Rove was the source of the Plame leak... so it appears

Ticomaya wrote:

Surely the dissemination of an "undercover" operative's name must be illegal. But it does not appear the IIPA proscribes such action.

In your opinion, Tico, is there any room between 'illegal' and 'nothing wrong with it'? Say I grant you for the sake of the argument that Rove leaked Valery Plame's identity without breaking any law. In this case, how would that affect your opinion about Mr. Bush having pledged to fire the leak "whoever it is", and about the propriety of him (not) acting on his pledge now?

0 Replies

JustWonders wrote:

Ticomaya wrote:
JustWonders wrote:
She had a Super Duper Top Secret desk job at Langley, Tico

"Double" secret?

Yep...and a bumper sticker that says "Honk If You're Covert Like Me" LOL.

Shoulda known when I saw her wearing her "spy" costume for her Vanity Fair photo-op.

0 Replies

cicerone imposter wrote:

png, Excellent post; it's straightforward and factual. Looking forward to reading more of your posts.

You gotta be kidding me.

0 Replies

parados wrote:

Tico wrote:
Or you meant to say something else. I do not think your are dense, nor do I think you haven't been paying attention. I trust I don't need to set forth here again the very specific legal definition of "covert agent" for you? I know you have read it before, so are you seriously contending that "undercover" is synonymous with that legal definition in the IIPA? That would be a ridiculous thing to claim. I'm sure you meant to say something else.

In the off-chance that you actually meant it, care to explain how you contend "undercover" and "covert agent" are synonymous?
Failure to cite a specific law that covers an "undercover agent" as opposed to a "covert agent" makes them synonymous in this instance.

Hmm. I'm not sure I agree. Am I correctly following your bizarre logic: If I called her a "hungry hippo," but failed to cite a specific law that covers a "hungry hippo" -- as opposed to a "covert agent" -- then in your view, the two would be synonymous?

Quote:

You can not show me a way that revealing the name of an undercover agent rises to the standard of breaking the law unless they are also covert.

I'm telling ya ... ask Cyclops.

Quote:

All covert agents are undercover ...

... or were within 5 years, ...

Quote:

... but not all undercover agents are necessarily covert.

True.

Quote:

Only revealing the names of a covert agent is against the law. If it is determined to be against the law to reveal the name of a specific "undercover" agent then that agent must be covert. There is no other logical explanation.

That is your position, which Cyclops disagrees with.

Quote:

Spin away Tico. The sky is not green no matter how many times you question the color of blue it is.

Have you ever seen a purple sky right before a tornado? :wink:

0 Replies

Thomas wrote:

Ticomaya wrote:
Surely the dissemination of an "undercover" operative's name must be illegal. But it does not appear the IIPA proscribes such action.

In your opinion, Tico, is there any room between 'illegal' and 'nothing wrong with it'? Say I grant you for the sake of the argument that Rove leaked Valery Plame's identity without breaking any law. In this case, how would that affect your opinion about Mr. Bush having pledged to fire the leak "whoever it is", and about the propriety of him (not) acting on his pledge now?

Why bring politics into a nice discussion of the law?

There is a lot of room between "illegal" and "nothing wrong with it." Don't you agree?

As far as Bush's pledge, as I've pointed out several times, my understanding is the first time he was asked this question in 2003, he tied his action to a violation of the law. Then in 2004, he was less precise, but stated that it was up to the Atty Gen. to determine the facts. His comment this year was squarely in line with his first statement.

If Rove is indicted, I think Bush should ask Rove to resign ... even though that does not mean he did anything illegal.

0 Replies

Stop pulling me into this!

I've never defended your position, Tico. Just saying that I don't think enough information is available to make conclusive determinations that she broke this ONE particular law.

lol

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

Thomas, I've tried to probe Tico about whether he has any consciousness of the wrongness of what Rove did, but it appears he's too impressed with his own ability to obfuscate with legalese BS to bother with little things like that.

0 Replies

Well, he IS a lawyer. How can you expect him to act differently?

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

I quit wasting my time reading tico's posts.

0 Replies

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Stop pulling me into this!

I've never defended your position, Tico. Just saying that I don't think enough information is available to make conclusive determinations that she broke this ONE particular law.

lol

Cycloptichorn

lol. I just love pitting liberals against one another whenever I can.

And I completely agree with you on this point.

0 Replies

snood wrote:

Thomas, I've tried to probe Tico about whether he has any consciousness of the wrongness of what Rove did, but it appears he's too impressed with his own ability to obfuscate with legalese BS to bother with little things like that.

