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Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Feb, 2005 12:35 pm
Thanks a lot for that really great job, Piffka!


Piffka wrote:
I was astonished to read (somewhere) that China had a reported CO[size=7]2[/size] drop of 17% in emissions since 1990. I'm still trying to find a good report that provides totals & trends on the most recent world-wide emissions. Most report statistics by industry (notably coal, gas, oil) and don't include country totals.


I'm not sure, if you were looking for something like this fossil-fuel CO2 emissions database. (Its called: Global, Regional, and National Annual CO2 Emissions from Fossil-Fuel Burning, Cement Production, and Gas Flaring: 1751-2000 (revised August 2003), and the data can be found following the link on the webside. ['China' starts at No. 2549 in the database].
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Feb, 2005 01:42 pm
What conclusions should we draw from the quoted material above?

1. That there is a good deal of disagreement (and some real bickering) among the scientists and economists involved in developing and verifying the models for projecting economic and emissions growth.

2. That scientists are often quick to make sweeping pronouncements in areas well outside their areas of expertise.

3. That the United States has managed to do a better job of combining economic growth with emissions reduction than any of the other nations reported?

And your point was.....?
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Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Thu 3 Feb, 2005 04:32 pm
That third conclusion looks faulty. That emissions drop for the United States was only reported from industry and is apparently not a national total of all emissions. Meanwhile, China has had a remarkably high economic growth. LA Times reports last week that:

Quote:
The economic acceleration at year-end lifted growth for all of 2004 also to 9.5%, the fastest rate in eight years. By comparison, the much-larger U.S. economy has been increasing at about a 4% annualized rate.


http://www.latimes.com/media/thumbnails/graphic/2005-01/16004164.gif


From the link Walter provided (I calculated the changes):
National CO2 Emissions from Fossil-Fuel Burning (Gas, Liquid, Solid)
*** August 28, 2003 ***

Source:
Gregg Marland
Tom Boden
Carbon Dioxide Information Analysis Center
Oak Ridge National Laboratory
Oak Ridge, Tennessee 37831-6335

All emission estimates are expressed in thousand metric tons of carbon.


Chinese Total CO2 Fossil Fuel Emissions
YEAR.........TOTAL.........CHANGE
1990.........654710.........
1991.........687542.........+32832
1992.........721323.........+33718
1993.........760462.........+39139
1994.........807334.........+46872
1995.........872721.........+64387
1996.........912318.........+39597
1997.........898820.........-13498
1998.........850695.........-48125
1999.........771022.........-79673
2000.........761586.........-9436........(difference since 1990 +106,876)


Total USA CO2 Fossil Fuel Emissions
YEAR.........TOTAL.........CHANGE
1990.........1314813
1991.........1313745.........-1068
1992.........1315580.........+1853
1993.........1392124.........+76544
1994.........1417184.........+25060
1995.........1417827.........+643
1996.........1440012.........+22185
1997.........1487066.........+47054
1998.........1500782.........+13716
1999.........1502889.........+2107
2000.........1528796.........+25907 (difference since 1990 +213,983)
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 03:51 am
blatham wrote:
thomas

Do you have data on how the insurance industry is preparing for or speaking about GW?

I don't have data. Based on what little I know about the insurance industry, global warming isn't a risk that fits their business model, so I would expect them to avoid it.

Insurance companies make money by turning their customers' unpredictable risks into predictable costs. They take a risk that strikes few claimants every year and spread it over many policy holders. That way, the combined risk of all policy holders averages out to a predictable cost for the insurance company, which charges it to its customers in form of insurance premiums. But global warming is a hard risk to spread, no matter how large it is. If it's benign, it's benign for every policy holder. If it's harmful, it's harmful for every policy holder. In other words, the risk is systemic, and so the risks of the many policy holders don't add up to a neat, predictable average for the insurance company.

Insurance companies don't like that kind of risk, and they try hard to avoid it. For example, the industry lost a lot of money when it discovered that asbestos was a systemic risk in their house insurance policies, and they have become much more reluctant selling insurance policies covering asbestos risks. With all that in mind, my (fairly confident) guess is that you'll find it hard to buy insurance that explicitly protects you from global warming. I'm pretty sure that insurance companies will phase out insurance policies where global warming factors in implicitly. And I'm also pretty sure there are some environmentalist organizations who interpret this behavior to mean that the risks of global warming are large -- which they may well happen to be, but that's not why insurance companies would be avoiding them.
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 04:06 am
Piffka wrote:
Please point out the contradiction. This is how that chapter ends:
Quote:
It would be useful to pay more explicit attention in integrated-assessment economic models to other kinds of potential shocks, perhaps focusing on major changes in water and agriculture systems for the United States as well as to shifts in monsoonal patterns or droughts in other regions. This effort is hampered to date, however, because there are few scenarios for abrupt climate change that have been handed off by geoscientists to the economic modelers. [...]

