18
   

TrumpCare: What will it look like?

 
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 09:02 am
@McGentrix,
Not this week
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2016 02:57 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
How much of this thread reflects not just a pessimism, but possibly an inability to see a replacement for the Affordable Health Act as anything but a lesser substitute


You got this exactly right. I don't see any politically viable replacement for the Affordable Care Act that provides coverage for people with pre-existing conditions. You are complaining about "pessimism", yet you fail to even attempt to address this problem.

This is going to be interesting...




Who's "complaining"? Must you assign to an observation some specific emotion? And, I don't offer a possible solution, since I am not a poseur.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 10:45 am
@maporsche,
maporsche wrote:
And what about costs? I mean everyone is so shocked that like 3% of the country might see UP TO 25% increases in their costs.

The costs are high because the Democrats wimped out on forcing unwilling people to buy insurance.

If people faced ruinous fines for not buying insurance, everyone would buy it and the costs would be much lower right now.


maporsche wrote:
What does TrumpCare do to ensure this never happens again?

They will either:

a) Force people to buy insurance against their will.

b) Let rates continue to skyrocket.

c) Let insurance companies go back to kicking sick people off insurance and letting them die.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 10:46 am
@revelette2,
revelette2 wrote:
They will fill the supreme court with judges who never believed in the civil rights or any kind of right.

Just the opposite. It was the Democrats who were doing that.

Trump will fill the courts with judges who will protect the Second Amendment.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 10:48 am
@Robert Gentel,
Robert Gentel wrote:
The problem with Obamacare is that it's not socialist enough (i.e. single payer) and that it didn't go far enough.

There are plenty of nations that don't have single payer and instead have a competitive marketplace. The system works just fine for them.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 10:49 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
.... like single payer?

The problem with single payer is that the Left bleats it with cultlike fervor without even knowing what it means.

Actual single payer might not be so bad. But the left spouting gibberish and proclaiming that it is single payer might be a disaster.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 10:51 am
@McGentrix,
President Trump wrote:
Our elected representatives must eliminate the individual mandate. No person should be required to buy insurance unless he or she wants to.

This is bad. It will either lead to the same high costs that we have now (for the very same reason), or it will require restoring rescissions so insurers can go back to stopping treatment of critically ill people and just letting them die.


President Trump wrote:
We must review basic options for Medicaid and work with states to ensure that those who want healthcare coverage can have it.

Medicaid is bad news (I realize that this isn't the Republicans' fault).

The care provided sucks, and it sucks badly. And when people on Medicaid die, the state seizes all their property.


President Trump wrote:
Remove barriers to entry into free markets for drug providers that offer safe, reliable and cheaper products. Congress will need the courage to step away from the special interests and do what is right for America. Though the pharmaceutical industry is in the private sector, drug companies provide a public service. Allowing consumers access to imported, safe and dependable drugs from overseas will bring more options to consumers.

If we don't allow companies to make a big profit from developing new medicines, they'll stop developing new medicines.

Of course, this could be countered by having the government fund socialized medicine development with taxpayer money.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 11:16 am
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:
What did the little guy do before the ACA?

The little guy got kicked off his insurance policy once he got seriously ill, and then he died.
maporsche
 
  3  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 11:23 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

maporsche wrote:
And what about costs? I mean everyone is so shocked that like 3% of the country might see UP TO 25% increases in their costs.

The costs are high because the Democrats wimped out on forcing unwilling people to buy insurance.

If people faced ruinous fines for not buying insurance, everyone would buy it and the costs would be much lower right now.


maporsche wrote:
What does TrumpCare do to ensure this never happens again?

They will either:

a) Force people to buy insurance against their will.

b) Let rates continue to skyrocket.

c) Let insurance companies go back to kicking sick people off insurance and letting them die.


To be fair, the democrats didn't have a single republican candidate willing to support the plan either, so it wasn't just them that wimped out.

I've got to say, I'm surprised to see your response to this post...I'm in agreement, assuming you prefer TrumpCare does letter A)
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 11:53 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

McGentrix wrote:
What did the little guy do before the ACA?

The little guy got kicked off his insurance policy once he got seriously ill, and then he died.


I don't believe that this happens or happened with any regular occurrence. I offer that it is more like Big Foot sightings. People know people who had a cousin that saw her boyfriend lose his insurance and die.
maporsche
 
  5  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 11:55 am
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

oralloy wrote:

McGentrix wrote:
What did the little guy do before the ACA?

The little guy got kicked off his insurance policy once he got seriously ill, and then he died.


I don't believe that this happens or happened with any regular occurrence. I offer that it is more like Big Foot sightings. People know people who had a cousin that saw her boyfriend lose his insurance and die.


