R.I.P. The 1st amendment 1791-2021

@engineer,

Well, you've been asked again and again and again to give me quotations in which Trump actually solicits violence and have failed to do so. You've either ignored the requests or given me quotations in which he doesn't solicit violence. I guess that says it all.

2 Replies

@Brandon9000,

Lol, yes it does.

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

When you get around to accepting defeat at the hands of engineer, maybe you can circle back and respond to these questions I asked last week:

you wrote:

People tell their supporters to fight every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

What "people" are you talking about?

Quote:

People tell supporters that the country or something valuable is being taken away from them frequently.

Again, who's saying this?

Quote:

If this were illegal, tens of thousands of people would have faced legal consequences for urging protest and resistance over the years, both of which are absolutely protected rights.

Assuming these "tens of thousands" of people actually exist, how many of them have occupied the highest elective office in the USA? How many of them have used their position to concoct a false, self-serving narrative, going so far as to solicit money to overturn the results of a fair election? How many of them have employed friendly media outlets to broadcast their lies to the nation? How many of them have stood before an angry mob, and with the legitimacy and status of a chief executive, commanded them to march on the Capitol — with the intention of preventing the lawful activity of a democratically-elected government through coercion and the force of numbers?

***

It strikes me as odd — here we have the president of the USA questioning the fairness of the upcoming election all summer, dismissing the results of the fair election as fraudulent when it was held and claiming victory "in a landslide", then inviting his supporters to Washington where it will be "wild", and finally haranguing an armed angry mob, telling them blatant lies to get them further worked up, and directing them to march on the Capitol while he watches the riot unfold on TV. And you actually liken this to some union organizer, black politician, or municipal candidate telling an assembly to "fight" for their rights? You really see no difference in context or consequence?

What's your problem, Brandon9000?

1 Reply

@hightor,

hightor wrote:

When you get around to accepting defeat at the hands of engineer,

Don't be silly. Engineer is clearly unable to back up any of his claims.

hightor wrote:

It strikes me as odd -- here we have the president of the USA questioning the fairness of the upcoming election all summer, dismissing the results of the fair election as fraudulent when it was held and claiming victory "in a landslide", then inviting his supporters to Washington where it will be "wild", and finally haranguing an armed angry mob, telling them blatant lies to get them further worked up, and directing them to march on the Capitol while he watches the riot unfold on TV. And you actually liken this to some union organizer, black politician, or municipal candidate telling an assembly to "fight" for their rights? You really see no difference in context or consequence?

Progressives can't stand it when peaceful protesters stand up to their bullying.

hightor wrote:

What's your problem, Brandon9000?

Who says he has a problem?? When progressives don't back up their claims, that merely proves that their claims are untrue.

2 Replies

@oralloy,

Quote:

Engineer is clearly unable to back up any of his claims.

He backed them up repeatedly.

Quote:

Progressives can't stand it when peaceful protesters stand up to their bullying.

The Capitol protests weren't "peaceful".

Quote:

Who says he has a problem??

That's why I've asked again and again — he doesn't seem able to process written replies to his questions so I'd like to know what his problem is.

1 Reply

@hightor,

hightor wrote:

He backed them up repeatedly.

Hardly. He has yet to show Mr. Trump doing anything other than urging a peaceful protest.

hightor wrote:

The Capitol protests weren't "peaceful".

Most of the protesters were entirely peaceful.

hightor wrote:

he doesn't seem able to process written replies to his questions

I think it's because the replies do not actually address his questions.

0 Replies

@engineer,

engineer wrote:

Lol, yes it does.

Tell me any sentence by Trump which solicits violence. I've asked you for this again and again and again. If you're right, why can't you?

You had one post recently which listed a few quotations by Trump, but not one of them solicited violence. Quote me just one sentence by Trump which solicits violence.

Either such a thing exists or it doesn't. If you claim he said something, but cannot provide a quotation in which he said it, you're simply wrong.

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

Im sure the entire evidence package that presents clips of Trumps inanities will be available through Netflix in a few weeks after the vote.
If you are so dumb as to not clearly recognize his string of inflammatory beckoning (AND THE TIMELINE OF THEIR OCCURRENCES), the sealioning another correspondent to do work thats already been done and clearly refutes what you want to hold fast, THEN you need remedial help in reading comprehension as well as audible pattern recognition.
Seek solace from Ollie, your bent minds think alike. ( I think it has more to do with you being "cornered" than dealing with Constitutional law)

1 Reply

@oralloy,

Quote:

Progressives can't stand it when peaceful protesters stand up to their bullying

I think 99% of human beings would dispute that Jan 6 at the Capitol was a peaceful protest. (Unless your family picnics involve B&E, murder, defacing public proprty, destruction of
public propety and artifacts, and defecation on public work spaces).

