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Fir can be consider as gase ?

 
 
MSIP
 
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2016 09:13 am
if fire can be consider as gas so the gravity also attracts it and that is force which attracts it to downward .
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and fire goes upward because of atmospheric temperature difference
...
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and the force between their atoms also give it force to go upward .
.
. but fire goes upward with very high velocity .
for it the temperature difference and atomic force is not enough .
because gravity also attracts it .
so how it goes upwardward with such high speed and power ?
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Type: Question • Score: 0 • Views: 687 • Replies: 8
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Blickers
 
  0  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2016 10:34 am
@MSIP,
I'm going to take a wild guess and say that although any gas is affected by gravity, as a group gasses area all quite light and are not affected by gravity much. Nitrogen, which is what air mostly is, is only 1.25 grams per liter or about an ounce per 7 gallons. So any other force is likely to affect the direction of gas more than gravity.
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Setanta
 
  0  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2016 03:36 pm
This gentleman has only a very sketchy and confused idea of basic physics, and is obsessed with fire and gravity. He also does not seem to understand that fire is a subjective and imprecise term.

What we see which we call flame is a product of the incomplete combustion which is oxidizing above the fuel source and incandescing in the process. Fire is the name we give to the process of oxidation. A fuel source, such as wood, contains elements, such as carbon, which will readily combine with oxygen, if sufficient heat is applied to the fuel source in a short period of time. (Charcoal can be produced if a fuel source is set to oxidizing, but the source for oxygen is damped down. In a charcoal burner's pit, the fuel, wood, is started oxidizing, and then covered with turves [sections of turf cut for the purpose], so as to control how much oxygen reaches the fuel. Charcoal burners spend the night moving small sections of turf to allow some, but not very much oxygen to reach the fuel. What is left is charcoal, which is largely carbon, and highly combustible, yielding a great deal of heat. Charcoal can turn iron into low grade carbon steel, especially if oxygen is forced through the fuel while the iron is buried in the charcoal. A bellows is used for that purpose.)

As the fuel source oxidizes, it releases gases which are the products of incomplete combustion--which is to say, compounds which will oxidize, but which have been given off before oxidizing because those gases expand with the heat, and therefore, rise above the fuel source. Some of those products of incomplete combustion incandesce, which is to say, they glow from the heat rising from the oxidizing fuel. Some of that glowing gas oxidizes with the oxygen present in the ambient atmosphere, and that is what a flame is.

Whether it is the gases of incomplete combustion, the flame or the gases which are the product of incomplete combustion which escape oxidation in the incandescent flame--all of them rise because they are expanding with the heat which is produced by the oxidation of the fuel, and therefore are far less dense than the ambient atmosphere around them.

It's a damned shame to have to explain flame and fire to any reasonably intelligent and educated adult.
oristarA
 
  0  
Reply Tue 22 Mar, 2016 09:59 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

This gentleman has only a very sketchy and confused idea of basic physics, and is obsessed with fire and gravity. He also does not seem to understand that fire is a subjective and imprecise term.
......
It's a damned shame to have to explain flame and fire to any reasonably intelligent and educated adult.


...of basic physics and CHEMISTRY...
I've had a great time to see you labor through the hardship of teaching an adult student who lacks the very basic knowledge of modern science, Set. Very Happy
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Mar, 2016 04:36 am
@oristarA,
charcoal making is actually destructive distillation . It wasnt long after colliery mounds were used that it was discovered that a stone colliery with a catch tube at the top would produce all kinds of (then) useful heavy distillates like tars. Then coal was discovered and its ability to be coked and wood charcoal died until Henry Ford re-engineered it

Most disgusting foul , business, was a collier and his grunts.(both charcoal and coke)
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Mar, 2016 05:12 am
The discovery of the hexene ring and the chemical manipulation of coal tar made Germany rich. More precisely, it made a small coterie of German industrialists rich--German factory workers remained the lowest paid or among the lowest paid workers in Europe. The initial benefit of coal tars was in dyes for fabrics. Coal tar chemical dyes were more vivid and held their color longer than vegetable dyes. That meant that when the underpaid German workers marched off in 1914 to kill their socialist brothers their coats of Prussian blue were very lovely to see, eclipsed only by the blue coats and red pantaloons of the French.

Another product of the hexene ring was ASA, which Hoffman dubbed aspirin. It helped to alleviate the headaches people suffered from exposure to the polluted air coming from the coal tar factories.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Mar, 2016 08:20 am
@Setanta,
you mean benzene ring. Hexene is just one double boond an is usually a CHAIN, not a ring.

We have a whole class of benzene based aromatics that are puked out in wood and coal tars, lower distillates and "n, b, t's"
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 Mar, 2016 06:27 pm
@farmerman,
Actually, the discovery of aniline and its production ,independently by brits an germans in the early 1800's, was where rungus and then Farben began the organic chem market. Combining ammonia and Benzene opened up a whole bigass number of chemical possibilities, from dyes to really powerful explosives (like TNT).
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MSIP
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Mar, 2016 05:06 am
@oristarA,
hello ! it's enough for me in this time of age
0 Replies
 
 

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