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Brexit. Why do Brits want Out of the EU?

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 25 Aug, 2019 12:50 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Johnson is expected to tell European Council head Donald Tusk that the UK will only pay 9 billion pounds ($11 billion) instead of the 39 billion pound ($47.88 billion) liability agreed by former Prime Minister May under a no-deal Brexit, Sky News reported this morning.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 25 Aug, 2019 12:18 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Johnson accused of ‘gaslighting’ voters over Brexit deal amid claims he offered nothing new in EU meeting
Quote:
Boris Johnson has been accused of “gaslighting” voters over the prospects of a Brexit deal, after EU sources said the prime minister brought nothing new to his first meeting with European Council president Donald Tusk.

In public, Mr Johnson said that the chances were “improving” of a fresh agreement on the terms of the UK’s departure ahead of the 31 October deadline for Brexit, though he conceded that it remained “touch and go” whether a deal would in fact be reached.

But a senior EU diplomat said that Mr Tusk was none the wiser after their 20-minute meeting at the G7 summit in Biarritz on the alternative arrangements Mr Johnson envisages for the Irish border to avoid the need for the controversial backstop.

And it emerged that Mr Johnson did not even mention the issue of the UK’s £39 billion financial settlement, despite briefings that he would use the threat that as much as £30 billion of the sum agreed by Theresa May could be withheld in a no-deal situation as leverage to encourage the EU to make concessions. In TV interviews, the PM said that “very substantial sums” could be redirected to domestic priorities if no agreement is reached.

Meanwhile, the prime minister raised hopes of a free trade deal with the US within a year, after talks with Donald Trump in which the president hailed him as “the right man for the job” of delivering Brexit.

Mr Johnson declined to give a predicted date for the conclusion of negotiations on thorny issues such as access for US chlorine-washed chicken and GM crops to the UK market, but said that suggestions it would take years were “an exaggeration”.

“The Americans are very ambitious to get this done as fast as possible,” he said. “They really want results within a year - I suppose by next June or July. We’re keen to go as fast as we can. But we want this to be a really big thorough going comprehensive trade deal.”

Johnson and Tusk are not scheduled to meet again until the United Nations General Assembly in New York in the last week of September - which comes after the end of the 30-day period within which German Chancellor Angela Merkel has suggested Mr Johnson should set out his proposals.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Mon 26 Aug, 2019 12:49 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Today, the EU Commission reacted cool about PM Johnson's idea, if it came to a Brexit without a contract, his country would no longer have to pay the full sum of 39 billion pounds (43 billion euros),
"All obligations of the 28 member states should be respected," said a spokeswoman on Monday. This applies "also and especially" if Great Britain withdraws from the EU without an agreement. "The settlement of the bills is of central importance at the beginning of a new relationship". EU Budget Commissioner Günther Oettinger told the newespaperAugsburger Allgemeine that Johnson "would certainly not get any pleasant agreements with us about the future if he refused to pay against all reason".

The background is that even after a no deal Brexit, the EU would still be by far Britain's most important trading partner. This would mean that the British government would urgently need to conclude a trade agreement with the EU as soon as possible - if only to reduce the potentially devastating effects of tariffs and other trade barriers on its own economy.

Johnson's claim that he would no longer be obliged to pay the bill in the event of a no deal exit is contested in Brussels. Diplomats say that London must, of course, continue to meet its obligations under international law even after the membership has ended.
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Wed 28 Aug, 2019 04:27 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Boris Johnson declared today, he would ask Queen Elizabeth II to prorogue parliament.
So Parliament will to be suspended in the second week of September ahead of a Queen's Speech on 14 October - thus cutting drastically into the time available for MPs to pass legislation to prevent no-deal.

This makes an attempt to remove Johnson by a vote of no confidence in the next fortnight much more likely.
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Wed 28 Aug, 2019 07:03 am
@Walter Hinteler,
UK tells France to start no-deal Brexit mitigation talks
Quote:
LONDON (Reuters) - Britain’s Brexit minister, Stephen Barclay, is due to say on Wednesday that Britain and France should immediately begin talks about how to minimize the disruption from a no-deal Brexit.

