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Has the Schiavo case Become a Political Football?

 
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 01:57 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
parados wrote:
woiyo wrote:
Quote:
2. He knowingly entered into what is legally and adulterous affair, (which is grounds for a divorce), without terminating his prior relationship.


Care to tell us what law makes it illegal to have an affair. Or the law that even defines affair?

Then tell us how having an affair means you have no rights. This argument is silly at best woiyo. Completely bogus.


Here you go ....

Florida Statutes, TITLE XLVI (Crimes).... wrote:
798.01 Living in open adultery.--Whoever lives in an open state of adultery shall be guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083. Where either of the parties living in an open state of adultery is married, both parties so living shall be deemed to be guilty of the offense provided for in this section.



Cool Cool Cool

Give that man a cigar!
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 01:59 pm
Lol, a misdemeanor is hardly a law that strips rights away from people. It's on the same level as minor drug possession and speeding.

From my same link above:

Quote:
After the malpractice case judgment, evidence of disaffection between the Schindlers and Michael Schiavo openly emerged for the first time. The Schindlers petitioned the courtto remove Michael as Guardian. They made allegations that he was not caring for Theresa, and that his behavior was disruptive to Theresa's treatment and condition.

Proceedings concluded that there was no basis for the removal of Michael as Guardian. Further, it was determined that he had been very aggressive and attentive in his care of Theresa. His demanding concern for her well being and meticulous care by the nursing home earned him the characterization by the administrator as "a nursing home administrator's nightmare". It is notable that through more than thirteen years after Theresa's collapse, she has never had a bedsore.

By 1994, Michael's attitude and perspective about Theresa's condition changed. During the previous four years, he had insistently held to the premise that Theresa could recover and the evidence is incontrovertible that he gave his heart and soul to her treatment and care. This was in the face of consistent medical reports indicating that there was little or no likelihood for her improvement.

In early 1994 Theresa contracted a urinary tract infection and Michael, in consultation with Theresa's treating physician, elected not to treat the infection and simultaneously imposed a "do not resuscitate" order should Theresa experience cardiac arrest. When the nursing facility initiated an intervention to challenge this decision, Michael cancelled the orders. Following the incident involving the infection, Theresa was transferred to another skilled nursing facility.

Michael's decision not to treat was based upon discussions and consultation with Theresa's doctor, and was predicated on his reasoned belief that there was no longer any hope for Theresa's recovery. It had taken Michael more than three years to accommodate this reality and he was beginning to accept the idea of allowing Theresa to die naturally rather than remain in the non-cognitive, vegetative state. It took Michael a long time to consider the prospect of getting on with his life - something he was actively encouraged to do by the Schindlers, long before enmity tore them apart. He was even encouraged by the Schindlers to date, and introduced his in-law family to women he was dating. But this was just prior to the malpractice case ending.


Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:00 pm
OCCOM BILL wrote:
Does it really have to be impossible to have a discussion that doesn't disintegrate into a mindless hyper-partisan Bush bashing fest? Rolling Eyes

DrewDad, we all saw that unrelated, irrelevant snipe from you the first half a dozen or so times you posted it. I for one would not support any legislation that suggested the public should pick up the tab for maintaining vegetables. Nowhere is that addressed in the bill Bush signed the other night and it is not an integral part of any debate I've seen on this case. NO hypocrisy can be drawn there and even if there were it would have NOTHING to do with the subject at hand. Some members have proven utterly incapable of refraining from sharing their irrational hyper-partisan hatred. Try not to follow their lead.

Snipe?

1. I don't think I've ever fallen into the hyper-partisan mindset. I will admit that I do not like Bush or his policies, in part because I see him as the poster child for hyper-partisanship.

2. The title of the thread seems to indicate a discussion of the political implications of the Schiavo case.

3. There are other places on A2K to discuss the legal, philosophical, or medical implications of the case.

From my viewpoint, the politicians are cynically using the case for political gain.

I think the parents are misguided, but that they are acting from pure motives. Leaving out possible sinister motives on Michael's part, Terri's brother and sister have both confirmed that she would not wish to live on in her present condition.

