Constructive voices coming from Antifa?

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

At least before Trump we feel and to a large degree are the modern version of Rome and if you wish to do business with Rome you do it on Rome terms.

That’s the attitude that leads to 9/11s

1 Reply

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

You have my curiosity. Exactly what point do you think you are making with that code?

That's good. Well this is a riddle for you to solve, but answering your question would be telling, so let's see if you can figure it out...

maxdancona wrote:

- You define left as absolutely true.
- You define right as absolutely false.

"left" and "right" are not defines in the code I posted before, they are both declared integer variables (short int's to be more precise) with values of 1 and 0 respectively assigned to them. But there are some defines being used though, but the code itself that I posted does not define those defines though.

Also, there is no "absolutely true" or "absolutely false", 0 is only defined as "false" and 1 is only defined as "true" - no "absolutely" there.

I'll give you a hint... if I changed the following code:

Code:short int left = 1, right = 0;

...to this:

Code:short int left = 0, right = 10;

...would this change the result?

(I already know the answer, but let's see if you do)

1 Reply

@justaguy2,

This is silly... but I love a good game.

Explain to me... What is the result.

int beef = 0;
int meat = 1;

printf (beef && meat);

What does that prove? This is silly.

or we could try..

int justaguy = 0;
int common_sense = 1;

1 Reply

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

This is silly... but I love a good game.

I'm enjoying myself too Very Happy

maxdancona wrote:

Explain to me... What is the result.

If you are a programmer, then you should be able to explain it, and know the answer to that question. The real question is... why is that the result?

maxdancona wrote:

printf (beef && meat);

A printf call written like that wouldn't work/display anything.

maxdancona wrote:

What does that prove? This is silly.

At least a few things currently, and even some things I didn't expect. As I would have thought you would have figured it out by now - both the code and the point it makes (a couple of points actually).

I'll give you more time to figure it out...

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

BillRM wrote:

At least before Trump we feel and to a large degree are the modern version of Rome and if you wish to do business with Rome you do it on Rome terms.

That’s the attitude that leads to 9/11s

Well we could had let them fight it out between them an that would have kept them busy for many years and somehow I could not see Saddam Hussein while consolidating the middle east under his rule allowing an attack on the US.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

It would be nice, just for once, if you understood what was being discussed.

0 Replies

@justaguy2,

Quote:

If you are a programmer, then you should be able to explain it, and know the answer to that question. The real question is... why is that the result?

The '&&' operator is a boolean operator (C doesn't have boolean data types), so is the '||' operator. A boolean is a value that is restricted to either "true" or "false". In C any number that is not 0 is true (although 0 and 1 are generally used as false and true).

The && is the logical conjunction operator in C. It is only "True" if both of the operands are "True"

The "||" is the logical disjunction operator. It is "True" is either of the operands are true (i.e. only "False" when both operands are false).

So you can name the two operands whatever you want. The operator works the same way. if "fish" is true and "chips" is false... fish && chips will be false.

Does that explain it to you? (When you learn about floats... it is going to blow your mind).

1 Reply

Here is the mathematical (nerdy) wording of my point...

Human beings are not booleans. Saying that a human being is either "liberal" or not "liberal" is ridiculous given the fact that each human being is complex. If you say that a "liberal" is someone who supports the right to abortion, and wants gun control. What do you do with a person who opposes legal abortion, but wants gun control?

This desire for ideological purity, where someone has to stick to their political side no matter what, doesn't make sense. That isn't how human beings really work.

- I strongly support immigrant rights

- I support a woman's right to choose.

- I support same sex marriage.

- I have a complicated belief in Transgender rights. I believe in the right of safety and dignity for transgender people. I think that as a society there needs to be some compromise given the importance of gender in human societies.

- I strongly support Black Lives Matter

- I don't support modern feminism that I feel has gone too far and is often contradictory.

- I want government run health care

- I support free speech... including the right of people to express hateful ideas.

As you can see... I agree with Izzy, and Justaguy and this crowd on most issues. It is the Democrats in the US that support most of my issue and always get my vote.

But to them it is a boolean... you either are with them or against them. The fact that I question on a couple of issues (even to ask a question is heresy to them)... I am someone to be hated and feared.

2 Replies

@maxdancona,

The real problem with boolean thinking is when you are trying to win elections...