You don't believe people got kicked off of their healthcare when they got sick?
McGentrix
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 12:12 pm
@maporsche,
Not in the giant quantity that you are implying, no.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 11 Nov, 2016 06:20 pm
@Robert Gentel,
The few very popular parts of Obamacare that they immediately rolled out to hook the populace are not going away. They can call it whatever serves their political interests but it will be an (drastic) amendment, not a total repeal of all provisions.

It may not be as good for the really sick little guy who relies on the government for everything, but it will be better for most of the rest of the little guys.
Robert Gentel
 
  5  
Reply Sat 12 Nov, 2016 05:36 pm
@oralloy,
Buy why is that prefefrable to public healthcare? Plenty of nations have that too, and for what our government already spends per-capita on healthcare.
0 Replies
 
revelette2
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Nov, 2016 06:40 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
It may not be as good for the really sick little guy who relies on the government for everything, but it will be better for most of the rest of the little guys
.

Says it all.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  0  
Reply Sun 13 Nov, 2016 09:04 pm
@McGentrix,
I just googled losing health insurance and its happening right now. Under tRumps plan 21 million people are going to lose health insurance. I hope you are one of them.
Krumple
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 13 Nov, 2016 10:06 pm
@RABEL222,
RABEL222 wrote:

I just googled losing health insurance and its happening right now. Under tRumps plan 21 million people are going to lose health insurance. I hope you are one of them.


Oh no! Are you wearing a hard hat so you dont get hurt after the sky falls? Or are you still wearing the tinfoil one?
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  5  
Reply Tue 15 Nov, 2016 09:29 am
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

What did the little guy do before the ACA?

When people in my ex's family got sick, they just waited til they were so sick they could go to ER.

They just skipped any preventative care. Anything chronic but not ER-eligible just went untreated. Of course all of this only increased their risks of an acute health crisis down the road.

If any of them would have gotten a life-threatening, chronic disease that required continuous rather than ER care? Don't know what they would have done.

Taking a step back, the fact that lots of people without health insurance that now have Obamacare (20 million or so, right?) did these things also meant higher costs for everyone, both in the short term (ER treatment's more expensive) and in the long term (accumulating health issues add up to higher costs when they culminate in crisis - preventative care would have been cheaper).
DrewDad
 
  3  
Reply Tue 15 Nov, 2016 09:51 am
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:

oralloy wrote:

McGentrix wrote:
What did the little guy do before the ACA?

The little guy got kicked off his insurance policy once he got seriously ill, and then he died.


I don't believe that this happens or happened with any regular occurrence. I offer that it is more like Big Foot sightings. People know people who had a cousin that saw her boyfriend lose his insurance and die.

No, people just missed too many days from being sick, and lost their jobs, which made 'em lose their health insurance, which meant they couldn't get covered again due to pre-existing conditions.


In the '90s I saw people with cancer having to basically crawl into work while undergoing chemo, so that they wouldn't lose their job and thus their health insurance. I was in a small (<30 person office) and we had two folks with cancer.

0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  4  
Reply Tue 15 Nov, 2016 09:57 am
@McGentrix,
McGentrix wrote:
I also think that some of the "better" parts of the ACA will be carried over.

Problem is, that's been tried and it failed.

Why Keeping Only the Popular Parts of Obamacare Won’t Work
Quote:
....

The pre-existing conditions policies are very popular. Nearly everyone has relatives or friends with illnesses in their past — cancer, arthritis, depression, even allergies — that could have shut them out of the individual insurance markets before Obamacare, so it’s an issue that hits close to home for many Americans.

But keeping those provisions while jettisoning others is most likely no fix at all.

Those policies that make the insurance market feel fairer for sick Americans who need it can really throw off the prices for everyone else. That’s why Obamacare also includes less popular policies designed to balance the market with enough young, healthy people.

Imagine you’re that patient with cancer. You really want health insurance, and you’re probably willing to pay a lot to get it. If the law requires insurance companies to offer you a policy, you are very likely to buy it.

Now imagine you’re a young, healthy person without any health problems. Your budget is tight, and health insurance is expensive. You might decide you’ll be fine without insurance, since you can always buy it later, when you’re the one with a pessimistic diagnosis.

Before Obamacare, several states tried policies like this, and required insurance companies to sell insurance to everyone at the same price, regardless of health histories. The results were nearly the same everywhere: Prices went way up; enrollment went way down; and insurance companies fled the markets.

Some states hobbled along with small, expensive markets. Some experienced total market collapse and repealed the policies. Prices in those markets typically became so high that they were really a good deal only for people who knew they’d use a lot of health care services. And the sicker the insurance pool got, the more the companies would charge for their health plans.

...
0 Replies
 
 

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