The parents have lost all the court battles, now they are trying to try the case in the court of public opinion. Fair enough, I might do the same.

But I've heard so many misinformed opinions on this subject. By the same people. Over and over. Who refuse to acknowledge when they are in error on the facts of the case.

So forgive me if I repeat myself; I'm just posting in the spirit of the thread. Sad
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:08 pm
It would seem that the more America disagrees with the Republican neoconservative lunacy, the more insane the tactics become.

Michael has been wanting to pull the feeding tube for years, as he's tried everything a loyal husband could possibly do. And if she expressed to Michael that she would never want to exist in this state, then it's the disgusting and egregious acts of these neocons, none of whom either know/knew Terri or have ever met her in person, who have decided that government interference is fine and dandy when it comes to ONE person.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to read the conservative blogs and see a backlash by the religious zealots who are railing against their neoconservative Congressmen for NOT doing enough.

Bush rushes back from his vacation to sign this bill. But did he rush back after THOUSANDS upon THOUSANDS had died in Southeast Asia? Did he rush to the funerals of fallen U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq? Did he rush to be as forthcoming as possible to the 9/11 commission, who were investigating the deaths of over 3,000 innocent victims?

Actions speak considerably louder than words. Perhaps America is finally realizing this through the blunders of a morally corrupt administration.
0 Replies
 
Bella Dea
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:09 pm
I think the parents should be ashamed of themselves for allowing their daughter to exist like this for so long. If anyone is the animal here it is them, not the husband. How could you be so selfish as to let someone you love so much be like Terri is?
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:25 pm
Quote:
In 1997, when Michael filed the petition to remove the feeding tube, there was STILL $700,000 in Terri's trust account to pay for her long-term care and rehabilitation.
Any evidence to support this allegation?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:29 pm
And the curtain opens to reveal The Texas Futile Care Law signed by...yes, George W. Bush.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:29 pm
Ticomaya wrote:
Florida Statutes, TITLE XLVI (Crimes).... wrote:
798.01 Living in open adultery.--Whoever lives in an open state of adultery shall be guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083. Where either of the parties living in an open state of adultery is married, both parties so living shall be deemed to be guilty of the offense provided for in this section.


I've thought, this was history? It goes furtheron:

Quote:
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.02--Lewd and lascivious behavior:
'If any man and woman, not being married to each other, lewdly and lasciviously associate and cohabit together, or if any man or woman, married or unmarried, is guilty of open and gross lewdness and lascivious behavior, they shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison not exceeding two years, or in the county jail not exceeding one year, or by fine not exceeding three hundred dollars.'
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.03--Fornication:
'If any man commits fornication with a woman, each of them shall be punished by imprisonment not exceeding three months, or by fine not exceeding thirty dollars.'
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.04--White persons and Negroes living in adultery:
'If any white person and negro, or mulatto, shall live in adultery or fornication with each other, each shall be punished by imprisonment not exceeding twelve months, or by fine not exceeding one thousand dollars.'
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.05--Negro man and white woman or white man and Negro woman occupying same room:
'Any negro man and white woman, or any white man and negro woman, who are not married to each other, who shall habitually live in and occupy in the nighttime the same room shall each be punished by imprisonment not exceeding twelve months, or by fine not exceeding five hundred dollars.'
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:33 pm
blatham wrote:
And the curtain opens to reveal The Texas Futile Care Law signed by...yes, George W. Bush.


A quick reading of that Texas law reveals the following ....

Quote:
ยง 166.034. ISSUANCE OF NONWRITTEN DIRECTIVE BY COMPETENT
ADULT QUALIFIED PATIENT. (a) A competent qualified patient who
is an adult may issue a directive by a nonwritten means of
communication.
(b) A declarant must issue the nonwritten directive in the
presence of the attending physician and two witnesses who qualify
under Section 166.003, at least one of whom must be a witness who
qualifies under Section 166.003(2).
(c) The physician shall make the fact of the existence of
the directive a part of the declarant's medical record, and the
names of the witnesses shall be entered in the medical record.