That must have been before you tried to insult me for my choice of avatar.

0 Replies

cicerone imposter wrote:

I quit wasting my time reading tico's posts.

Certainly your right to do so, c.i.

0 Replies

Ticomaya wrote:

JustWonders wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
JustWonders wrote:
She had a Super Duper Top Secret desk job at Langley, Tico

"Double" secret?

Yep...and a bumper sticker that says "Honk If You're Covert Like Me" LOL.

Shoulda known when I saw her wearing her "spy" costume for her Vanity Fair photo-op.

This was after she was already outed and was wearing a scarf. nice try but I wonder why you feel the need. Just keep sticking to your covert canard. :wink:

0 Replies

Ticomaya wrote:

snood wrote:
Thomas, I've tried to probe Tico about whether he has any consciousness of the wrongness of what Rove did, but it appears he's too impressed with his own ability to obfuscate with legalese BS to bother with little things like that.

That must have been before you tried to insult me for my choice of avatar.

Still, though - one would think you could over yourself long enough to address the intrinsic rightness or wrongness of what Rove did. And I didn't just try to insult your choice of avatar.

0 Replies

Quote:

lol. I just love pitting liberals against one another whenever I can.

And I completely agree with you on this point.

Naturally. Now, the question is, are you arguing that there IS sufficient evidence to prove that she DOESN'T apply to this one particular law?

Cause my advice to Parados, in that case, would be to continue forwarding an argument. If it is a case of 'we'll have to wait and see' then I would say to drop it, or he would just be wasting his time playing word games with a proffessional word-gamer.

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:
lol. I just love pitting liberals against one another whenever I can.

And I completely agree with you on this point.

Naturally. Now, the question is, are you arguing that there IS sufficient evidence to prove that she DOESN'T apply to this one particular law?

Cause my advice to Parados, in that case, would be to continue forwarding an argument. If it is a case of 'we'll have to wait and see' then I would say to drop it, or he would just be wasting his time playing word games with a proffessional word-gamer.

Cycloptichorn

I am NOT claiming there is known evidence proving she is not a "covert agent."

0 Replies

snood wrote:

Ticomaya wrote:
snood wrote:
Thomas, I've tried to probe Tico about whether he has any consciousness of the wrongness of what Rove did, but it appears he's too impressed with his own ability to obfuscate with legalese BS to bother with little things like that.

That must have been before you tried to insult me for my choice of avatar.

Still, though - one would think you could over yourself long enough to address the intrinsic rightness or wrongness of what Rove did.

Your earlier "probing" consisted of asking me whether I thought Rove acted with "ill intent." I asked you to define what you meant by that vague phrase, and you never did. You do not believe Rove's effort was to correct the implication that Cheney sent Wilson to Niger, so you spewed forth with a list of what you consider to be historical bad deeds of Karl Rove, and your opinion that these prior bad acts demonstrated that he was performing some sort of "attack politics," which you find to be reprehensible. You also implied that I didn't have a "shred of decency" nor a "modicum of common sense," but did suggest that I had "questionable morals," keeping with your preference to insult rather than discuss rationally.

Quote:

And I didn't just try to insult your choice of avatar.

Then you insulted me personally, and that post was deleted. You must be proud.

0 Replies

Whether Rove or others such as Libby or even the President (for he can never be taken out of the equation) acted with ill intent is quite moot. They acted with ill intent as is customary for them: they didn't like Wilson's song, thus they sought not to address the merits of it but rather attack the person behind it including his family. Bush made another of his "promises" (fire anyone responsible for the link and it wasn't conditional to any criminal charges) and obviously didn't follow trough (what do you expect from a weasel?).

They tried to push the Blame on their ill advised policies on anyone not to close to the inner circle such as the CIA (which tells us much about their care of the intelligence gathering when it doesn't suit their purposes).

And in the final analysis Wilson was much vindicated: Africa had no part in Saddam's nuclear program for there was no such program nor any other piles of WMD, the original hawkish idea of going to war. To this date Bush can't talk about the war in clear and non-misleading terms about the reasons we went to war for basically he would disclose his own deception.

The whole affair wouldn't be one if it weren't for the backroom backstabbing politics the Bush administration is so found of.

No need to define ill intent in that case. Ill intent spells Bush administration.

0 Replies

Hi cicerone.

Thanks for your earlier kind comments.

0 Replies

A listing of Rove tactics is about getting a character reading of the man and how he goes about his business. I think his record speaks for itself.

0 Replies

Rove was the source of the Plame leak... so it appears

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know