Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

Republicans don't believe in free market, they believe in victory and profit.

Don't defend oil companies, they have bought out patents on technolgies which could have improved MPG perfomance on cars or helped provide alternative means.

You're just hiding behind the notion or a "Free Market." The nature of competition is not the driving factor as it should be. Just admit it, we're being hustled by the people who control the supply. There is no balance between customer and supplier anymore.

He with the gold makes the rules, but it should be the government not the bussiness that makes the rules. If you want to ride this sinking ship to the bottom of the ocean by defending some antiquated notion of laissez fair you are a fool. More than a fool if you think that a government cannot act in the interest of it's people when a group or organization threatens it be it economically or other. You may be content to stand by your ideals but it doesn't give them practical value.

Bottom line: Crude oil is used to produce non-reuaseable products which hurt both the economy and the enviroment. It is in the interest of any government to protect both it's economy and it's enviroment. It is also in the intrest of the citizens that these are both addressed. No free market should superceed the interests of the people or the government, certainly not the authority of the government at that. We cannot pretend that the oil industry is using the only bussiness model that will yield a profit.

T
K
O

So, demand for crude oil has spiked to the point where it's gotten real expensive.

Republican plan: drill more!

So, when the demand rises to fill up the new level of drilling, what will the plan be?

DRILL MORE!!!!!

That's the eternal Republican plan. It makes zero sense to be investing in more infrastructure for oil drilling and refining if they are planning on a point in which other technologies will take over happening any time soon; it really is a formula to keep us addicted to oil, no matter where it comes from, for the known future.

To hell with that!

Cycloptichorn

Diest TKO wrote:

You're just hiding behind the notion or a "Free Market." The nature of competition is not the driving factor as it should be. Just admit it, we're being hustled by the people who control the supply. There is no balance between customer and supplier anymore.

The free market is more than a notion, it is the foundation of our economy.

The year 2030

People: What now?
Republicans: uh.... Drill.... uh...! DRILL DEEPER!

T
K
O

Cycloptichorn wrote:

So, demand for crude oil has spiked to the point where it's gotten real expensive.

Republican plan: drill more!

So, when the demand rises to fill up the new level of drilling, what will the plan be?

DRILL MORE!!!!!

That's the eternal Republican plan. It makes zero sense to be investing in more infrastructure for oil drilling and refining if they are planning on a point in which other technologies will take over happening any time soon; it really is a formula to keep us addicted to oil, no matter where it comes from, for the known future.

To hell with that!

Cycloptichorn

Democrat solution to the high price of oil, shut down drilling, is that it? Would you also complain about apple prices after you quit growing apples?

He also criticized McCain's proposal to offer a $300 million prize to whoever is able to develop a suitable battery.

"When John F. Kennedy decided that we were going to put a man on the moon, he didn't put a bounty out for some rocket scientist to win -- he put the full resources of the United States government behind the project and called on the ingenuity and innovation of the American people -- not just in the private sector but also in the public sector."

miniTAX wrote:

Name ONE, please.

Watch the movie "Who killed the electric car?" In the film they outline how the range of the electric car was limited by not using batteries which were superior. Guess who would not let those batteries be used and thus increase the range of the vehicle?

T
K
O

Well, if that's true, why are you then crying for the government to intervene?

old europe wrote:

Well, if that's true, why are you then crying for the government to intervene?

No intervention requested, simply a request to get out of the way. Just as planning and zoning normally grants more permits as a city grows, the government can grant more leases on government land, which belongs to us I would remind everyone.

A majority of the Democrats have made it clear now that they oppose eliminating current federal restrictions on oil drilling (e.g., in regions more than 12 miles off shore, and in less than 0.1% of ANWAR). Because of this a majority of Democrats are now the cause of rising oil and fuel prices.

http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.SenateReport#report

153.

Paavo Siitam, a retired professor of chemistry, agronomy, biology, and physics, and a researcher in soils and microbiology, critiqued the Associated Press for hyping climate fears in 2007. "Despite some doom and gloom predictions, excluding waves washing onto shores by relatively rarely occurring tsunamis and storm-surges, low-lying areas on the face of our planet have NOT yet been submerged by rising oceans... so probably low-lying areas along shorelines of Canada and the USA will be SAFE into foreseeable and even distant futures," Siitam wrote to EPW on September 22, 2007 regarding an AP article predicting dire sea level rise. "By the way, I'd be happy to buy prized oceanfront properties at bargain prices, anywhere in the world, when unwarranted, panic selling begins. The dire predictions will not come true this century," he added.

