Brexit. Why do Brits want Out of the EU?

@Foofie,

Foofie wrote:

Olivier5 wrote:

Are you a representative of the U.S.A. hinterland culture, Foofie? I'm trying to figure out what it looks like.

I represent no one, except my Ashkenazi genome. Have a happy Passover.

You too.

Why the reference to the US hinterland culture then? Are these people dear to your heart or important to you in other ways?

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

The guy says climate science is a religion, and then he says he never attacked climate science.... I call that a lie. How do you call that? Senility?

The essence of science is that it consists of testable theories and hypotheses, and ideas that are always subject to question, verification, refutation and revision by actual data.
Religion includes a priori beliefs that are held to be, or accepted as, true, at least in part, as matters of faith, and not subject to proof.

The observable behaviors of many contemporary advocates of climate science ( many not scientists themselves) call for its acceptance in spite of data that calls for revision and modification, as a minimum. In doing this they are treating it as a religious belief.

That is a statement of fact: not a lie and not an attack.

It appears fairly clear that Oliver 5 is no scientist.

2 Replies

@georgeob1,

Saying that we believe in science is not a religion by any stretch. Science offers us the best opinion based on the latest scientific findings. That it must be revised based on latest facts doesn't equate it to religion. It's based on logic.

0 Replies

@georgeob1,

In post # 6,397,629 you said:

Quote:

I believe you are too blithely conflating the narrow domain of currently fashionable 'climate science' with science writ large. 'Climate science', in my perception, is as much religion as science.

Now you say: "many contemporary advocates of climate science ( many not scientists themselves)"...

So who the hell are you talking about? Bloggers and journalists, or scientists? Be specific in your supposedly factual accusations. Give us names. Statements. Facts, not vague rumors.

Quote:

in spite of data that calls for revision and modification, as a minimum

And what data is that, as a minimum?

2 Replies

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

In post # 6,397,629 you said:

Quote:
I believe you are too blithely conflating the narrow domain of currently fashionable 'climate science' with science writ large. 'Climate science', in my perception, is as much religion as science.

Now you say: "many contemporary advocates of climate science ( many not scientists themselves)"...

So who the hell are you talking about? Bloggers and journalists, or scientists? Be specific in your supposedly factual accusations. Give us names. Statements. Facts, not vague rumors.

In both instances I expressed my general opinions of observable behavior and reactions among many, to criticisms of the prescriptions AGW advocates. They included some from all the categories you identified and these general behaviors are all well known. You are welcome to do your own research and form your own opinions.

I made no accusations, specific or otherwise, of anyone, though it is clear that you wish to pretend that I did. You certainly have offered nothing whatever to back up your categorical statements about those whose opinions and policies you oppose, accusing them of cowardice among other things, and have offered no specifics of any kind in the process.

You appear to be rather fond of your own general statements, but very critical of mine. That's OK, but don't pretend it is anything other than that.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Quote:
I have not "attacked" any of the messengers here

That is a lie. You did attack the science of climate change on this very thread.

Quote:
It would also be helpful to add more specific and technology based factual material to the discussion and less hyperbole & name-calling.

You can look up the specifics whenever and wherever you feel like it. Why is it up to me to provide you with this material?

To call a lie a lie is not "name-calling". It is stating a FACT.

Your concept of attacking the messenger is rather different than mine.

1 Reply

@georgeob1,

Well, my observation of your general behavior is that you behave as a coward on this issue. This is OF COURSE not an attack, since your own "observing" that 'climate change is a religion' was EVIDENTLY not an attack either...

You see how easy it is to catch you at your own game?

0 Replies

@roger,

How do you call it then, when people who undestand very little about climate attack the quality of the science put forth by competent researchers because they are afraid or annoyed by what these researchers say?

I call that shooting the messenger. But if you got another phrase, I'd love to hear it.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

I think you're really grasping to call it an attack on the messenger or shooting the messenger. What he attacks is the message. I can understand someone being attacked. I can understand a group under attack. Exactly what or who is being attacked here? Really, it sounds like you heard the phrase somewhere and want to try it out. See if it works, ya know?

1 Reply

@roger,

He has not attacked the message in any way, shape or form. A scientific theory cannot be "religious". Only people can be religious.

2 Replies

@Olivier5,

Like I say, I think you just like the sound of the accusation. A disagreement is not an attack. If you can get your head around that idea, figure out exactly who has been attacked.

1 Reply

@roger,

A vague set of GW proponents, including a undeterminate number of climate scientists, have been called 'religious' and not therefore 'scientific'. That's an attack on a vague group of persons but it is still a personal attack in my view. Admittedly a vague one.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

A vague set of GW proponents,

I'm going to have to let you go, here. Each post sounds more confused than the last.

1 Reply

@roger,

I'm not the one being confused here.

0 Replies

Anyway, this was just a tangent. Back to Brexit. May and Tusk agree to keep a watch over the Gibraltar issue and defuse tensions as they arise.

Quote:

Brexit: Theresa May and Donald Tusk agree to 'lower tensions' over Gibraltar
Joe Watts Political Editor

Theresa May and Donald Tusk have agreed to try and “lower tensions” over Gibraltar in Brexit talks following the recent furore over the issue.

The Prime Minister made clear however that there would be “no negotiation on the sovereignty” of the British territory without the consent of its population.

The two leaders met to discuss pending Brexit negotiations amid concerns that Gibraltar could become a flash-point in an already difficult situation

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-talks-theresa-may-donald-tusk-gibraltar-lower-tensions-eu-negotiations-council-president-a7670571.html

0 Replies

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

He has not attacked the message in any way, shape or form. A scientific theory cannot be "religious". Only people can be religious.

Self declared "scientists" who demand acceptance of their theories in the face of evidence calling for their modification or limitation, and who, in the process, demand to be given control of a major part of the economic and physical lives of others in pursuit of the theory's requirements, are not behaving as scientists at all. They are behaving as authoritarian political (or religious, take your pick) figures and are treating their supposedly scientific theories as religious or political dogma. Many leading figures of "climate science" behave in this way.

I was both clear and explicit about the limitations of the "message" or theory.

Oliver just can't handle the truth.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

You are much nicer than I am.

2 Replies

@ehBeth,

Oh, I think it's a toss up.

0 Replies

@georgeob1,

Who are you talking about exactly?

Edit: We should create another thread. This is out of topic.

0 Replies

@ehBeth,

ehBeth wrote:

You are much nicer than I am.

Ha ha. I don't know about that.

1 Reply

Brexit. Why do Brits want Out of the EU?

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