In a speech in Paris, Barclay plans to “stress that the UK and France must prepare for no deal including by immediately starting bilateral discussions on how to mitigate it,” a statement from his office said.

Barclay is also due to say that Britain’s offer to French nationals living in the United Kingdom is “much more generous” than the French one to UK nationals in France, and will call on Paris to match London’s plan.


Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Wed 28 Aug, 2019 07:16 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Quote:
Barclay is also due to say that Britain’s offer to French nationals living in the United Kingdom is “much more generous” than the French one to UK nationals in France, and will call on Paris to match London’s plan.


The ultimate no-deal Brexit checklist for Britons in France (28.08.2019)
0 Replies
 
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Wed 28 Aug, 2019 08:59 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Boris Johnson declared today, he would ask Queen Elizabeth II to prorogue parliament.

But why did she approve of this tyrannical request?
https://i.imgur.com/k2LJJd6.jpg
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Wed 28 Aug, 2019 09:12 am
@tsarstepan,
tsarstepan wrote:
But why did she approve of this tyrannical request?
She does have a say, but it's limited. Technically, the government had to ask her for permission to suspend Parliament.
This is normally a formality since the Queen keeps out of politics. If she had refused, that would have been unprecedented.
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Wed 28 Aug, 2019 05:28 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
I think a no-deal Brexit is what he actually wants to achieve and is trying to bring about.

As I said.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Thu 29 Aug, 2019 06:01 am
Netherland's Foreign Minister Stephan Blok said that serious talks took place in Brussels between the EU and Britain on Wednesday but that the sides have not managed to bridge divisions on Brexit terms.
Other European Union ministers today urged the UK to choose an orderly Brexit, with some openly expressing concern that Prime Minister Boris Johnson's move to suspend parliament increased the risk of a chaotic split.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Thu 29 Aug, 2019 08:55 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Tory minister filmed admitting Boris Johnson’s move to suspend parliament motivated by Brexit
Quote:
Defence secretary Ben Wallace has been caught on camera suggesting that Boris Johnson’s decision to suspend parliament was driven by the demands of his Brexit plans.

And Mr Wallace admitted the weakness of the government’s control over events in parliament, conceding that he did not know what the outcome of Mr Johnson’s dramatic gambit will be.

The prime minister insisted on Wednesday that it was “completely untrue” that Brexit was behind the use of a mechanism known as “prorogation” to shut the doors of Westminster on MPs for five weeks in the run-up to the 31 October deadline for EU withdrawal.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Fri 30 Aug, 2019 01:34 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
[url0https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-boris-johnson-no-deal-government-extension-leave-parliament-prorogue-latest-a9085971.html]Fresh doubts over Boris Johnson’s commitment to deal after extension ruled out[/url]
Quote:
Government tells EU it will not allow even a short delay to Brexit, despite being told it will be ‘impossible’ for parliament to ratify any new agreement in time

Fresh doubts have been cast over Boris Johnson’s commitment to securing a Brexit deal after the government said it would not delay the UK’s departure from the EU even to give parliament time to approve a new agreement.

Mr Johnson’s chief Brexit negotiator, David Frost, ruled out a so-called “technical extension” during talks in Brussels this week, according to a leaked diplomatic memo seen by The Independent.

It raises the prospect that parliament could run out of time to ratify a Brexit deal even if the prime minister manages to secure a new agreement with Brussels.

Mr Johnson claimed on Friday that Remainers were wrecking Britain’s chances of leaving the EU with a deal by making Brussels officials believe that Brexit could be stopped.

But MPs warned that approving any deal would be “impossible” in just a few days after the PM’s move to suspend parliament, fuelling fears that Britain is heading for a no deal even as the government insists it is intensifying talks with the EU.

The Institute for Government think tank also said it would be “very tricky” for parliament to approve a deal in time, prompting Labour MPs to claim that Mr Johnson was not serious about negotiating a new agreement and was instead simply “telling people what they want to hear”.
0 Replies
 
eurocelticyankee
 
  2  
Fri 30 Aug, 2019 01:45 pm
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 1 Sep, 2019 04:18 am
@eurocelticyankee,
Boris Johnson tells Tory rebels — it’s me or Corbyn chaos
Quote:
Former Tory ministers plot breakaway over no-deal

Boris Johnson today warns Tory MPs they face a historic choice this week — back him to deliver Brexit and a £3.5bn spending “bonanza” for public services, or see Jeremy Corbyn take over and “plunge the country into chaos”.