The majority of Americans want more restrictions put on abortion. https://www.npr.org/2019/06/07/730183531/poll-majority-want-to-keep-abortion-legal-but-they-also-want-restrictions

If Joe Biden drives away every American who wants restrictions put on abortion... he will lose the election. What any winning political movement needs to do is to pull in people most of whom will disagree with them on other issues. You will see Joe Biden reach out to pro-life Americans... and you will see behind the scenes efforts to make sure that the extreme left shuts up.

Human beings are not boolean.

2 Replies

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

The '&&' operator is a boolean operator (C doesn't have boolean data types), so is the '||' operator. A boolean is a value that is restricted to either "true" or "false". In C any number that is not 0 is true (although 0 and 1 are generally used as false and true).

Almost totally correct, except... C does in fact have a boolean data type, which from memory I believe was introduced in the C99 revision, so you're wrong about that. If you don't include the "stdbool.h" header, then you couldn't write "bool result = <value>" nor the actual words "true" or "false" in your code - you'd have to use "_Bool result = <value>" and "0" instead "false" and "1" instead of "true" (being the reason I did include the "stdbool.h" header).

maxdancona wrote:

The && is the logical conjunction operator in C. It is only "True" if both of the operands are "True"

It's actually called the "logical AND operator" AFAIK.

maxdancona wrote:

The "||" is the logical disjunction operator. It is "True" is either of the operands are true (i.e. only "False" when both operands are false).

It's actually called the "logical OR operator" AFAIK.

maxdancona wrote:

So you can name the two operands whatever you want. The operator works the same way. if "fish" is true and "chips" is false... fish && chips will be false.

Actually, and while both the logical AND operator and the logical OR operator work in a similar way, they don't work in exactly the same way - as there wouldn't be any point in having two different operators that worked in the same way, as this would imply they do the same thing, well, not quite. So that statement of your's is not quite true.

maxdancona wrote:

Does that explain it to you? (When you learn about floats... it is going to blow your mind).

I already knew how those C operators work and what they do. I also already know what "float" and "double" variables are. Why would you assume I only know integers?

More to the point: while you've finally looked up the logical AND, and the logical OR operators and learnt what they do... you still haven't understood the point of the exercise.

Hint: why would you think that "short int left = 1, right = 0;" are defines, defining "true" or "false" when they are both integer variables assigning "1" and "0" to "left" and "right" respectively?

0 Replies

@maxdancona,

justaguy2 wrote:

... you still haven't understood the point of the exercise.

Let me make a slight correction to the above since you must have posted while I was still typing my previous reply...

maxdancona wrote:

Human beings are not boolean.

Right, so as asked before, why can't you be honest and even-handed? Why do you continually frame your posts as if it's only one side committing any violence, etc. Why do you accuse people of things they did not imply or say? Because you do have a nasty habit of NOT being honest, attacking others with snide responses when rightfully called out, you don't want to acknowledge trump/far-right supporters attacking other protesters using violence (until pushed - if even then), and you do seem to willfully misunderstand people calling you out and then attack them for doing so.

None of that is an honest discussion on your part. So be honest yourself if that's what you want.

1 Reply

@justaguy2,

Quote:

Why do you continually frame your posts as if it's only one side committing any violence, etc.

You say this because Izzy said it. You are copying Izzy. If you read my posts, you will see plenty where I am condemning White Supremacy and violence from the Right. I even started a thread on White Supremacy.

Click on the word "maxdancona", and look at my posts. I am attacking extremism on the right, as well as extremism on the left. Extremism is the problem.

Izzy's logic is always either/or.... Anyone who questions any part of the left must be part of the right. This is faulty logic. You seem to be just repeating slavishly what Izzy is saying (and the number of phrases in your post that are direct copies of what Izzy says is embarrassing).

2 Replies

@maxdancona,

It’s very easy to make broad sweeping remarks about white supremacy.

Your condemnation of such is very vague to the point of being meaningless.

Your criticism of those on the left is very specific and targeted.

And you’re very much against women’s rights which would put you in the same camp as the pussy grabber.

I’m not the great influencer you make me out to be. People’s view of you is based on what you have said. It’s got **** all to do with me, it’s just after reading so many of your posts that people see your double dealing.

Your problem is honesty. I don’t believe you and this is only compounded by your passive aggressive manner where you imply all manner of things without having the guts to come out and say what you mean.