Yes. And the rest of the chapter explains, among other things, the likely scope of the uncertainty. Because producing food isn't a hard problem anymore -- only 1% of American GDP is devoted to food production -- climate change can increase that cost by a large percentage without the consequences becoming catastrophic on a national or international level.

Piffka wrote:
How can you "adapt to the consequences" when you don't know the scope of the consequences?

If you don't know the scope of the consequences, you also don't know the scope of the prevention effort needed. So this argument doesn't tell us whether it's better policy to prevent global warming, or to adapt to it.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 07:06 am
thomas

Thanks. I was also thinking of winter sports industries. I know that some 60 US resorts teamed up with McCain and Lieberman on their GW initiative. I don't follow the ski press any longer, but I'll wager the European resorts are likewise alert. Many resorts are located at elevation/climate boundaries that make minimal changes in average winter temperatures critical to their survival. Have you noted much in the business press on these folks as a corporate voice in this context?
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 07:20 am
It would make sense -- the rule of thumb here is that 100 meters in height cause a 0.6°C drop in temperature. (I'm sure there's a corresponding rule in imperial units.) So according to middle-of-the road IPCC projections of 3°C over 100 years, the snow cover would move up 100 meters in 20 years, which probably would cut into the profit margins of some ski resorts. Things like this may well happen. Then again -- on my list of problems the world's leaders should worry about, the problem whether I can ski in Davos over my Easter holidays ranks pretty low. Of course, the operators of ski lifts in Davos may see it differently.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 07:30 am
So would I and all the other bronzed ski gods like myself.
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McTag
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 07:31 am
Thomas- since you are in Germany, as I was recently, perhaps you saw the article in "Stern" magazine about this subject, and the photographs of Uppsala Glacier (in Patagonia?) comparing the 1910 condition with today's.
Very dramatic.
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 08:18 am
Perhaps they had some space to fill waiting for the next incarnation of "The Hitler Diaries".

The selective reporting of freezing/melting phenomena in a global climate that for eons has undergone continual temporal and geographic changes, on scales large and small - proves nothing, except to willing, credulous minds.

The ice sheets around the Antartic peninsula have been shrinking for decades, while the the ice accumulation at the core of the continent has been growing in a far more substantial way.


edited to appease Blatham
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 08:28 am
Sure...just like you to make a gontinent-thickening argument.
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Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 08:47 am
McTag wrote:
Thomas- since you are in Germany, as I was recently, perhaps you saw the article in "Stern" magazine about this subject, and the photographs of Uppsala Glacier (in Patagonia?) comparing the 1910 condition with today's.
Very dramatic.

I only read the Stern at the dentist's, so I'm unfamiliar with the photographs of Uppsala Glacier. I do know several similar comparisons of glaciers in the Alps though, and I believe you that the comparison you saw was dramatic. What I don't know is how much of this can be attributed to selective reporting, and how much of it is real. But judging by the reporting on the impact of airplane exhaust, I'm inclined to think selective reporting. (This thread of reporting often features impressive satellite pictures of a Europe covered with airplane contrails, but not a single natural cloud -- until you realize the pictures always seem to be from the same day.)
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McTag
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 09:59 am
Well Thomas, I hope you don't have to go back to the dentist soon- but the pictures were "die Muehe wert".

I hope, too, that George does not have to learn, any time soon, new words for the old hymn

"From Greenland's icy mountains
To India's coral strand...."
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 10:29 am
At least there are some clouds on the Stern photos

http://www.stern.de/_content/53/62/536254/Heft_07_2005_buehne_162.jpg

And, yes, Thomas, this report is very similar to the one about the Alpine clacier, which was published some time ago (2½ years)
Historic Alps Postcards: A Tool in Documenting Glacial Melt
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HofT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 14 Feb, 2005 10:30 am
I'm familiar with glaciers in the Swiss Alps, and can confirm they used to be much smaller than they are today >