In his first newspaper interview since becoming prime minister, Johnson delivers an ultimatum to former ministers leading the charge against him to pick a side. About 20 have talked about breaking away from the party if he makes them fight a snap election on a no-deal manifesto.

Locked in the deepest constitutional crisis for a century, the prime minister promised to unveil the “biggest, most generous spending review since the height of Tony Blair’s New Labour” in Wednesday’s spending review. Local councils will get £3.5bn extra — the first real-terms rise in their budgets for a decade — with £1bn earmarked for social care.

“We need to put a tiger in the tank, put our pedal to the metal, foot to the floor,” he said. “We’re putting a huge amount into social care, into schools, into transport and education.”

But Johnson also warned Conservative MPs intent on “parliamentary shenanigans” this week to block a no-deal Brexit that they would make it “impossible” for him to get a new deal with Brussels and would put Corbyn in power.

Johnson accused the Labour leader of having “made a historic decision to turn his party into the anti-democratic, referendum- cancelling party”.

He and his senior aides will discuss today whether to take away the Tory whip and deselect Tory MPs who join forces with Corbyn. In a showdown tomorrow with former cabinet ministers Philip Hammond, David Gauke and Dominic Grieve, Johnson will tell them they have to choose a team.

He told The Sunday Times: “I just say to everybody in the country, including everyone in parliament, the fundamental choice is this: are you going to side with Jeremy Corbyn and those who want to cancel the referendum? Are you going to side with those who want to scrub the democratic verdict of the people — and plunge this country into chaos?

“Or are you going to side with those of us who want to get on, deliver on the mandate of the people and focus with absolute, laser-like precision on the domestic agenda? That’s the choice.”

Last night, Corbyn said that a general election was “the democratic way forward”, adding: “In that election, Labour will give the people the chance to take back control.” Meanwhile, Michel Barnier, the EU’s chief Brexit negotiator, said the Irish backstop could not be ditched. Johnson has insisted it must be scrapped.

The 20 former ministers have privately pledged not to sign up to a no-deal manifesto in a general election and have discussed the possibility of running under an “independent Conservative” banner if Johnson kicks them out.

Last night Hammond hit back, saying removing the whip would be “staggeringly hypocritical” since “eight members of the current cabinet have defied the party whip this year”.

He added: “I want to honour our 2017 manifesto, which promised a ‘smooth and orderly’ exit . . . not an undemocratic no-deal.”

On Tuesday, rebel MPs will try to force through a plan to seize control of the Commons agenda to pass a law on Wednesday and Thursday that would force Johnson to go to Brussels to seek an extension to the Brexit deadline.

Johnson said this would “achieve nothing” but would exacerbate “acrimony” in the country.

Senior government sources say that even if the rebel bill passes, Johnson could go to Brussels and veto the suggestion himself — as an extension of the October 31 deadline would require the support of all 28 member states — or ask an ally such as Hungary’s prime minister, Viktor Orban, to do it for him.

In the interview, Johnson signalled that he intends to play hardball, refusing to rule out:
● packing the House of Lords with hundreds of peers to defeat the rebel bill
● asking the Queen not to give royal assent if it passes
● calling a general election himself even though the public has had “a bellyful” of elections
● deselecting Conservative MPs who try to bring down the government.

Rebel leaders fear that once parliament has been prorogued, Johnson could simply extend the suspension for another fortnight until Brexit, keeping them powerless to prevent the move.

Johnson and a team of senior ministers, including Michael Gove and Amber Rudd, will be deployed to lean on potential Tory rebels, stressing that he is sincere about seeking a deal with Brussels.

The prime minister said: “The one thing that could undermine the UK’s ability to negotiate would be Brussels thinking that there’s some chance that the referendum could be cancelled, and that Brexit could be blocked. That’s the way to make a deal impossible. The people who claim to be campaigning against no-deal are making no-deal more likely.”

The claim that Corbyn would create chaos is an echo of David Cameron’s adverts before the 2015 election warning that the choice for voters was stability with him “or chaos with Ed Miliband”.

