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This takes the cake for horrible decisions: Trump dumping the Dreamers

 
 
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 01:17 pm
It almost seems to me that he is purposely trying to make the rest of the world hate the US. He is a true tin eared thoughtless klutz, likely worse in that he is doing this on purpose. Stupid in so many ways, re future excellence in the US.

link -
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/03/trump-dreamers-immigration-daca-immigrants-242301

Trump has decided to end DACA, with 6-month delay

Senior White House aides met Sunday afternoon to discuss how to roll out the controversial move affecting hundreds of thousands of Dreamers.

By ELIANA JOHNSON
09/03/2017 08:21 PM EDT
Updated 09/04/2017 12:40 AM EDT
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Type: Discussion • Score: 12 • Views: 2,594 • Replies: 57

 
snood
 
  3  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 01:41 pm
@ossobucotemp,
This latest stupid move falls in line with his tendency to cater only to his rabid-ass base. You know, the ones who still believe him when he says Mexico will pay for the wall, and that the media is the enemy of the people.
That crowd will love anything that can be construed as "toughness" on immigration (or North Korea, or transgenders, or...).
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 02:25 pm
@snood,
I don't have a handle on the variety of people who came here as Dreamers. I suppose Mexico is only one of the many places, but it's a country I know better than others.

Immediately I think of old friends - in no special order: Nagi, an egyptian man who fled Nassar, that I met when he was a med student in Guadalajara hat met at the Hilton Bar, this in the sixties, and some stayed friends). Far as I know, he's still a practicing doc in Orange County, CA. or likely retired.

Sergio, a fellow from Chihuahua, Mexico, studying at UCLA. He dated one of my girlfriend group. My girlfriend group, including his girlfriend, went to Europe (no way I could afford it), so I helped him with his English.) No dummy...
Sometime later we all met back in Guadalajara. He took us to the university carnival, among the better times I've ever had dancing, the room rocking, guys with tubas exploding the air around us after they entered the auditorium.

A2k's Pantalones. We haven't caught up since Christmas time, but will. Now there's a bright person.

Luis, whom I miss on a2k a lot.

I could add a lot more.
Most of those were people with both good brains and access to good schools.
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 02:36 pm
@ossobucotemp,
I went to Mexico a bunch of times, but was naturally perceived as a tourist, which, at least in the beginning, I certainly was. Lets say I'm a tourist plus, as I've read a lot of books about Mexico. I gave a big batch of my books re Mexico to Venice High School. I hope they kept them or passed them on..
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  2  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 02:55 pm
@ossobucotemp,
A couple of days ago, when the press was speculating that he might actually keep DACA after all because of the protests, Trump made a statement that he would make a decision soon and that "we love Dreamers".

Then he comes out with this.
roger
 
  3  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 03:45 pm
@Blickers,
Tough love, eh?
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 04:22 pm
@roger,
Explain what you mean, please.

0 Replies
 
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 04:26 pm
@Blickers,
I'm rifiling all my possible expletives.
0 Replies
 
Kolyo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 04:35 pm
@ossobucotemp,
ossobucotemp wrote:

Trump has decided to end DACA, with 6-month delay


I've been following this on the radio.

The 6-month delay is so that Congress can pass laws protecting the Dreamers. Before, the dreamers were only protected by Obama's executive order.

Obviously, it's still awful news. It pisses me off the way our government jerks people around. Many of these people may not even speak Spanish that well.
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 04:44 pm
@Kolyo,
Ah, congress.

ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 04:52 pm
@Kolyo,
thanks
ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 05:01 pm
@ossobucotemp,
Oh, wait..
0 Replies
 
Kolyo
 
  2  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 05:42 pm
@ossobucotemp,
ossobucotemp wrote:

Ah, congress.


Given the inability of Congress to act on dreamers behalf in the past, I can understand why the dreamers would expect absolutely no help this time either, but I have heard Republicans talking about a path to citizenship.

