What is IT that makes Us, Us?

I hope this is not too off topic....

I recently read "Mothering Without A Map" about how women who grew up without mothers, learn to become mothers.

One intrigueing aspect of attachment theory is that infants who have negligent or absentee moms often are very "charming". They smile more, cry less and attempt to draw people in as a way of self preservation. This tendency to charm often stays with the person throughout their life although the process doesn't involve contrivence or memory of any sort.

extra medium wrote:

What makes us, us? What keeps you the same person, in spite of all your atoms being replaced? If all the atoms in our bodies have been replaced, what is the common thread that keeps us, us?

Memory. It is the intangible thread which transcends the exchange of atoms and the discharge of neurons. Our ability to remember what we thought we were, makes us what we are.

What is it, outside of atoms & cells, that somehow maintains our identity.

Memory. It is the intangible thread which transcends the exchange of atoms and the discharge of neurons. Our ability to remember what we thought we were, makes us what we are.

what about neurons? aren't they irreplacable?

Every year about 98% of the atoms in your body are replaced.

Thus, within a few years from now, all the current atoms in your body will have been replaced. Yet you will still be the same you.

Looking a few years into the past, none of the atoms that now make up your body were present.

Yet, you are still you. (or are you?)

What makes us, us? What keeps you the same person, in spite of all your atoms being replaced? If all the atoms in our bodies have been replaced, what is the common thread that keeps us, us? Is this "proof" of a soul-like entity?

If it doesn't prove that a soul exists, it appears to prove, at the very least, that "we are not our bodies." What is this common thread, this thing animating our bodies of ever-changing atoms? Discuss?

partially inspired by g's ship in ports question

actually JJ,

I think his paper was really great....I mean, how DO you maintain all your knowledge, memories, etc if you're constantly being recyled.

I can understand it better the way he explained it.....using the word "mind" to mean the soul.

HEY!

Where did his post go!!!!???

dammit!

actually, I had hoped intially it was extra medium coming back....I miss him.

for example, all electrons are the same, undifferentiated, and indeed uncountable. One electron is indistinguishable from many. In fact, we can't even logically say 'all electrons are the same' for the elctron has nothing to distinguish one from another or one from many.

John Jones wrote:

for example, all electrons are the same, undifferentiated, and indeed uncountable. One electron is indistinguishable from many. In fact, we can't even logically say 'all electrons are the same' for the elctron has nothing to distinguish one from another or one from many.

Electrons may have identical structures, just as atoms do, but they are all distinguishable by their location within space. An electron which is "here" may be identical to one which is "there", but they are not the "same" electron.

So it looks like maybe its a combination. We are our memories. But there may be a particular part of our brain that sort of stores, organizes, etc. our memories, and helps to regulate and create our "selves."

What is it that enables us to remain the same person, even though all the atoms have been replaced in this portion of the brain. What is it, outside of atoms & cells, that somehow maintains our identity. Memories? What are memories? (thats another thread) Somehow memories, then, must be transferred from old atoms to new atoms at some point. Now this is interesting. Memories & our identity being transmitted from old atoms to new atoms. Atoms mixing together, somehow communicating to one another, to ensure that our identity & memories remain somewhat consistent over time. Atoms telling each other: "Hey, I see you're new around here. I'm about ready to be replaced. Here, take my part of what this dude is all about. Got it? Good. I'm outta here." Interesting.

It occurs to me that this question can be asked and answered from two different points of view. I can say what makes me me from my point of view, or I can say what makes you you -- and they aren't necessarily the same answers. I only know a person through their behavior, their speech, and the apparent continuity of their voice and body, which I can recognize through my own memories. Which I suppose leads to a discussion of the social construction of the self, which is a whole other bag of candy...

Memories (and therefore the sense of self) do change over time. A neuron may have thousands of connections, and every new experience adds or strengthens connections. Unused connections may fade away and the data they represent is no longer accessible. But individual atoms have nothing to do with the continuity of memory.