War against Iraq is based on lies, lies and more lies

i'm getting tired of that constant refering to Hitler and his gang.

The jews are running out of credit concerning the Shoah. They refered too much to it in the past and now people are used to it. Ok, the Shoah was inhuman, a disgrace for mankind,.... But how much longer long do they want to 'profit' from it?

Norman Finkelstein, a jew ,says the Holocaust has been exploited to extort cash, that most 'survivors' are bogus and that too much money is spent commemorating the Nazi genocide.

We live now. What about Armenian holocaust? What about Cambodja, Congo, Ruanda? Millions of people died there too.

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frolic
Attacking people who attack you is justice and defense. Civilians killed by Israeli's is a result of collateral damage. Civilians killed by Palestinians are targeted. There is a vast difference. Apparently you can't see it or don't care to. As for the intifada I believe you should remember who the instigators were. You friendly peace loving Palestinians. That after they turned down the Camp David offer.
As to whether you can voice your opinion, Of course you may. However, just noted that all your posts are tinged with Anti- American venom

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Anti- American? Me? I love America! its a pity that such a moron leads it.

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OK, let us not refer to Hitler, let us refer to Leon Degrelle, the SS general, commander of the "Wallonia" Waffen SS division in the WWII. He escaped to the Francist Spain, and Russian justice would be happy to acquaint him with the rope and loop (I know that he is already in the hell). Not only for Jews: more than half of the 27 million Soviet casualties in the WWII were civilians, and SS contributed to majority of these.

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Majority of the Holocaust survivors are already dead of age and diseases. So, the financial burden on Germany will disappear very soon. Germany, by the way, all the time since the end of WWII was the most consistent country in the whole Europe in its policies against racism and anti-Semitism.
Switzerland was not demanded to pay reparations. Swiss authorities and army were not involved in massacres. Swiss banks have unjustfully appropriated the property of the Holocaust victims, they merely stole their assets, and now Swiss banks (and not Switzerland as a country) are being sued by successors of this property. They stole money, and they have to return it, whoever owned it, Jews or Zulus.

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Degrelle died in 1994. His Rex-party got about 10% of the votes in 1936 elections. So, he wasn't THE MAN for the average Belgian. BTW, he was a walloon and thus unacceptable for the Flemish.

Many East front fighters were encouraged by the church to fight against the Godless Bolsjeviks. Therefore, IMO Religion is the root of all evil in the world. Bush and his Bible Belt, Bin Laden and his Jihad, The Jews and their promised land, the vatican and its role in the spreading of AIDS and position during WWII.

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OK, I never claimed that all the Belgians were Nazi collaborators, just as not all the Germans were devout Nazis in 1933-45, I strongly believe that absolute majority were not. By the way, are not Wallons citizens of Belgium?
The same referes to the people involved in the reparation request procedures: some of them are frauds, but absolute majority is not.

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Foggy Bottom is not impressed with PNAC:

Democracy Domino Theory 'Not Credible'
A State Department report disputes Bush's claim that ousting Hussein will spur reforms in the Mideast, intelligence officials say

Los Angeles Timesanti-American sentiment is so pervasive that elections in the short term could lead to the rise of Islamic-controlled governments hostile to the United States. (Emphasis mine.)

Now here's an aspect of this that I have not heard discussed: should we invade and if we were to establish a democracy in Iraq, how would we react if the first people to win election under this new system were 2nd-cousins to Osama bin Laden? How could we prevent this without undermining the very democratic principles that we were allegedly trying to inspire?

And don't think that it won't happen. Even if the Islamic extremists make up a very small portion of the Iraqi population, they, like their extremist kinfolk around the world, make up in fervor what they are lacking in numbers (why do you think the GOP can rely so completely on the extremists in our own country to always come out and vote for their candidate?)

This demonstrates, once again, the problem with "imposing" democracy on another country.

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Why did the jews move to Palestine and not Australia, Argentine,...?

Because of the Bible, (and the bible is a great storybook. Especially the old testament. Much more action.) But when you start believing the bible is the word from God and you claim land, based on the bible and because you think you are the chosen people. Thats when the problems start.

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Quote:

frolic

i'm getting tired of that constant referring to Hitler and his gang.

