Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

@Walter Hinteler,

I am not totally familar with where all the turbines are, Walter. I was in northern Jutland, observed many turbines throughout the area traveled, and was told the wind blows off the North Sea alot. It was most of the time I was there. Regardless of the primary concentration of wind turbines, and whether its mainly the Baltic Sea or North Sea, I think Denmark is blessed with wind more than many countries, so the fact that they still achieve only 25% of their generation capacity, that is a significant fact to consider.

2 Replies

@okie,

I don't think that Denmark gets more wind than most other countries. Why should they?

They started, however, to use wind turbines back in the 60's of last century to have an alternative to nuclear power.

According to all data I could find, wind doesn't "provide[s] a minority of their electrical generation" but is one of the major sources.

1 Reply

@okie,

The other obvious point about all of this, relative to Obama's claim for the 10 year plan, cartel oil is primarily important to transportation, to make gasoline. In order for this oil to be replaced with wind, solar, and geothermal, as Obama promised, you have to convert oil used to make gasoline with another source that can tap into wind, solar, and geothermal, such as electrical cars, thus charging them from electricity produced by wind, solar, and geothermal. First of all, that is another totally unrealistic goal, unsupportable by any facts, and even if you did, you would then increase the demand on electrical generating output nationwide in rather astounding proportions to attain the numbers he suggested, another totally unrealistic and unsubstantiated goal.

I stick by my assertion, Obama appears to be totally incompetent when it comes to energy.

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@Walter Hinteler,

Walter Hinteler wrote:

According to all data I could find, wind doesn't "provide[s] a minority of their electrical generation" but is one of the major sources.

Correction: wind is the largest energy source in Denmark.
Source

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

Denmark has much to commend it. It is tiny--just a little bit larger than our small State of Maryland--and enjoys a highly compatible and homogenous (and therefore happy) population, has some of the toughest immigration restrictions in the EU, and is blessed with resources that allows it to produce more energy than it uses. And bordered by lots of ocean and consistent winds, wind energy makes a lot of sense there. Most of the turbines are in the ocean--I previously posted pictures. It will be interesting to see how those hold up in the salt water spray and what the maintenance costs will ultimately be.

I don't know if Walter's source or this Wiki statement is more accurate. If Wiki is right re 2007, it is hard to believe that Denmark would have gone from 19.7% to more than 50% in less than two years.

Quote:

Wind power provided 19.7 percent of electricity production in Denmark in 2007, a significantly higher proportion than in any other country.[1][2][3] Denmark was a pioneer in developing commercial wind power during the 1970s, and today almost half of the wind turbines around the world are produced by Danish manufacturers such as Vestas.[4]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power_in_Denmark

A great deal of the USA--of the world in fact--is land locked however and there is insufficient wind in most place for that to be a reliable source. Certainly continued R&D needs to be put into wind energy, but it would make sense to leave that to private entrenprenours such as T Boone Pickens rather than have our govenrment resources put into that rather than much more efficient nuclear energy et al.

2 Replies

@Foxfyre,

Foxfyre wrote:

I don't know if Walter's source or this Wiki statement is more accurate. If Wiki is right re 2007, it is hard to believe that Denmark would have gone from 19.7% to more than 50% in less than two years.

Well, mine is Denmarks Energy Agency.
I don't know if its more accurate than Wiki.
But at least, it's the only oficial source for energy data etc

1 Reply

@Foxfyre,

Foxfyre wrote:

A great deal of the USA--of the world in fact--is land locked however and there is insufficient wind in most place for that to be a reliable source. Certainly continued R&D needs to be put into wind energy, but it would make sense to leave that to private entrenprenours such as T Boone Pickens rather than have our govenrment resources put into that rather than much more efficient nuclear energy et al.

Our (Germany's) main wind farms are inland - Europe's largest inland windfarm region (with more than 900 windturbines on a couple of square miles near Paderborn alone) is here where I live.

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@Walter Hinteler,

From your source:

Quote:

In 2007, electricity generation based on renewables
comprised 29.3 per cent of domestic electricity supply,
whereas this figure was 26.4 per cent the year before. The
greatest contribution in 2007 came from wind power, with
19.7 per cent.

I think you might have misread the information. Denmark does manufacture more than 50% of the wind turbines, but they are nowhere near generating 50 percent of their energy needs from wind power.

In fact that same Wiki article said that only about 10% to 14% of Denmark's energy consumption is from wind power. They sell off the remainder of the electricity produced by the wind turbines no doubt because it is generated during high winds faster than it can be stored or consumed locally.

So, if Denmark on the cutting edge of renewable energy isn't able to utilize wind power any more than that, how much more impossible would it be for a country the size of the USA to make more than a small dent in their energy needs via wind power?

