Reply
Wed 17 Nov, 2004 01:19 pm
Masochism seems to run amok throughout mankind.
Question -
How is it that, among those that accept the general consensus of the "wrath of God" - both in this life and the hereafter, is one of unbelievable punishment, torment, pain, suffering and horror that lasts forever -
- YET -
At the same time have interpreted "God's Love" to be equal, either to the human emotional conditions or so far above the human equivalent that no one who walks the earth will ever know the reality - let alone the fullness - of God's love in their life?
To accept any portion of God's love so described, severely limits both, the capability or willingness of any one to pursue the truth of the reality of God's love.
In the first case - God's wrath - although accepted as presumable fact worldwide, seems to be of paramount importance, when deciding on the supposed right & wrongs of society - be it religions, cultural, or ethical.
To such an overwhelming degree, far less is known of God's love.
Sadly, of the vast majority of interpretations that can be compiled, regarding the definition of God's love, almost all interpretations are derived by, delivered by and propounded by - religions.
Humans then, blindly and willingly being led around by rings in their noses, are also persuaded not to question - in effect, use their own minds - whether the interpretations forced on them is, on one swing of life's pendulum, correct in any manner, let alone the entire conceptual interpretations.
And on the other swing of the pendulum, whether or not any and / or all interpretations are, in fact, craftily persuaded to the degree of total acceptance, from the opposing source of God.
All societies, of whatever size, supposed quality, or appearance, have been built on these sandy premises. Ever watch a "happy" child build a castle in the sand? Experiencing joy as they build their castle, they are crushed when a wave washes over it, leveling their dream. Overcoming their depression they once again, build yet another sand castle. Enter a wave.
Repeating this scenario as an adult would be equal to self-inflicted wounds. Yet when the foundations of humanities societies built on these sandy foundations topple, humans moan, cry & wonder of the resulting effects.
Therefore - as humanity focuses more so on the wrath of God, then accepting the unproven interpretations of God's love - without questioning the interpretations of God's love, to the degree of complete answers; without finding the true reality of God's love for and by themselves; and without a total immersion of every facet of any individual's life to seek until finding - regardless of time, scorn, distance, experiences, set-backs, unintentional delays, doubts, "supposed" dangers or surrender by absolute quitting the search for the truth of the reality of God's love -
Is comparable to worldwide masochism.
Machoism is more of an issue in Australia, and not really a "worldwide" thing.
Australian guys are expected to act tough, so it's part of their cultural development.
uh....Machoism is NOT the focus of this writing, kind one...
Oh... my, how embarrasing.
Quite alright...
Getting over that, what then is your opinion?
Have a great weekend...I'm going fishing...
Tm
Here's my favorite chapter on the subject. It deals with restoration. In case you don't care to read it, I'll summarize.
It doesn't make sense to assume God will give an irrational and extreme punishment to the wicked. He just restores things to their proper order, which is just.
In being a just God, he will meet us with whatever measure we put forth. So if we are merciful and forgiving, it would not be just to be unmerciful or unforgiving to us.
And that's before you factor in the fact that he loves us, and will therefor be as merciful as possible.
To everyone.
http://scriptures.lds.org/alma/41
With all due respect, SCoates...yer still missing the point of my writing...or perhaps my writing misses what I tried to convey...for that, I apologize.
I was trying to get the point across, that the world is more focused in accepting a "punishing" God, rather than focusing on the love of / for God...more so, what the REALITY of God's love IS...
Oh well...maybe next one...
All my best and hope you have a great weekend.
TM
I don't see how my comment misses that point.
WW Masochism
SCoates...
Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner....out of town.
Anyway, to make a long reply short, I fully agree with you.
The most simplest way I can put this particular forum topic would be like this...
"The more you (not personally intended) ignore God,
The more God will ignore you."
Think of how much people "believe" in God, yet do absolutly nothing (by going about their daily lives ignoring God) their entire life and not seeking until they find God. If that be the case, what do you think God would say & do (or NOT say & NOT do...) about this?
Let's say you had a child from birth, and even though you and the child (& wife, siblings, etc.) are living in the same household, yet that child ignores you all your life. How would YOU feel about that?
There is no difference. It's the same between God & man.
Oh well....
By the by...the day I told you I was going fishing....?
Only caught two lousy finny fellows...
:-)
TM
One day I had a fishing pole but I didn't have any bait, and I dipped it in the water, and immediately got a bite. Turns out their were some VERY hungry little blue gills in their. I caught five or six in as many minutes without bait, before it got boring.
Fun childhood memories.
I just found your original statement (re Oz men) fascinating, that's all. I had no idea that the problem was unique to one country. Sorry, Couldn't help but enquire .... :wink:
Oh, yeah... Australian guys are extra macho.
Sure. some are. :wink: I just thought this was an amazing statement, that's all. I'm certain there are a few other "pockets of macho" in the world that's all. I realize that this is not what this thread is about, but hey, I just wanted to comment on your post. Have you been to Oz, SCoates?
SCoates wrote:Machoism is more of an issue in Australia, and not really a "worldwide" thing.
Australian guys are expected to act tough, so it's part of their cultural development.
No, but trust me... nowhere is as macho. There are other tough places, but no other macho places.
For example, the mongolians are pretty tough. Cowboys are pretty tough...

May I suggest that you've been watching too much Crocodile Dundee?
I'm not suggesting that there isn't any overt macho stuff in Oz. All I'm saying is that I don't think the problem is unique to Oz. I live in Oz. I don't know how you can make a statement like you've made without travelling very widely, including Oz. That's all. :wink:
You're wrong.
I'm sorry I have to be so blunt with you msolga. I hope it doesn't hurt our relationship.
No, it hasn't. Without becoming a bore: What makes you so sure of your view?
sigh h h h h h h ...
How many times...?
Machoism is NOT...NOT...NOT THE ISSUE!!!!!!!
"...eyes have they to see, yet they see not..."
Have a great weekend, though.
TM
I know, I know, I know .....
But I couldn't just let that pass without responding.
A thousand apologies.
Please continue!