47
   

Brexit. Why do Brits want Out of the EU?

 
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 08:22 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Gibraltar deal clears way for Sunday Brexit summit
Quote:
BRUSSELS (Reuters) - An 11th-hour deal on Saturday to answer Spanish demands for a big say on Gibraltar after Britain leaves the EU has salvaged an EU summit which will now go ahead as planned on Sunday to deliver a Brexit accord.

With British Prime Minister Theresa May due to meet EU chief executive Jean-Claude Juncker and summit chair Donald Tusk at 6 p.m. (1700 GMT) and 7:15 p.m. respectively, Tusk secured a deal with Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez, who had been threatening to scupper the consensus by staying away on Sunday.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 09:11 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Perhaps, it's meant serious: Boris Johnson calls for appointment of 'no deal' Brexit minister
Quote:
BELFAST (Reuters) - Former British Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson on Saturday called for the appointment of a government minister to take charge of preparations for a “no-deal” British exit from the European Union.

“It is very important that we show we are negotiating with confidence and conviction and have a new secretary of state with powers across Whitehall to make things happen and get this country ready if we have to go out on WTO terms,” Johnson told the BBC.

He said he did not believe Britain would leave without a deal but he said doing so would not “be nearly as bad as some people suggest.”
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 09:40 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Either
May gives way over Gibraltar after Spain's 'veto' threat
or
Spain backs down in BITTER row over Gibraltar,
it's the result which counts and not the wording of a headline:
nothing has changed regarding Gibraltar's situation since more than 300 years.
Walter Hinteler
 
  4  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 11:42 am
@Walter Hinteler,
I don't know, if Lash still reads the responses here.
But it might be of interest for others, too:
So will Europe miss the UK when it’s gone? Probably not, actually

I like especially this passage:
The Obsever wrote:
However, Brexit has also had an impact on the continent’s Eurosceptics, he added. “It’s striking. Before and right after the referendum, the talk was Frexit, Nexit, Czexit. It all stopped very quickly. In France, Marine Le Pen wanted to leave the EU, then the euro, now she wants to leave neither. No one wants to.”

First, Lequesne said, Britain’s experience “has shown how complicated leaving is. Second, Brexit has boosted popular support for the EU.” October’s Eurobarometer survey shows that 68% of respondents feel their country benefits from EU membership, the highest level since 1983, while 66% – a majority in every state – said they would vote to remain in any exit referendum.
Lash
 
  1  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 01:16 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
I follow in the news and here, periodically. Surprising this business hasn’t been finalized.

Hoping it goes well for all concerned. (Specially the Saxons.)
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 01:53 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:
Surprising this business hasn’t been finalized.
Why are you surprised? The dates are and were well known from the very beginning.
Lash
 
  1  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 02:02 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Reports consistently cite sparse to no progress.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  3  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 09:37 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
There seems to be much misunderstanding by the UK that Brexit will be good for them. I'm amazed at their lack of understanding of how Brexit will end up costing them more for everything. Trying to negotiate separately with all Euro countries will just end up being chaotic. The more countries they negotiate with, the options become slimmer. Their primary goal should be to expand their marketplace.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sat 24 Nov, 2018 11:56 pm
@cicerone imposter,
At the moment, it looks like the deal won't get through Parliament.
May doesn't have enough support from her own Conservative MPs or MPs from other parties.

If Conservative MP's vote against the Withdrawal Agreement, it will (most likely) fail, and I can't see how the government can survive.
If they vote for it, you they'll get "Brexit in name only" coupled with an inherent threat to the British Union.

Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 12:13 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Prime Minister Theresa May has penned a letter to the nation setting out why she thinks the public should back her Brexit deal. Here is the full letter.

https://i.imgur.com/vXWPbZW.jpg

"When I became your Prime Minister the United Kingdom had just voted to leave the European Union.

"From my first day in the job, I knew I had a clear mission before me - a duty to fulfil on your behalf: to honour the result of the referendum and secure a brighter future for our country by negotiating a good Brexit deal with the EU.

"Throughout the long and complex negotiations that have taken place over the last year and a half, I have never lost sight of that duty.