0 Replies

@maxdancona,

And here we go again... you get called out, and you not only blame others, you attack others for doing so. You also once again accuse me of things I've NOT DONE. I cannot help it if others happen to agree with me or vica versa and see straight through you and your continued bullshit. The same as I can't help it if someone else decides to use the same words as me, or vica versa. What do you expect ANYONE to do about that? As I have not copy and pasted anyone's words, I've used my own words, typed with my own fingers (just as I have with this post). I've not even read all of Izzy's posts in every other thread they've replied to. So again, you are a complete and utter hypocrite and liar.

0 Replies

@maxdancona,

You’re the only one who keeps talking about extremes, it’s your credibility that is the problem. People don’t believe you because you’re not a straight talker, when you’re accused of something you never address the topic you change subjects.

You accuse anyone who agrees with me as being one of my sock puppets. That really is a classical definition of denial.

You’re so insular in your thinking. You’re talking to an Englishman and an Australian and you choose gun control and abortion to make your point. Neither abortion or gun control are election issues here or Australia, having sensible laws on both that only a handful of religious nutters oppose.

You use the term liberal in a way that only means something to Americans. In Australia the Liberal party is the right wing party, with the
Labor party being on the left. In the Uk the Liberals are a spent force after propping up the Tories.

And as someone with a transgender son it’s clear you don’t give a **** about transgender rights.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

In Australia the Liberal party is the right wing party, with the Labor party being on the left.

Yep, that's correct.

And here's another fun fact for you, maxdancona, the Liberal party is in government at both federal and state level where I am. And here's another fun fact for you: I don't see much, if any difference in my life having lived under both the Liberal party and Labor parties being in government at various points in time. But I DO see the same issues cropping up time and time again regardless of which of those parties is in power.

Here's one more fun fact for you: most people I know, in fact nearly everyone I know, doesn't disagree with the gun laws we have here, for one thing. So Izzy is quite correct is saying that never crops up as an issue when there's an election here. In fact, the only people who try and make it an issue are the far-right nutters here. But even in the Liberal party, most agree with the gun laws the way they are, indeed, it was a Liberal prime minister, being John Howard that got the states here to agree to the national firearms agreement that brought in the gun laws we currently have.

While people like you, maxdancona, are more interested in talking about the left and the right in your country.

In all honesty, and if I didn't know better, I'd think that Americans are just **** nuts...

1 Reply

Max's: Summary of the Thread
(A quick list of the relevant points -- so you don't have to read through the mud slinging).

1. My original question is whether there was anyone who identified themselves as "Antifa" was denouncing violence. This question hasn't been answered.

2. People pointed out that "Antifa" is not an organized group.

3. I pointed out that there were people on the left who were defending the use of violence. No one seems to disagree with this.

4. People pointed out that there was violence on the right. I agree with this, but I don't think it is relevant to the discussion.

5. People pointed out that Trump attacks Antifa and that this is a right wing talking point. I agree with this.

6. I pointed out that leftist extremism, and particularly violence from the left, is bad for the Democrats election chances, and that Joe Biden is very clearly denouncing violence from the left.

I don't see anyone here disagreeing seriously with any of my points. They seem to be rather upset that I am making them.

1 Reply

@justaguy2,

justaguy2 wrote:

In all honesty, and if I didn't know better, I'd think that Americans are just **** nuts...

You're an Australian saying this? Is that some kid of a joke?

1 Reply

@maxdancona,

maxdancona wrote:

3. I pointed out that there were people on the left who were defending the use of violence. No one seems to disagree with this.

Nobody has agreed either. You’ve not posted any specific examples of the ‘left’ being responsible for any violence. People have pointed out that those individuals are opportunist criminals.

Like Mr Goldman you refuse to deal with the issues raised, namely your dishonest way of debating, instead you change the subject with another one of your summaries.

0 Replies

@maxdancona,

Quote:

If Joe Biden drives away every American who wants restrictions put on abortion... he will lose the election. What any winning political movement needs to do is to pull in people most of whom will disagree with them on other issues. You will see Joe Biden reach out to pro-life Americans... and you will see behind the scenes effortns to make sure that the extreme left shuts up.

Human beings are not boolean.

So women that are the majority voters wish the men in government to have control over their wombs how interesting.

An of course the fathers and the brothers of women wish them to return to using coats hangers if they do no care to carry a fetus to full term.

In any case, a fast check of the numbers the abortion issue right now seem a near wash and somehow I can not see the far right anti abortions population voting for Biden for other reasons.

1 Reply

Constructive voices coming from Antifa?

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