"The results show ages within at least 8 distinct periodsduring the Holocene, indicating that periods with smaller than today's glaciers must have occurred naturally"
http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:2opzx7p-aLgJ:www.cosis.net/abstracts/EAE03/11947/EAE03-J-11947.pdf+alpine+glaciers+ch&hl=en

> even though they've shrunk a lot in the last century. McTag - if you can prove jet contrails or SUVs in the Holocene, your Nobel prize is in the mail.
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McTag
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Feb, 2005 02:37 am
HofT wrote:
I'm familiar with glaciers in the Swiss Alps, and can confirm they used to be much smaller than they are today >

"The results show ages within at least 8 distinct periodsduring the Holocene, indicating that periods with smaller than today's glaciers must have occurred naturally"
http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:2opzx7p-aLgJ:www.cosis.net/abstracts/EAE03/11947/EAE03-J-11947.pdf+alpine+glaciers+ch&hl=en

> even though they've shrunk a lot in the last century. McTag - if you can prove jet contrails or SUVs in the Holocene, your Nobel prize is in the mail.


Well that's interesting. Glaciers grow, then they shrink again.

HofT, I am not pitching for any scientific accolades; many times here I have said I am merely an interested onlooker. Disturbed weather patterns affect us all, some to the peril of our lives, and many people, academic and otherwise, are seeking the reasons for the disrupted weather we have all noted in the last ten years.

I am not comfortable with the opinion that it's all cyclical, and nothing particular to worry about; or at best, there's nothing we should or can do about it anyway.

Until the "experts" agree, nothing will be done anyway, that's clear. Until then, no doubt we will fight more wars over more oil to burn, and we Europeans will continue to resist immigration from drought-ravaged Africa.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Feb, 2005 12:41 am
The Kyoto Protocol burdened with the challenge of saving the world from global warming has come into force since 1 1/2 hour by now.

Quote:
Can Kyoto really save the world?
The Kyoto deal has been hailed as proof that the world's nations can co-operate to confront climate change. It has also been derided as an empty exercise in political posturing. The truth is that it is both
By Hamish McRae
16 February 2005


After seven years, huge international debate and the freezing out of George Bush's United States from the international community, the Kyoto Protocol is formally ratified today.

The agreement, which seeks to limit the world's carbon emissions, was signed by 84 countries in Japan's former capital city in 1997. It bound the industrialised countries to cut emissions by 5 per cent from their 1990 level by 2012.

The treaty has been hailed as the key step forward in confronting the environmental challenges posed by climate change. But it remains controversial: is it a great leap forward in international co-operation or another example of empty political posturing? Or maybe, just maybe, something of both?

The case for cutting the global output of greenhouse gases is the link between such emissions and global warming - a link still unproven but for which there is strong circumstantial evidence. This is accepted by most industrialised nations.

But for the agreement to become international law two things had to happen. One was that 55 countries had to get it approved by their national legislatures. The other was that the countries approving it had include a sufficient number of industrial countries to account for 55 per cent of their global emissions in 1990.

The first target was relatively easily met, but the "early signers" were largely small countries that did not use a lot of energy. The second was tougher, particularly since in March 2001, the new US President, George Bush, said his country was not prepared to ratify the treaty. The US unsurprisingly is the world's largest user of energy (and hence accounts for 36 per cent of carbon emissions of the industrial countries) so the second hurdle became harder to surmount. But last November Russia, which had previously indicated it would not sign up, switched sides. Russia has been a huge (and inefficient) user of energy and accounted for more than 17 per cent of global emissions in 1990. Suddenly the 55 per cent barrier was breached and the protocol could become law.

For many people this is a time for rejoicing, an example of international co-operation for a common good. Like the Montreal Protocol of 1987, which banned the production of CFCs, it has demonstrated that countries were prepared to implement policies that might act against their short-term national self-interest in order to promote long-term global environmental aims. Countries that have refused to ratify Kyoto, most notably the US and Australia, are duly pilloried. President Bush has been particularly singled out as a bad global citizen.

For others, this has been an exercise that at best is wishful thinking and at worst hypocrisy. Unlike the Montreal Protocol, which had a clear objective and clear benefits - reducing the damage to the ozone layer - Kyoto is both badly constructed and uncertain in its impact. And the countries that matter most have not signed up.