Nonwritten directives must be witnessed by the attending physician and two witnesses.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:37 pm
Debra, We are waiting for proof that Michael did not spend any of that money on Terri's health care and attempts to regain her health.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:37 pm
woiyo,
Thanks for the link. Did you bother to check out the penalties for it?

I am curious when Florida last enforced this law but that will have to wait for another day. Imagine the furor if all those old people cohabitating were suddenly arrested.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:38 pm
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
Florida Statutes, TITLE XLVI (Crimes).... wrote:
798.01 Living in open adultery.--Whoever lives in an open state of adultery shall be guilty of a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083. Where either of the parties living in an open state of adultery is married, both parties so living shall be deemed to be guilty of the offense provided for in this section.


I've thought, this was history? It goes furtheron:

Quote:
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.02--Lewd and lascivious behavior:
'If any man and woman, not being married to each other, lewdly and lasciviously associate and cohabit together, or if any man or woman, married or unmarried, is guilty of open and gross lewdness and lascivious behavior, they shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison not exceeding two years, or in the county jail not exceeding one year, or by fine not exceeding three hundred dollars.'
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.03--Fornication:
'If any man commits fornication with a woman, each of them shall be punished by imprisonment not exceeding three months, or by fine not exceeding thirty dollars.'
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.04--White persons and Negroes living in adultery:
'If any white person and negro, or mulatto, shall live in adultery or fornication with each other, each shall be punished by imprisonment not exceeding twelve months, or by fine not exceeding one thousand dollars.'
Fla.Stat.Ann. s 798.05--Negro man and white woman or white man and Negro woman occupying same room:
'Any negro man and white woman, or any white man and negro woman, who are not married to each other, who shall habitually live in and occupy in the nighttime the same room shall each be punished by imprisonment not exceeding twelve months, or by fine not exceeding five hundred dollars.'


Shocked

Last two appear to have been invalidated in McLAUGHLIN v. FLORIDA, 379 U.S. 184 (1964). LINK
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:38 pm
If you indeed are an attorney, unfounded charges must be proved in a court of law. So far, it's 19 Florida judges against you. Who do you think I'm going to believe?
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:39 pm
parados wrote:
woiyo,
Thanks for the link. Did you bother to check out the penalties for it?

I am curious when Florida last enforced this law but that will have to wait for another day. Imagine the furor if all those old people cohabitating were suddenly arrested.


If you're talking about the crime of "adultery," the penalty is up to 60 days in jail and up to a $500 fine (second degree misdemeanor).
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:40 pm
Bella Dea wrote:
I think the parents should be ashamed of themselves for allowing their daughter to exist like this for so long. If anyone is the animal here it is them, not the husband. How could you be so selfish as to let someone you love so much be like Terri is?


EXACTLY, Bella. It truly makes so sense. But there seems to be MUCH more to this than meets the eye, as political ideologies are trumping common sense in Terri's case.

I feel for her parents, and I also feel for Michael's pain as he tried, for years, to do whatever he could to help Terri. Are those the actions of a man who would want to "murder" his wife?

These neoconservative operatives are truly disgusting. Bush will ONLY rush back from a vacation when his political future depends on it, tsunami victims, 9/11 victims, and American/Iraqi victims be damned!
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:40 pm
... and no removal of rights, in any case, whatsoever.

This line of argument is dead.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:41 pm
cicerone imposter wrote:
If you indeed are an attorney, unfounded charges must be proved in a court of law. So far, it's 19 Florida judges against you. Who do you think I'm going to believe?


I'm assuming this was intended for Debra, c.i.?
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:42 pm
Tico,

You mean it isn't an automatic divorce for adultery? Or the loss of any marriage rights? How can that be?
Wioyo has been saying he should lose all his rights for adultery. You mean he wasn't correct?
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:43 pm
The judicial system only works for Republican neoconservatives when they rule in their favor.

I thought everybody knew that by now?
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2005 02:45 pm
And, once again, John Stewart's "The Daily Show" hits this squarely on its head:

http://www.edwardsdavid.com/BushVideos/dailyshow_schiavo_congressional_meddle_050321-01.rm

http://www.democraticunderground.com/images/homepage/20050322_stewart.jpg
0 Replies
 
 

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