Humans - our part in development

@NealNealNeal,

NealNealNeal wrote:

I know what you mean. It is amazing beyond words that God would do that. It is wonderful that Jesus would love us so much that He would be willing to do this
However, the Holy Spirit confirmed to my spirit that it was true. So, I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior.
My spirit was now alive!!! I now had peace like I never had before. I began to be a much nicer person than before.
Since then, I have had fellowship with God.
Science can tell us about the physical world. However, it is not meant to explain the Spiritual world.

Neal...do makes you feel happy and content.

But if you are going to attempt to sell this stuff to others...you have gotta up your game.

If there was a single person named Jesus who died during those days...he did not die for your sins or anyone else's. He died because he pissed off the wrong people.

A sin in nothing more than something a human does that offends their gods. If the gods want to forgive those offenses...no one has to die or be tortured.

Think about it more carefully, unless doing so would make you less happy and content.

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@Olivier5,

Ok. I respect that opinion. It is the "social gospel"
It would not have been enough to make me a first generation Christian, however.

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@maxdancona,

O.k. However, remember that Jesus told poor people not to be consumed by material things. God would provide for their needs
Jesus told people to "seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness. And all material needs would be given to you (by God).
By the way, there were no "illegal immigrants" in Israel.
As the Virus proved, there is a limit to how many people our country can support. African Americans got hurt because illegal aliens have invaded our country, among other things. I support the poor, disabled, and weak. Churches all over the west coast have people going to Mexico to build homes for people there. I live in a bachelor's apartment and often go hungry so other people have food.
Do you think Pelosi does that? She hides in her home "surely larger than 350. square feet) behind guarded gates. She doesn't have to be around the poor.
Did Obama or his daughter go to Mexico to do manual labor for the poor? No, neither of them did that.

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@NealNealNeal,

So if the poor people shouldn't be consumed by material things, why should others go to them and build homes for them?
They shouldn't be concerned they don't have homes. No?

Do you know what Pelosi, Obama or any other number of people do to get the poor the homes they need? I don't, but it's clear a person does not have to physically go somewhere and do the manual labor to help build a house.

I wouldn't want to live in a house Pelosi, Obama, or one of his daugthers built. They would do a shitty job because they're not trained at it. But you don't know how they are supporting those that do just that.

You know who knows how to physically build houses in Mexico?
Mexican laborers.

I watch teams of Mexican men work on a house, roadway, office building etc that would put a lot of American house laborers to shame.

If they want a house, they just go out and build it. A lot of times behind a secure gate.
BTW, as far as the stereotype of the poor Mexican standing there waiting for help, far from all Mexicans are poor.
And the poor get excellent medical care, eat fresh food and don't piss and moan. They put you or I to shame with their ingenuity.
They're very family oriented and take care of each other.

They got more going on with not being consumed by material things than you Neal.
If you have to often go hungry so other people can eat, you're doing it wrong.

People in America go to places right near by them to build homes for the poor.
Are those people less deserving?

You got some damn naive notions man.

Question
How many homes in Mexico have you built?

1 Reply

@chai2,

chai2 wrote:

So if the poor people shouldn't be consumed by material things, why should others go to them and build homes for them?
They shouldn't be concerned they don't have homes. No?

Do you know what Pelosi, Obama or any other number of people do to get the poor the homes they need? I don't, but it's clear a person does not have to physically go somewhere and do the manual labor to help build a house.

I wouldn't want to live in a house Pelosi, Obama, or one of his daugthers built. They would do a shitty job because they're not trained at it. But you don't know how they are supporting those that do just that.
We go there so that the poor could have basic shelter and food. I don't know why the Mexican government is so inept that it let's Americans do their work for them. Also why don't Mexicans in the south help their fellow Mexicans in the north? Also, why don't they help poor people in Central America? Why do Mexicans steal from Americans.Why doesn't the Vatican sell some of their goodies to help the poor?
You
You know who knows how to physically build houses in Mexico?
Mexican laborers.

I watch teams of Mexican men work on a house, roadway, office building etc that would put a lot of American house laborers to shame.

If they want a house, they just go out and build it. A lot of times behind a secure gate.
BTW, as far as the stereotype of the poor Mexican standing there waiting for help, far from all Mexicans are poor.
And the poor get excellent medical care, eat fresh food and don't piss and moan. They put you or I to shame with their ingenuity.
They're very family oriented and take care of each other.

They got more going on with not being consumed by material things than you Neal.
If you have to often go hungry so other people can eat, you're doing it wrong.

People in America go to places right near by them to build homes for the poor.
Are those people less deserving?

You got some damn naive notions man.

Question
How many homes in Mexico have you built?

1 Reply

@NealNealNeal,

Jesus was not a citizen. I. Today's terms he would be an illegal immigrants. It was the white people in power who put him to death. The Romans were the equivalent of Americans today (a wealthy country and a dominant military power). Jesus was not a citizen.

If Jesus lived with people the "Patriotic Romans" despised. If he were alive today, he would be with the "illegals". And Neal would be with the Scribes and Pharisees condemning him for not following the law.

I hate the hypocrisy of Christians today. Jesus hated the hypocrisy of the Scribes and Pharisees.

I think I would get along with the biblical Jesus just fine.

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@Olivier5,

Roger that.

