kinds of backlashes come from police. There will inevitably be some circling of the wagons and maybe more pointed responses.

Also, let’s watch closely what comes out of the DOJ investigation into the Minneapolis police. Chauvin was a monster, but he acted with impunity for twenty years within the Minneapolis Police system.
We would be making a mistake to treat Chauvin as a total lone wolf anomaly. There was a whole police department that had his back for years. They would have covered this murder up if not for the brave actions of Darnella Frazier whose video of the crime memorialized all 9:29 that was dissected in court. There were other cops with him that day who, if they thought he was doing something wrong, were not empowered by their system to save Floyd.
 

 
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