Faith

Or as Proverbs 22:6 put it:
But I'm guessing we might differ on 'the way he should go'.

Faith is believing in something which can neither be proven or disproved. If you have faith you've chosen to believe in something that resonates within you, but of which can't be certain.

Some people find this unsettling. I don't know why.

Not too shabby Finn.

I can tell you why I find this unsettling.

People who have faith are certain of what can't be proven. It is the certainty that makes faith so scary and often so damaging.

Certainty can be a very good thing, no?

Certainty in something that has been proven is a very good thing.

Certainty in something that is unproven often a bad thing and sometimes it it tragic.

Other than change and death, nothing in life is certain.
I think it really deeply troubles some people if people of faith actually have peace of mind in the face of death or danger or change.
And that's notwithstanding all the intellectual, rational assertions about the absurd or random nature of reality that those without faith use to argue against faith. I think it bothers them that people that have strong faith may, as a direct result of that faith, enjoy freedom from some of the anxiety of uncertainty. We're just expressing opinions here.

There seems to be a fairly recent uptick in a sort of militant atheism - sort of a 'No God' evangelism. When I listen to the most outspoken of its proponents, there is a common strain in their talking points. That is, their righteous resentment against religion - because of all the damage it has done and continues to do to mankind. I think that some of the antipathy that they clearly have for the whole 'God thing' doesn't come from their laudable concern about the harm that man-made religions have done. I think it comes from the uneasiness they have about people having faith. It is an uneasiness rooted in the knowledge that faith in something unseen and unscientific gives some people undeniable peace and joy.

If I'm right, this is an ugly form of envy.
And envy is a deadly sin; a character defect. Which is why, I'm afraid this will remain a sort of lonely opinion - no one can cop to it.

I find this self-serving without objective evidence.
As an atheist in a family of christians, I don't fear death. Death and taxes are a fact of life.
FACT: Our mother was a christian, as are all my siblings. She feared being cremated. That was a mystery to me, because I told my wife to have my body cremated. I do not wish to take up ground space on this planet after I'm gone. Our younger son was cremated when he passed.

I find this non-sequitur in the context of a discussion about faith, which has nothing to do with evidence.

It's also a little personal labeling my opinion as self serving.



Well then my theory obviously wouldn't apply to you, now would it?

But what is resignation to death compared to absolutely looking forward to it?

Are you saying that faithful people look forward to death? Do you know any personally who have expressed that to you? Or is it just gratuitous snark because faith is just so darn stupid?

"Looking forward to it?" Where in the world did you get that idea? Your imagination is working over time. At 80, I'm lucky that I'm still independently mobile, as healthy as can be expected with all the different health issues I have, and the means to travel the world.

I never use gratuitous snark.

Why would anyone who had true faith not look forward to death? If they truly believe there is a far better life waiting for them after death, I mean, what am I missing that you don't get?

I don't mean that you actively seek to end this life early, but as CI pointed out, death is inevitable. So isn't it one of those enviable things about those with faith that you alluded to is that they would naturally look forward to it as an improvement in life instead of - The End?

Or were you just try'n to get a rise out of CI?

You know anyone who says their faith makes them look forward to death?

I'm still gobsmacked that the concept of those with faith looking forward to death is strange to you.
WTF do you mean by 'faith' if not the belief that there is a better existence after death?
And yes, you will probably find a lot of those with 'faith' that find that concept bizzare. I'd ask them the same thing: WTF do they mean by faith? Faith in what?

If they don't, they are obviously lying about their faith aren't they?

But to answer your question,yes, but not many. Of course I'm one of them.

To answer your question, no. If someone says they don't look forward to death, I don't think that makes them a liar about their faith.
There are differing degrees of depth of faith.

Fear of death is a natural human thing that polls second only to fear of public speaking.

"Public speaking?" Really?

Is it hard for you to believe that's a common fear?

On this list it's number two:
http://www.selfhelpcollective.com/most-common-fears.html
On this one, number ONE:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/10/30/clowns-are-twice-as-scary-to-democrats-as-they-are-to-republicans/

I guess it's because I was never afraid to speak in front of groups. During my working career, I spoke to Board of Directors, managers, and associates. I also taught classes to management staff.
I also spoke to business owners when I did consulting work.