How should the thoughtful non-specialist respond to these conflicting perspectives? What we really want to know is whether in 20 or 30 years' time it will be seen as an important first step towards keeping the world a habitable place, or as a failed experiment, setting the wrong priorities and actually making future international co-operation more difficult to sustain. Perhaps the best way forward is to look at the criticisms of Kyoto and then see whether, despite those criticisms, it is still a useful process.

Take first the argument that it is badly constructed and in particular that it excludes the country that is increasing its emissions fastest at the moment and which is now the second largest importer of oil: China. China is already the world's fifth or sixth-largest economy. It is growing at around 9 per cent a year and relies heavily on fossil fuels for powering this growth. Last year China installed as much new electricity generating capacity, mostly fossil fueled, as the entire electricity output of the UK.

And we have seen nothing yet. By the Kyoto target year of 2012 China will in all probability have become the world's third largest economy, behind only Japan and the US. Indeed were China not to have become the world's third-largest economy, everyone would be the worse for it as it would suggest some kind of political and economic collapse there, with all the misery that would entail.

The other great global giant, India, is also increasing its energy use. Its economy has been growing at almost as fast a pace, around 7-8 per cent a year. Its energy use at the moment is much lower, for it has not experienced such rapid industrialisation and its building boom has been more muted. But it has become almost as large a car market as China, has the world's largest road-building programme and the spread of air-conditioning will ensure that its energy use continues to soar.

So does the exclusion of these two giants - and much of the rest of the developing world - destroy the rationale of Kyoto? It certainly weakens it. Our perspectives of economic power have changed radically since 1997. Maybe we should have realised that the new industrial countries would determine the world's energy demands and hence its carbon emissions and sought to bring them into the tent. But the debate within both China and India in some ways supports the Kyoto ideal, even if neither country is bound by it. Anyone who has been to China recently will be aware of the problem of air pollution with which the country is wrestling. Shanghai is beset with power shortages. Within China there is a serious debate as to how it can continue to grow at its present pace without being held back by environmental pressures.

In India much the same debate is happening, too. It is clear that India cannot follow the Chinese growth model, for its population pressure is even greater and its natural resources scarcer. So it has to find a way of growing by using energy more efficiently. In lots of small ways - taxis, for example, run on natural gas - it is seeking to improve its environment standards.

So it is very much in the self-interest of both China and India to expand their economies in the "greenest" way possible. But how? Both use technology developed in the rich world. If that technology becomes more efficient, cleaner, and less carbon-intensive, they will apply it. Insofar as the efforts to meet Kyoto standards drive western Europe and Japan to develop better technology, that will inevitably improve the environmental performance of China, India, and other fast-growing developing countries.

So Kyoto helps China and India become cleaner, even though they are not bound by it.

What of the next criticism, that Kyoto does not fully reflect different countries' starting points? Well to some extent it does, as countries have been set different targets within the 5 per cent overall cut, so Switzerland has to cut its carbon output by 8 per cent while Australia increases its by the same amount. In addition, countries that take measures to absorb carbon, for example through reforestation, are allowed to unleash more of it. But the fundamental point does stand - it is easier for some countries to meet their targets than others.
For example, it is relatively easy for Russia to cut its energy use because in 1990 it had large and inefficient heavy industries that have now been shut down. And from a base of huge inefficiency, the first steps in cutting emissions are relatively easy - all you need do is to apply good practice developed elsewhere. Rationally you can argue that the Kyoto accord is not in Russia's self-interest, as not only would it benefit from a slightly warmer - and therefore more prosperous - Siberia, but as an exporter of oil and gas it would gain from the continuing energy profligacy of its main customer, Western Europe.

And yet, signing up costs Russia nothing. Russian membership of the club will not significantly affect global carbon emissions, but brings political benefits. It can present itself as a virtuous friend of the EU and of the international community - unlike the US.

A further point is that the targets do not fully reflect differences of population growth or economic success. For example, they do not take into account a shrinking population in Germany and a rising one in the US, nor Germany's economic stagnation or America's boom. When Kyoto was negotiated it was thought the fall in Germany's population would not begin until well past 2012. As things have turned out, it started last year. Meanwhile, America's population growth has run ahead of forecasts. Similar differences in economic performance were not expected either - and it would be hard to defend Kyoto if it became a way of punishing economic success.

But it should not become that. You can acknowledge that it is crude, despite the tweaks to try to make it less so. You can acknowledge that the information on which the original deal was based was flawed. But you can still believe that it nudges countries in the right direction rather than the wrong one.