"Today, I am in Brussels with the firm intention of agreeing a Brexit deal with the leaders of the other 27 EU nations.

"It will be a deal that is in our national interest - one that works for our whole country and all of our people, whether you voted 'Leave' or 'Remain'.

"It will honour the result of the referendum.

"We will take back control of our borders, by putting an end to the free movement of people once and for all.

"Instead of an immigration system based on where a person comes from, we will build one based on the skills and talents a person has to offer.

"We will take back control of our money, by putting an end to vast annual payments to the EU.

"Instead, we will be able to spend British taxpayers' money on our own priorities, like the extra £394 million per week that we are investing in our long-term plan for the NHS.

"And we will take back control of our laws, by ending the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice in the UK.

"In future, our laws will be made, interpreted and enforced by our own courts and legislatures.

"We will be out of EU programmes that do not work in our interests: out of the Common Agricultural Policy, that has failed our farmers, and out of the Common Fisheries Policy, that has failed our coastal communities.

"Instead, we will be able to design a system of agricultural support that works for us and we will be an independent coastal state once again, with full control over our waters.

"The deal also protects the things we value.

"EU citizens who have built their lives in the United Kingdom will have their rights protected, as will UK citizens living elsewhere in the EU.

"A free trade area will allow goods to flow easily across our borders, protecting the many skilled jobs right across the country that rely on integrated supply-chains.

"Because our European friends will always be our allies in the fight against terrorism and organised crime, the deal will ensure that security co-operation will continue, so we can keep our people safe.

"As Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, I have from day one been determined to deliver a Brexit deal that works for every part of our country - for England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, for our Overseas Territories like Gibraltar, and also for the Crown Dependencies.

"This deal will do that.

"Crucially, it will protect the integrity of our United Kingdom and ensure that there will be no hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland - so people can live their lives as they do now.

"It is a deal for a brighter future, which enables us to seize the opportunities that lie ahead.

"Outside the EU, we will be able to sign new trade deals with other countries and open up new markets in the fastest-growing economies around the world.

"With Brexit settled, we will be able to focus our energies on the many other important issues facing us here at home: keeping our economy strong, and making sure every community shares in prosperity; securing our NHS for the future, giving every child a great start in life, and building the homes that families need; tackling the burning injustices that hold too many people back, and building a country for the future that truly works for everyone.

"On 29 March next year, the United Kingdom will leave the European Union.

"We will then begin a new chapter in our national life. I want that to be a moment of renewal and reconciliation for our whole country.

"It must mark the point when we put aside the labels of 'Leave' and 'Remain' for good and we come together again as one people.

"To do that we need to get on with Brexit now by getting behind this deal.

"Parliament will have the chance to do that in a few weeks' time when it has a meaningful vote on the deal I hope to strike today.

"I will be campaigning with my heart and soul to win that vote and to deliver this Brexit deal, for the good of our United Kingdom and all of our people."

Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 12:39 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Gibraltar Chronicle: ‘Abandon Francoist politics on Gibraltar,’ Picardo tells Sanchez
Quote:
Chief Minister Fabian Picardo fired back at Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez on Saturday night, dismissing his claims that Spain had secured “historic” gains in its sovereignty aspirations over Gibraltar.

In a stern message, he said Gibraltar would never renounce its British sovereignty and urged Mr Sanchez to “abandon the politics” on Gibraltar of Spanish dictator General Franco.

Mr Picardo was reacting to Mr Sanchez’ statement after news that a last-minute agreement had been reached to defuse the Brexit row over Gibraltar ahead of a crucial EU summit on Sunday to rubber-stamp the draft Withdrawal Agreement.

Spain claims it has a secured decisive voice over whether any future deal between the EU and the UK will be applied to Gibraltar.

“We have received sufficient guarantees to be able to reach a solution to a conflict that has lasted more than 300 years between the United Kingdom and Spain,” Mr Sanchez told reporters in Madrid, adding that Spain would again table its joint sovereignty proposal in the second phase of Brexit negotiations.
[...]