Your definition of "peaceful" belongs in a tropical ant hill..

1 Reply

@farmerman,

Yes, months of BLM protests in multiple cities, number of deaths 0.
One right wing white supremist protest in Charlottesville, deaths 1
One right wing capital protest, police deaths 1, police injuries >100.
Number of cars driven into crowds of right wing protestors - 0
Number of cars driven into crowds of BLM protestors - 104

Yep, those violent progressives.

0 Replies

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

Im sure the entire evidence package that presents clips of Trumps inanities will be available through Netflix in a few weeks after the vote.
If you are so dumb as to not clearly recognize his string of inflammatory beckoning (AND THE TIMELINE OF THEIR OCCURRENCES), the sealioning another correspondent to do work thats already been done and clearly refutes what you want to hold fast, THEN you need remedial help in reading comprehension as well as audible pattern recognition.
Seek solace from Ollie, your bent minds think alike. ( I think it has more to do with you being "cornered" than dealing with Constitutional law)

You might as well be next. Engineer has clearly fled.

Why is it so complicated? If he did solicit violence, as you seem to claim, just quote me one sentence in which he did so. If you're right, why would that take you more than five minutes?

Why should I wait for some video? You claim he solicited violence. Tell me one sentence in which he did. Vague references to some future video and claims that anyone with common sense could see it are just a smokescreen to obscure the fact that you cannot come up with even one sentence in which he did what you accuse him of.

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

Why don't you Google Trumps inserection speeches
You will get all kinds of information.

1 Reply

@RABEL222,

because lazy Brandon wants you to do it for him...

1 Reply

@Region Philbis,

And even then he'll just deny it. It's like the old Klan trials in the South, no amount of evidence will get a conviction. Think of how overwhelming the evidence was to get seven Republican senators on board. I thought the Ukraine impeachment was straightforward and that only got one.

1 Reply

@engineer,

engineer wrote:

And even then he'll just deny it. It's like the old Klan trials in the South, no amount of evidence will get a conviction. Think of how overwhelming the evidence was to get seven Republican senators on board. I thought the Ukraine impeachment was straightforward and that only got one.

"No amount of evidence," huh? Give me one single quotation in which he asks for violence. I asked you again and again and again and you couldn't. How does the phrase "no amount of evidence" apply to a situation in which you give zero evidence?

You're right and I'm wrong? Okay, for the tenth time, give me one single quotation in which Trump asks for violence.

2 Replies

@Brandon9000,

Okay, for the tenth time, what's your problem, Brandon9000?

There is no single statement where he orders the mob to commit violence. It doesn't matter because when you exhort an armed, angry mob to "fight" the threat of violence is implied. The preparatory work began last summer when he started musing about a "stolen election" and "fraudulent" mail-in ballots. And sure enough, when he lost the election he immediately claimed he'd won by a landslide. For the next two months he continued to stoke up the intensity and announced the January 6 ("will be wild") protest. By the time the rally was held, he didn't have to tell the mob anything more than, "We're going to march on the Capitol". Addressing an armed, angry mob he made no attempt to quell the level of outrage and instead continued to spread his inflammatory lies.

The only reason to direct the mob to the Capitol was to coerce the lawmakers with the threat of violence. He could've just as easily directed them to join hands around the Reflecting Pool and pray for the country while beseeching god to work a miracle.

What was the rally for, Brandon9000? It was too late to legally change the results of the election, so what did his people hope to accomplish? For people like Trump, it's all about intimidation. From a politician who claims to stand for "law and order"! Why do you continue to support this loser???

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

I gave you links, then I have you a detailed post, then the impeachment managers gave you a two day presentation. Your response is the same. They'd love you in those old (or nor so old) Klan trials. "Members of the jury, yes my clients grabbed shotguns when the saw a black man jogging and yes they chased him down in pickups and yes he was unarmed and tried to avoid them, but they shot him in self defense and you must acquit!"