The Jews are running out of credit concerning the Shoah. They refereed too much to it in the past and now people are used to it. OK, the Shoah was inhuman, a disgrace for mankind,.... But how much longer long do they want to 'profit' from it?

Your getting tired of referring to Hitler and his gang. I wonder how tired the people who where gassed and incinerated felt? It should be noted that Hitler and his gang which included a good part of the German and other European nationals were not the originators of the concept. Throughout history the favorite European sport was the scapegoating and massacre of Jews. That in my opinion still remains in the minds of many Europeans. It very easy for you as a member of the oppressor class to denigrate the feelings of the oppressed.

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There is no need to install democracy in Western understanding of this word in Iraq. Semi-democratic pro-Western regime of Jordanian type will do; I even would like to see the Jordanian prince Hassan el-Hashimi a future king of Iraq (by the way, Hashimite dynasty ruled in Iraq in 1921-58). The main objective of war, IMO, is intimidation of the rogue regimes throughout the world, proving them futility of any efforts to argue the Western (and not only American, by the way) domination.

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Jews are present in Australia and Argentine as well. The only place the Jews could claim on grounds of having there an independent country twice in history was the Canaan area (Palestine, by the way, is a term introduced by the Roman occupants, the indigenous name of the land is neither Israel and nor Palestine, but Canaan). And the necessary proofs, familiar to any European appeared in the Bible.
There were pragmatic motives as well. UK, the most influential superpower in the late 19th-early20th century, agreed to support the Jewish claims for the Ottomanic Palestine, but not for any other place.
Majority of the early Zionists were not only secular, they were actively antireligious and shared Leftist approaches. The oldest political party the founding fathers of Israel belonged to, the Labor Party, is a member in the Socialist International (in the past it had different names, but it is the same party).

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au1929 wrote:

Quote:
frolic

i'm getting tired of that constant referring to Hitler and his gang.

The Jews are running out of credit concerning the Shoah. They refereed too much to it in the past and now people are used to it. OK, the Shoah was inhuman, a disgrace for mankind,.... But how much longer long do they want to 'profit' from it?

Your getting tired of referring to Hitler and his gang. I wonder how tired the people who where gassed and incinerated felt? It should be noted that Hitler and his gang which included a good part of the German and other European nationals were not the originators of the concept. Throughout history the favorite European sport was the scapegoating and massacre of Jews. That in my opinion still remains in the minds of many Europeans. It very easy for you as a member of the oppressor class to denigrate the feelings of the oppressed.

me, a member of the oppressor?
You are really funny. Laughing

You know i had this sticker on my bike(had, because my bike was stolen a few years ago)

http://www.ptb.be/shop/shopimages/fascisme.jpg

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The Israeli are there, so we have to take that in account ofcourse.

Two countries, Israel and Palestina, with one common capital, Jerusalem is my dream too. I'm not against the state Israel. But i'm afraid that the current Israel Govt is not interested in peace. Sharon seized power because of the violence and stayed in power last elections(despite the fraud scandal) because of the violence. He has built his political career on violence. BTW, if u look at the parties he formed coalition with you know he isn't looking for peace.

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frolic wrote:

The Israeli are there, so we have to take that in account ofcourse.

Two countries, Israel and Palestina, with one common capital, Jerusalem is my dream too. I'm not against the state Israel. But i'm afraid that the current Israel Govt is not interested in peace.

COMMENT:

By now, it has to be evident that there will NEVER be anything resembling true peace in the Middle East so long as a state of Israel exists.

Everyone in that area seems to hate everyone else -- and they are among the most hard-headed group of supposedly intelligent animals ever assembled in one place.

Solomon had the cure.

Not two states -- but no state.

Run by outsiders -- under outsider's rules.

Anyone who cannot get along has a choice of finding living accomodations somewhere else -- or the are confined in some kind of mass prison area.

No Israel. No Palestine. No nothing until everyone learns to play well with others. 'Til then -- its "up to your room."

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Ok, i'm gonna put this thread back on track.

What case do the US have against Iraq to justify a war?

self-defence after 9/11? NO

WMD that threaten the US? NO

anyone else with a strong case?

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War against Iraq is based on lies, lies and more lies

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