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I find a clash in a secular based value system

 
 
Reply Fri 31 Mar, 2017 08:13 pm
When I say secular, I mean the whole idea that this is the only life we got and that once we die, that is it. Where the clash comes in here is the personal value we have as human beings with the insignificance we have in this universe. Imagine if there were a beautiful young child and I said to him/her:

"This child is a very beautiful person, BUT he/she will rot and decay away like trash because that is all he/she is (in the grand scheme of things). He/she is nothing more than insignificant trash in the grand scheme of things. We are all just biological organisms in the grand scheme of things only to have the precious value we have as human beings rot and decay away."

I see a major clash here in this quote. I cannot see how this child is a beautiful person when that is being clashed with the whole idea that we are insignificant trash in the grand scheme of things. The only way to create harmony between the claimed beauty of the child and the grand scheme of things would be to have this universe be one that is meant for us. A universe where we are souls who are more than our biology who get to live on happily ever after with a God who truly loves us.

This harmony is what would allow the claimed beauty of the child to finally be established as firm and sound beauty. Otherwise, there would be a clash which is no different than pinning up a positive against a negative. The positive and negative would cancel each other out. Therefore, you cannot have the positive value of a human being (beauty) when you have the negative (the idea that we are insignificant trash in this universe).

That's just how life works. If you pin up a positive force against a negative force, then they will both cancel each other out. Again, the child would be significant to those who love him/her in terms of personal value. But when that gets clashed with the idea that we have no value in the grand scheme of things and that we are insignificant in the grand scheme of things, then that is when things cancel out.

When I talk about establishing harmony, I am not talking about any religion here because it is often the case that you are punished and go to hell according to some religions. I am instead talking about a truly loving God and a truly beautiful and eternal blissful afterlife. Therefore, I really hope there is such a God and afterlife. I really hope it is not some Christian based God or afterlife.
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Krumple
 
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Reply Fri 31 Mar, 2017 08:29 pm
@MozartLink,
Its all on how you look at it.

I see nothing wrong with the decay of the body. After all, our bodies wouldn't even exist if the elements that make it up weren't put together inside stars that blew up.

My body IS the universe, made from stars, its beautiful even though one day it will return to the earth from whence I barrowed it. I don't see it as a piece of trash. Do you look at nature as trash?

As far as living for ever, I wouldn't want to. Not only would an after life render this one completely worthless but no matter how good an after life was, I would get tired of it.

If the after life is better than this one then it would render this life far less to zero value. You think you get to watch sports and drink beer in heaven? Yep it's just like this life but better right?

MozartLink
 
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Reply Fri 31 Mar, 2017 08:33 pm
@Krumple,
So, I guess, for you, there is no clash. There is no pinning up of the personal values of human beings against the idea that we have no value and are insignificant in the grand scheme of things. But, for me, there is always that clash which has that cancelling effect I mentioned in my post.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 31 Mar, 2017 08:37 pm
@MozartLink,
How can I see the beauty in a crystal of tanzantie hen I know that, by inherent entropy the crystal will, over a coupla eons, decay to a pile of water sequestering clay. Maybe theres something in that, buy everything on time.

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Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Fri 31 Mar, 2017 08:44 pm
@MozartLink,
MozartLink wrote:

So, I guess, for you, there is no clash. There is no pinning up of the personal values of human beings against the idea that we have no value and are insignificant in the grand scheme of things. But, for me, there is always that clash which has that cancelling effect I mentioned in my post.


There is a funny question that is profound;

"What do you say to a person who has never existed?"

If there is no after life, dying and becoming worm food has a beauty of its own. You don't need your body any more, you are dead, why not at least let something benefit from it. Are the worms unworthy?

I don't just see surface beauty but what kind of person they were. Who cares if they had a beautiful appearance if they were total jerks in life?

If your arm gets cut off and can't be put back on your body, does it get to go to heaven before they rest? You know, your right spirit arm of your soul gets to go to heaven before the rest of your soul?
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