If I were a dreamer I don't know how this would affect my plans for the next 6 months and beyond. It makes it harder to commit to a health plan or a rental agreement when you have wonder whether the government might swoop in and place you in another country.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 08:58 pm
This is personal for me; someone I care very much about is a Dreamer (and I know several others). They are Americans in every way but one. You would not be able to pick them out of a lineup as immigrants. Right now, all they can do is continue their lives (same as you and me) and hope for the future.

If you haven't called your congress people yet... please do.


Blickers
 
  1  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 09:14 pm
@Kolyo,
Quote Kolyo:
Quote:
The 6-month delay is so that Congress can pass laws protecting the Dreamers. Before, the dreamers were only protected by Obama's executive order.

So Trump i seliminating an executive order which protects the Dreamers, but he's giving Congress 6 months until the elimination takes effect so Congress can pass a law toprotect them again?

Why not just leave the executive order in place that protects them, then? Why would Trump purposely endanger the Dreamers only to give Congress a chance to rescue them from his own Executive Order? Is Trump daffy, or what?
Kolyo
 
  2  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 10:30 pm
@Blickers,
Blickers wrote:

Is Trump daffy, or what?


I've given up trying to follow his logic.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Reply Mon 4 Sep, 2017 10:38 pm
@Blickers,
Blickers wrote:

Quote Kolyo:
Quote:
The 6-month delay is so that Congress can pass laws protecting the Dreamers. Before, the dreamers were only protected by Obama's executive order.

So Trump i seliminating an executive order which protects the Dreamers, but he's giving Congress 6 months until the elimination takes effect so Congress can pass a law toprotect them again?

Why not just leave the executive order in place that protects them, then? Why would Trump purposely endanger the Dreamers only to give Congress a chance to rescue them from his own Executive Order? Is Trump daffy, or what?

I think it helps to remember that every single thing he does is with an eye toward what his rabid base likes to see. He doesn't quite know WHAT to do about the dreamers, but he knows he has to look like he's doing something. So, he kicked it down the road for 6 months and put it on Congress.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 Sep, 2017 12:58 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

This latest stupid move falls in line with his tendency to cater only to his rabid-ass base. You know, the ones who still believe him when he says Mexico will pay for the wall, and that the media is the enemy of the people.
That crowd will love anything that can be construed as "toughness" on immigration (or North Korea, or transgenders, or...).


Uhhh, didn't LBJ (when the solid Democratic South was behind the Vietnam Conflict) have a well known expression, "Let's stop pussy footin' around." And, his base liked his toughness.

And, he did sign desegregation into law, knowing full well he was going to lose many of the white Democrats in the South. So, let's not condemn toughness. It's all about who benefits from toughness, in my opinion..
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  0  
Reply Tue 5 Sep, 2017 05:29 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

This is personal for me; someone I care very much about is a Dreamer (and I know several others). They are Americans in every way but one. You would not be able to pick them out of a lineup as immigrants. Right now, all they can do is continue their lives (same as you and me) and hope for the future.

If you haven't called your congress people yet... please do.


Why haven't they naturalized then?
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Tue 5 Sep, 2017 06:13 pm
@McGentrix,
Because they can't. Most Dreamers have never had any legal possibility of fixing their immigration status until DACA. The door has always been closed for them. Immigration laws make no sense, there are insanely random rules that come about by legislatures who have competing goals. The "deport them all" crowd in Congress won't allow any change that would make the laws more fair or less cruel

The issue that I am familiar with is called EWI (entry without inspection). If a person, even a child, crosses the border without having any record of talking to a border inspection agent, they have no chance of fixing their status. Surprisingly this applies to a lot of people, including people who came shopping during Christmas. In the 1980s many people were simply waved through with their parents as kids and are now stuck.

The immigration laws are ridiculous, random and cruel. I am pretty sure that anyone who had any way to be "naturalized" has already done so.
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