Energy prices look likely to remain high for a generation. Countries that can grow - both in population and in living standards - without stretching energy supplies will find it easier to make progress than those that can't, so the agreement pushes countries towards policies that are, in general, in their self-interest. A US that had a more efficient car fleet now would be richer, for it would be better able to withstand high oil prices. Living standards would be higher and the dollar would be higher, for it would be less dependent on oil imports. Strategically too, it would be more secure.

Beyond economics there is such a thing as politics. Democracies have to work with the grain of public opinion. A Russian president can force through legislation in the way a US one cannot. Criticism of the US has to be tempered with an acknowledgment of the will of its people. Arguably by immediately acknowledging that Kyoto would never be passed by Congress, the present President was at least being more honest than his predecessor, who sidelined political debate on the matter until he was out of office.

Yet here again, while acknowledging the separation of powers in the US, it is surely possible also to acknowledge the power of persuasion. There is a significant minority within the US that seeks to reduce environmental damage caused by high energy use. The fashionable car for Hollywood stars is the hybrid Toyota Prius, which does more than 50mpg. America can look to places such as Copenhagen, which has over 20 years sought to get people out of cars and on to bikes and public transport - and has created a much more livable city than similar US cities. So politics can lead as well as follow and environmentalism feels modern in a way that profligate energy use does not.

There is one final line of criticism of Kyoto that needs to be acknowledged: that it is not the highest priority. Other aims, such as the elimination of malaria or combating Aids in Africa, have greater claims on scarce resources. The Danish statistician Bjørn Lomborg has controversially argued that Kyoto slows the growth of emissions by an insignificant amount at a very high cost. While it is certainly desirable to do so, it would better to put resources into the development of alternative energy and tackling the effects of global warming.

These objections need to be taken seriously. Economic resources - just like fossil fuels - are finite and they need to be directed where they will be most effective. Money spent on wind farms is money not available for drugs in Africa. But the best response to this, surely, is to see Kyoto as an early and imperfect step along a long and difficult road.

Its huge benefit is to focus attention on a global problem - and a global problem that the market cannot fix. The costs of global climate change are very long term and most uncertian. The markets can match supply and demand today but their focus is inevitably short-term. They find it hard to look 30 years out. And there are external costs - felt beyond the countries that produce and consume energy - that are carried by the world as a whole. That is why the world, or much of it, signed up to Kyoto and it is why we should celebrate today.

What matters most, though, is what happens next. Somewhere out in the future is the next generation of technologies that will wean the world off fossil fuels and provide it with renewable power. But we cannot see those clearly so meanwhile we have to be careful with what we have got.

If Kyoto encourages the hunt for the new technologies - as it has - that is worth something. If it makes us think a little more about our own use of energy that is worth something too. If it is the start of a wider global process of co-operation in conservation, then it is worth a huge amount. A good day for the world.
Source
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HofT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Feb, 2005 07:49 am
Walter - not only Lomborg but every statistician who has reviewed the cost-benefit ratio in the Kyoto scam has concluded it's cargo cult science. In the immortal words of the late Professor Feynman:
_____________________________________________________________

"In the South Seas there is a cargo cult of people. During the war they saw airplanes with lots of good materials, and they want the same thing to happen now. So they've arranged to make things like runways, to put fires along the sides of the runways, to make a wooden hut for a man to sit in, with two wooden pieces on his head to headphones and bars of bamboo sticking out like antennas--he's the controller--and they wait for the airplanes to land. They're doing everything right. The form is perfect. It looks exactly the way it looked before. But it doesn't work. No airplanes land. So I call these things cargo cult science, because they follow all the apparent precepts and forms of scientific investigation, but they're missing something essential, because the planes don't land."
_____________________________________________________________

http://www.physics.brocku.ca/etc/cargo_cult_science.html
_____________________________________________________________

The contortions of India and China, officially expected to improve their abysmal power plants during Kyoto phase 2 with the monies they cheerfully pocketed during phase 1, should convince you of the absurdity of the whole scheme.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Feb, 2005 08:05 am
What's the workup by economists on the cost-benefit ratio of the Iraq war? Or the institutionalization of torture by this administration? Or the cost-benefit ratio of losing a species? Of losing coral reefs? Of a lot of black and asian people disappearing?

The Pacific cargo cults are very interesting indeed. America, of course, borders the Pacific too.
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georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Feb, 2005 11:04 am
Sophistry and evasion. Beneath your usual standard.
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