I do not accept the rules imposed by others. If I did, I would not be alive today. I am a law-abiding citizen, but I recognize that there are regimes that need to be opposed rather than accepted. And in periods of regime change, the normal rules don't apply. One needs to adjust one's behavior to the changing circumstances.

My goal is to become the conscience of the world

The principles of the Declaration of Independence are not self-evident truths but arrangements necessitated by our inherently imperfect understanding.

okie wrote:

old europe wrote:

Well, if that's true, why are you then crying for the government to intervene?

No intervention requested, simply a request to get out of the way. Just as planning and zoning normally grants more permits as a city grows, the government can grant more leases on government land, which belongs to us I would remind everyone.

Well, of course you can argue that the government shouldn't have the power to enforce arbitrary lines in the dirt, and declare that a certain territory is off limits. You can argue that, if the government is doing that, it is merely in the way of the free market. And if the government getting out of the way would help everyone - companies can branch out to new areas, make more money, employ more people, while at the same time consumers are rewarded with lower prices - then that would be the way to go.

I'm sure you would then agree that the government should also get out of the way and stop enforcing the Southern border. It would seem that exactly the same rules apply there.

miniTAX wrote:

Name ONE, please.

Watch the movie "Who killed the electric car?" In the film they outline how the range of the electric car was limited by not using batteries which were superior. Guess who would not let those batteries be used and thus increase the range of the vehicle?

http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.SenateReport#report

154.

Meteorologist Grant Dade of Texas TV's KLTV, a member of both the American Meteorological Society and the National Weather Association, dismissed man-made climate fears in 2007. "I think it is about time we see the other side of the Global Warming debate come out," Dade said on November 8, 2007. "Is the Earth warming? Yes, I think it is. But is man causing that? No. It's a simple climate cycle our climate goes through over thousands of years." Dade critiqued the media for hyping climate fears while ignoring inconvenient facts. "Did you hear about the Arctic ice melting? But you didn't hear in Antarctica last winter was the most ice ever recorded," Dade said. "You don't hear that," he added.

Diest TKO wrote:

miniTAX wrote:

Name ONE, please.

Watch the movie "Who killed the electric car?" In the film they outline how the range of the electric car was limited by not using batteries which were superior. Guess who would not let those batteries be used and thus increase the range of the vehicle?

I don't want to guess, TKO. I want examples of patents bought out by big oils to prevent MPG improvements, which is what you claimed firsthand. What and where are they

miniTAX wrote:

Diest TKO wrote:

miniTAX wrote:

Name ONE, please.

Watch the movie "Who killed the electric car?" In the film they outline how the range of the electric car was limited by not using batteries which were superior. Guess who would not let those batteries be used and thus increase the range of the vehicle?

I don't want to guess, TKO. I want examples of patents bought out by big oils to prevent MPG improvements, which is what you claimed firsthand. What and where are they

miniTAX, this is interesting. I have heard these stories all my life. Some guy in Indiana or Illinois disappeared after he said he had a super efficient carburetor, and was talking to an auto or oil company, etc. etc. etc. I find it amazing that otherwise sane people, some anyway, actually believe these myths. And the best that Diest has as an example is a Hollywood movie!

Here we have auto companies, traditional giants Ford and GM, struggling to even survive as companies, and there is no doubt in my mind that if anyone had any information about a carburetor, oh by the way Diest carburetors are now pretty much antiquated, or a battery powered car that would do wonders, these companies would love to know about it so they could actually save their companies from dying on the vine. The beauty of the free market is that if such things exist, they would never be able to be squelched or thwarted. If by some weird turn of events, one was, others would still come forth, as long as there is a dollar to be made.

I do not subscribe to the idea that a business can succeed by buying out all of their competiton. It may work for a while, usually a very short while, but ultimately it fails. The only real path to success as a company is providing a superior product or service at a competitive price.