The huge handouts in the spending round will fuel talk that Johnson is pumping money into northern seats that backed “leave” in the hope that he can seize them in a snap general election.
0 Replies
 
Olivier5
 
  1  
Sun 1 Sep, 2019 09:35 am
Tens of Thousands Protest BoJo's 'Coup'

https://images.axios.com/dWdEAcbsm4zIAsoblgM43BIxxcs=/2019/09/01/1567325636407.jpg

https://images.axios.com/pcrPLsLJoszTeyXZziGyYbZP4Fg=/33x916:4335x3333/768x432/2019/09/01/1567319285226.jpg

https://images.axios.com/45ph7vDRs9Cx7kDC5U44hZV_p3Q=/2019/09/01/1567325768034.jpg

Source
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 1 Sep, 2019 11:07 pm
@Olivier5,
According to the new gov.uk website Get ready for Brexit not everyone is affected by Brexit, namely British nationals who live and work in the UK, do not run a business and have no plans to travel abroad are told to sit back and relax: “Based on your responses, you do not need to take any action to prepare for the Brexit deadline of 31 October 2019.”

For others advice is e.g. to renew the passport earlier than planned, buy a GB sticker for the car, and prepare to wait four months before taking a ferret on holiday.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 1 Sep, 2019 11:40 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Anyone defying orders to vote with the leadership will lose the whip - effectively being expelled from the party and unable to stand again as a Tory candidate - a senior government source has told the BBC. They also said Johnson could reach a deal with the EU at the Brussels summit on 17 October, two weeks before the deadline for Brexit.

However: Irish border after Brexit – all ideas are beset by issues says secret paper says a leaked report, according to the Guardian.
Quote:
All potential solutions to the post-Brexit Irish border are fraught with difficulty and would leave smaller businesses struggling to cope, experts have said, as leaked government papers outline major concerns just two months before Britain is due to leave the EU.

A report summarising the findings of the government’s official “alternative arrangements” working groups concluded that there are issues with all the scenarios put forward to try to replace the backstop arrangement. There are also specific concerns over whether any technological solution could be delivered to monitor cross-border trade.

Critics said the paper, seen by the Guardian, should “ring alarm bells” across government over how likely it is that alternative arrangements to the backstop will be found.

The dossier marked “official-sensitive” prepared for the EU Exit Negotiations Board is dated 28 August. It details how the findings of all advisory groups informing the government on the Northern Irish border are being kept deliberately under wraps to try to avoid hampering Britain’s intended renegotiation of the backstop agreed to by Theresa May.

Alternative systems to avoid a hard Northern Irish border after Brexit have become the central tenet of Boris Johnson’s Brexit strategy. He sees this as a way of unlocking a new deal with Europe and has claimed that there are “abundant solutions”.

However, the damning report shows there is no single deliverable solution at present, despite the fact Johnson is almost a third of the way through the “30 days” target that the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, gave him to come up with a fresh border proposal.

The report said: “It is evident that every facilitation has concerns and issues related to them. The complexity of combining them into something more systemic and as part of one package is a key missing factor at present.”

Johnson’s claim that a hard border could be avoided with mobile checks of livestock and crops was dismissed by experts as the most unlikely option to work. The report said: “Overall there were a number of concerns surrounding the deliverability of technological facilitations.”

Questions were also raised over whether a trusted trader scheme – the current favourite for a border solution – would require infrastructure to set it up.

MP Tom Brake, the Liberal Democrat Brexit spokesman, said: “As we continue to get closer to 31 October, with Boris Johnson attempting to shut down our democracy, this leaked document rings alarm bells. It proves the government has no deliverable solution to the Irish border, let alone being able to find one within the next few weeks.

“The fact that in this document there is not a single option that can be put forward to the EU as a viable alternative to the backstop, and that No 10 do not want to release these findings as they know Boris Johnson’s bluff will be revealed, simply shows why MPs must come together to stop no deal.”

Naomi Smith, the chief executive of the Best for Britain group, which is “committed to finding a democratic way to stop Brexit”, said: “It is utterly shameful that the government has found no practical solution to the question of the Irish border, despite its insistence that the backstop be removed.