1 Reply

@Foxfyre,

Foxfyre wrote:

I think you might have misread the information. Denmark does manufacture more than 50% of the wind turbines, but they are nowhere near generating 50 percent of their energy needs from wind power.

Sorry, did I really post that Denmark is generating 50% of their energy from wind power?

My fault if this happened (though I can't really see where I did so):

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

Walter Hinteler wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:

I think you might have misread the information. Denmark does manufacture more than 50% of the wind turbines, but they are nowhere near generating 50 percent of their energy needs from wind power.

Sorry, did I really post that Denmark is generating 50% of their energy from wind power?

My fault if this happened (though I can't really see where I did so):

No you didn't. I was the one who misread. But did the information say that the 10 to 14% wind generated electric power in Denmark is their largest energy source? I suppose that's possible, but it just doesn't seem reasonable.

1 Reply

@Foxfyre,

a) they've got by now nearly 25%
b) coal is still [2006/7 data] the largest energy source in Denmark (here it really was me who looked at the wrong graph)

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@Walter Hinteler,

Well its okay Walter. Its always humbling to all of us to admit fallibility, but alas, occasionally that seem to be necessary now and then. No harm no foul.

Anyhow, Denmark is a remarkable little country with much to commend it and I don't think development of wind power should be in any way discouraged anywhere that it might be practical. But it definitely is a spit in the ocean to think that wind power will be a major source of power most places in the world anytime in our lifetime, and we should not be diverting precious and limited public resources away from more viable sources of energy to meet our growing energy needs.

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

Also, Walter, your graph only shows electrical generation, it apparently does not show all energy consumption in Denmark.

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@Foxfyre,

Denmark is a nice country, however, they are also experiencing some dark clouds on the horizon, one being the Muslim problem. Muslims demand they have their own justice system, etc. etc., and the numbers are becoming fairly significant in that country. Riots and unrest have reared their ugly heads in Denmark, relative to this. When we visited there a few years ago, we were told the story of a man paying his son to kill his sister, the mans daughter, because she dated a Danish boy. It was an honor killing, and then they demanded they were not subject to Danish law.

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Also, Walter, your graph only shows electrical generation, it apparently does not show all energy consumption in Denmark.

In fairness to Walter, he was only addressing electrical energy.

But the information that he provided, supported by Wiki and other sources, does illustrate your point that wind energy on anything other than the smallest scale is simply not going to be a viable part of an energy policy that will meet the needs of the people. We're going to need oil in the short term between now and the next 50 years; we're going to need nuclear or some other clean major energy source in the slightly longer term of the next 100 years. By the time the existing reserves run out, I believe we will have developed ways to harness and use energy that aren't even a glint in anybody's eye at this time. And I will be very very surprised if wind energy is a significant part of that.

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@okie,

Well, okie, you certainly read Shakespeare: "Something's rotten in Denmark".

Since you seem to be an expert in Danish politics and about Denmark: what's your opinion about they act/react to their other minorities, like e.g. the German minority?

2 Replies

@okie,

okie wrote:

Also, Walter, your graph only shows electrical generation, it apparently does not show all energy consumption in Denmark.

Well, I don't know the exact number of Danish sailing boats ...

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

I would think any Germans living in Denmark could very easily leave if they were unhappy in Denmark. I mean it isn't like its that far for them to go home. I would think you could commute to just about anywhere in Denmark from northern Germany. Denmark is pretty green though, so probably discourages long commutes.

1 Reply

@Foxfyre,

Foxfyre wrote:

I would think any Germans living in Denmark could very easily leave if they were unhappy in Denmark. I mean it isn't like its that far for them to go home. I would think you could commute to just about anywhere in Denmark from northern Germany. Denmark is pretty green though, so probably discourages long commutes.

I suppose, Foxfyre, you're not well-read about the German minority in Denmark resp. the Danish minority in Germany and their history.

I mean, certainly you can re-arrange historic settlements, like e.g. in the Middle East. But we've got minortity laws here in Europe. (Danish is an official language in Germany, the Danish minority has special political etc rights; similar but not equally done in Denmark.)

1 Reply

@Walter Hinteler,

I not read at all on that subject Walter. Denmark is frequently held up as the model of the world's happiest nation, a paragon of evidence of successful socialism, financial parity, etc. etc. etc. Have I ever believed that they don't have a few warts and issues and problems just like everybody else? No I have not, but that should not diminish their accomplishments either.

And it was not on my radar that the Danish treatment of German minorities would have anything to do with climate change or energy policy either. Is that somehow a factor?

1 Reply

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