Heck, even McConnell gave a speech saying Trump incited violence.

1 Reply

@engineer,

engineer wrote:

I gave you links, then I have you a detailed post, then the impeachment managers gave you a two day presentation. Your response is the same. They'd love you in those old (or nor so old) Klan trials. "Members of the jury, yes my clients grabbed shotguns when the saw a black man jogging and yes they chased him down in pickups and yes he was unarmed and tried to avoid them, but they shot him in self defense and you must acquit!"

Heck, even McConnell gave a speech saying Trump incited violence.

You claim that Trump solicited violence, so you are required to present support for your claim. You can't make a claim and then ask people who disagree with it to go out and locate proof. Debate never has and never will work that way. If what you say is true, it should be really easy. I never asked you for any more than one single quotation.

Of all the times I ever asked you for quotations, to the best of my recollection, you only posted quotations once. Here they are:

Quote:

All of us here today do not want to see our election victory stolen by emboldened radical-left Democrats, which is what they’re doing. And stolen by the fake news media. That’s what they’ve done and what they’re doing. We will never give up, we will never concede. It doesn’t happen. You don’t concede when there’s theft involved.

Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore and that’s what this is all about. And to use a favorite term that all of you people really came up with: We will stop the steal.

Quote:

We will not let them silence your voices. We’re not going to let it happen, I’m not going to let it happen.

Quote:

You will have an illegitimate president. That’s what you’ll have. And we can’t let that happen.

These are the facts that you won’t hear from the fake news media. It’s all part of the suppression effort. They don’t want to talk about it. They don’t want to talk about it. In fact, when I started talking about that, I guarantee you, a lot of the television sets and a lot of those cameras went off. And that’s a lot of cameras back there. But a lot of them went off.

But these are the things you don’t hear about. You don’t hear what you just heard. I’m going to go over a few more states. But you don’t hear it by the people who want to deceive you and demoralize you and control you. Big tech, media.

Quote:

Republicans are, Republicans are constantly fighting like a boxer with his hands tied behind his back. It’s like a boxer. And we want to be so nice. We want to be so respectful of everybody, including bad people. And we’re going to have to fight much harder.

Quote:

Now, it is up to Congress to confront this egregious assault on our democracy. And after this, we’re going to walk down, and I’ll be there with you, we’re going to walk down, we’re going to walk down.

Anyone you want, but I think right here, we’re going to walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them.

Because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength and you have to be strong.

Quote:

But we’ve done it quickly and we were going to sit home and watch a big victory and everybody had us down for a victory. It was going to be great and now we’re out here fighting.

Quote:

And we fight. We fight like hell. And if you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore.

Our exciting adventures and boldest endeavors have not yet begun. My fellow Americans, for our movement, for our children, and for our beloved country.

And I say this despite all that’s happened. The best is yet to come.

So we’re going to, we’re going to walk down Pennsylvania Avenue. I love Pennsylvania Avenue. And we’re going to the Capitol, and we’re going to try and give.

None of these quotations suggests violence, so what the hell kind of evidence is that? The mere fact that you're posting doesn't mean that you're posting evidence. Tell me one of the above quotations or any other quotation that you think asks for violence.

1 Reply

@hightor,

I think what is particularly damning in the impeachment trial is the timeline once the attack begins. After telling the crowd to walk to the capital to fight like hell or you won't have a country anymore, he retreated to the White House to watch on TV. When the attack starts, he is called by Rep. McCarthy and tells him the protesters must care more about the country than McCarthy does and refuses to stop them. While watching a guy with a bullhorn reading out his tweets, Trump calls Senator Tuberville and upon hearing that they are trying to evacuate the VP tweets a negative Pence tweet to the guy with the bullhorn (who reads it to the crowd). Not only did Trump incite the insurrection, he was guiding it.

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

Brandon9000 wrote:

None of these quotations suggests violence...

In the context of calling the election stolen and telling people their very country is at stake, ALL OF THAT SUGGESTS VIOLENCE! Trump was not talking to a random group of people, he was fully briefed on the crowd. The FBI was tracking extremist plans from all over the country. I think if you witnessed a stoning, you would say "well, that guy only threw one rock and that rock probably didn't kill the person, probably didn't even hit them so NOT GUILTY". It's all the rocks together, the impact of each stone in succession, that is the problem.

1 Reply

R.I.P. The 1st amendment 1791-2021

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