“Removing the backstop without something to take its place would fundamentally undermine the Good Friday agreement, and the fragile peace process started just 20 years ago which it guards.

“Despite the prime minister shutting down parliament, MPs must do all they can to block a damaging and undemocratic no-deal Brexit, and the reimposition of a hard border in Northern Ireland.”

The official report summarises the work of two groups tasked with coming up with border ideas: advisory groups involving agricultural and food experts, customs and legal specialists and senior Northern Irish figures; and a Whitehall-based group which is due to shortly come up with a negotiating position on how to rework the withdrawal agreement to present to the EU.

Border solutions the report deems as having the most potential are listed as:

• Regulatory and industry assurance schemes.
• Trusted trader schemes.
• Smarter risking (a technological solution that involves data sharing).
• A Northern Ireland sanitary and phytosanitary zone to track contamination and disease.
There were significant concerns about an artificial intelligence option, which experts felt might not detect disease and chemical contamination of food.

Onboard vehicle technology which could track the location, weight and temperature of goods was also considered risky if a lorry might suddenly be taken out of service and goods offloaded into a non-registered vehicle.

Physical goods checks through mobile units could take weeks and involve lengthy periods of quarantine, the report found. The units could also be vulnerable to “targeting” and staff could be at risk, it said.

Significantly, smaller businesses in Northern Ireland could suffer through the additional administration required to send and receive goods across the border, as well as other constraints and costs, the report found. They might also struggle with data collection or be unwilling to share information due to concerns around privacy.

“This is because they do not have the existing systems in place and are more likely to have non-standardised products and product ranges,” it said.

On keeping the work around border solutions secret as the government prepares to go back to the EU to discuss the withdrawal agreement, the report said: “DExEU [the Department for Exiting the European Union] has been considering whether a paper consolidating the findings from all of the advisory groups should be published in late September/early October.

“However, we and other departments have cautioned against this given the potential negative impacts on the renegotiation with the EU and we understand No 10 are in agreement …”

A spokesperson for the DExEU said: “We don’t comment on leaked documents.”

Over the weekend, the Republic of Ireland’s minister for foreign affairs, Simon Coveney, said his country would not agree to drop the backstop merely for the “political convenience” of the British prime minister.

In a forthright interview with the Sunday Business Post newspaper, he said: “There isn’t a single EU member state putting pressure on Ireland to move away from that position, despite the fact that the UK has spoken to all of them and used all of the persuasion that they can muster to actually move countries away from that position.”

He said dropping the backstop would only create problems for Ireland further down the line. “I’m not going to pretend to people that we can do that for political convenience now to get a deal, and then find that Irish politics is dominated by the border issue indefinitely into the future. We’re not doing that,” he said.
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Mon 2 Sep, 2019 11:41 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
The chaos days of London begin

https://i.imgur.com/nDum45A.jpg

Johnson’s ultimatum: back me or face 14 October election.
But at least 17 Tory MPs say they will vote to stop no-deal Brexit despite government pressure ...
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Tue 3 Sep, 2019 10:39 am
@Walter Hinteler,
UK public must decide next steps if parliament votes against Johnson: PM's spokesman
Quote:
LONDON (Reuters) - Prime Minister Boris Johnson is clear that should lawmakers decide to vote against his government on Tuesday, then the British public should decide who negotiates with the European Union in an election, his spokesman said.

Lawmakers are expected to vote later on a plan to seize parliamentary time on Wednesday to try and pass a law which would force Johnson to seek a delay to Brexit.

“The PM has been very clear ... should MPs (Members of Parliament) vote tonight to trash the UK’s negotiating position, to hand the power over to the opposition, that the next logical step for this prime minister, is something he doesn’t want ... an election,” the spokesman said.

“Then the British public can decide who goes to Brussels to make that decision,” he said, repeating that if Conservatives voted against the government or abstained they would be expelled from the party’s group in parliament.

0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Tue 3 Sep, 2019 03:54 pm
These days in Parliament should be recorded for posterity. I’ve heard precedence has been set in s couple of instances, but I know nothing of parliamentary procedures in Britain, so I guess I’ll have to read some kind Brit papers.

I heard that some MPs are sacrificing their ability to stand for the next election due to a Johnson threat.

Sounds like a cluster f.

 

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