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@NealNealNeal,

We build basic shelter for the poor in Mexico and give them food. This is what the Mexican government, rich people in Southern Mexico, and the Vatican could do if they wanted. Mexicans could also help the poor in Central America. Instead, they sneak accross our border and steal from Americans.j
God is not impressed by people who give a tiny percent of what they have to others. Please read the account of the widow's mite.
Pelosi Obama, and Democrats in Congress don't care about others. They just want to control people's lives. They lust for power.
I have seen 25 shelters built in Mexico.

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@NealNealNeal,

Stop avoiding and answer my questions.

Also, what Bullshit. So, these people that supposedly coming across the US border and stealing from this country, should instead be giving what according to you something they don't have to someone else?

How many Mexicans do you know that sneak across the border and steal from the US?
What are they stealing?
What do you know about what your God is impressed or unimpressed by?
What if Pelosi, Obama and whoever else you care to mention are donating to countries all over the world a larger percentage of what they have?

Are you privy to their finances?
Tell us Neal, what have their contributions been? Do you have access to their tax records?

No, instead you want Nancy and Barack to put on overalls and push a wheelbarrow around.

You say you've seen shelters built. What was your part in building them?

You son, are all hat and no cattle. You're making it up as you go along.

Talk about wanting to control other peoples lives. You seem very interested in narrating what random people do and don't do, then present it as fact.

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@maxdancona,

I didn't read the part where Mary and Joseph snuck over the border to get welfare. Nor did I read the part where Jesus murdered people as part of a gang.
The Romans occupied the land They set up governors to collect taxes from the Jews Jesus was not an illegal alien.
Jesus believed that we should give to God what is God's and to Caesar what is Caesar's.
Jesus told the Jewish leaders that the Talmud was wrong. People like Nicodemus believed Him. Gamaliel was also influenced by Jesus. Jesus fulfilled the law. He didn't destroy it.
Jesus said that the gospel takes precedence over the social gospel. He spoke about hell several times.
You can't sacrifice Holiness on the alter of love Please understand that black Americans have suffered from illegal aliens.

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I have known illegal border crossers most of my life. They are an asset to this country most of the time. I have had some wonderful experiences due to their generosity and hard work.

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@NealNealNeal,

You think Jesus was a patriotic American? Your hypocrisy is that you actually think that Americans are better and deserve more than people in other countries.

If the biblical Jesus were alive today, he wouldn't go to your church. He would likely be picked up by immigration, and deported.

The saddest thing is that White American Christianity has been Hijacked by American political extremosts who care about poltical ideology, and think they are more important than the poor.

You are part of a bankrupt religion that caters to White Americans and ignores the needs of anyone else.

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@NealNealNeal,

You go to a White American Church that is concerned with White American problems (you may have a few token minorities in your church, but I know how this works).

Black churches pretty overwhelmingly support immigrants. Black churches are closer to biblical Christianity because they have actually faces suffering and know a little about what Jesus was talking about.

The primary goal of White churches is to make White people feel better about themselves without the need to care about other people.

It is hypocritical and it is sick.

1 Reply

@chai2,

Are you ignorant of the problem that we have with illegal aliens?
These illegal aliens steal in whatever way they can.
It takes more than throwing money at problems.This is very impersonal.
My role in building homes has changed over the years. I am no longer able to do some things due to physical limitations and the political situation in Mexico.
I have also helped people with AIDS, the disabled, the poor in America, the elderly, etc.

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@maxdancona,

Actually, I go to a church that is integrated. Our pastor is Chinese
You totally miss Jesus' teaching about personal morality and responsibility.

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@NealNealNeal,

Read the gospels. Don't just pick out verses that you think tell you how great Americans are. If you read the actual message on its entirety you will find.

1. Jesus sided with the poor against the rich in verse after verse.

2. Jesus was constantly criticised by the religious hypocrites of the day for being friends of sinners and breaking the law himself.

3. Jesus was very clear that you will be judged by Him for how you treat the outcasts of society (i.e. illegals) and that you will go to hell, even if you follow him if you don't trust them with compassion.

4. Jesus preached about not judging people who are worse off then you.

5. Jesus preached very clearly about compassion and forgiveness.

6. Jesus was not a citizen of Rome, nor was he a Patriot. If he were alive today he would not be an American citizen. He would likely live among the people you are calling "illegals".

7. You wouldn't like the biblical Jesus. That is why you have invented your own Jesus, that happens to act like a patriotic American.

Your version of Jesus doesn't challenge you at all. You Jesus doesn't stop you from judging people in poverty. Your Jesus doesn't call you to put mercy over the law, or to put yourself in other people's place or to stand up to religious hypocrisy.

You would hate the biblical Jesus. That is why you have replaced Him with your own image.

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@maxdancona,

There is truth to what you are saying. However, God doesn't simply dismiss the unfair actions of the poor. It is unfair to people who legally apply for entry into the U.S. It is also unfair to the poor who live in the United States.
It is also unfair to the poor in Africa. Those are the truly poor of the world.
Jesus was considerate of Roman law. He told people to give unto Caesar what is Caesar's.
I do understand your point, however.

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@NealNealNeal,

Of course. People love mythology.

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@NealNealNeal,

You haven’t answered one of my questions, and you’re not going to.

You not going to waste my time any more.
I’m collapsing this topic so I don’t view it any longer.

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@NealNealNeal,

The Talmud was written centuries after Jesus died. It includes narratives most probably about him and a few quotes from him.

1 Reply

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