The Observer (The Guardian): Brexiters accuse May of Gibraltar betrayal ‘under cover of darkness’
Quote:
[...]
Amid a growing outcry over the government’s concession, the prime minister insisted that nothing had changed over the UK’s territorial claim to Gibraltar. She also dismissed claims from Spain’s foreign minister that the agreement on the Rock had been a victory for Madrid, delivering a treaty that was “the most important one since the Utrecht Treaty of 1713”, that handed the territory to the British.

Theresa May said: “The UK’s position on the sovereignty of Gibraltar has never changed and will not change.

“I’m proud that Gibraltar is British and I will always stand by Gibraltar.”
0 Replies
 
Olivier5
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 02:40 am
Brexit: Theresa May writes letter asking British public to back deal 
BBC, 25 November 2018

Theresa May has written a letter to the British public pleading for their support for her Brexit deal, as the EU prepares to sign it off.

The prime minister said her agreement promises a "brighter future" for the UK and leaving the EU next year will be "a moment of renewal and reconciliation for our whole country".

EU leaders are in Brussels for a summit to decide whether to endorse the deal.

European Council chief Donald Tusk has recommended all countries approve it.

Spain - which had threatened to boycott the summit - will attend after a last-minute disagreement over Gibraltar was resolved on Saturday.

However, even if the EU agrees to the deal, it needs to be passed by the UK Parliament. Many MPs - including in Mrs May's own Conservative Party - have stated they will vote against it.

In Mrs May's "letter to the nation" - published on the eve of the EU summit where she hopes the 27 other EU countries will back her deal - the PM claims the deal is "in our national interest" and works for all parts of the UK.

Leaving the EU on 29 March 2019 will mark "a new chapter in our national life," she said.

"It must mark the point when we put aside the labels of 'Leave' and 'Remain' for good and we come together again as one people.

"To do that we need to get on with Brexit now by getting behind this deal."

The prime minister said she would be campaigning "with [her] heart and soul" to get MPs to pass the deal in the House of Commons and "honour the result of the referendum".

She said the deal delivers on Brexit by ending free movement of people and "vast" annual payments to the EU.

"With Brexit settled", the government will be able to focus on issues such as the economy, the NHS and building homes, she added.

Analysis
BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg

The end of the negotiations. But not the end of the arguments Theresa May has to make about our relationship with the rest of the continent.

Today - Number 10 hopes - marks the end of months and years of negotiations, not just with Brussels. But, with a bigger aspiration: to bring the country together.

But, while a deal is expected to be signed off in Brussels today, whatever the last minute jitters, Theresa May will know, pitching her agreement to the EU is one thing, persuading Parliament another, and ultimately what will determine her and all of our futures is whether the public is willing to come on board. [...]

https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-politics-46332884

Theresa May's 'letter to the nation' in full
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 03:41 am
@Olivier5,
I'd posted May's letter above Wink

----------

EU-27's heads of government approved the contract of resignation with the UK. Now the British and European Parliaments have to give their assent. If this is successful, Britain's withdrawal from the EU on 29 March 2019 should proceed without chaos for the time being.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 04:09 am
@Walter Hinteler,
EU leaders back Theresa May's Brexit deal in Brussels
Quote:
[...]
In a statement, the EU’s leaders stated their intention to build “as close as possible a partnership” with the UK after Brexit, while warning that they would be “permanently seized” in future negotiations by the principle that countries outside the bloc cannot enjoy the same rights as those within.
[...]
Further statements issued on Sunday morning by the 27 EU leaders laid out their intention to maintain the rights of European fleets to fish in British waters.

There was a thinly veiled threat to block any transition extension unless a new arrangement with Brussels was swiftly agreed by the government.

Arriving at the summit, the EU’s chief negotiator, Michel Barnier, nevertheless advised MPs to vote for the deal on the table, suggesting that a “no” vote could damage negotiations on the future relationship.

“Now it is time for everybody to take their responsibilities, everybody,” he said. The deal was “a necessary step to build the trust between the UK and the EU” to build “an unprecedented and ambitious future partnership”.

The European commission president, Jean-Claude Juncker, said: “I would vote in favour of this deal because this is the best deal possible for Britain.

“I’m sad because watching the UK … leaving the EU is not a moment for jubilation but a moment of deep sadness and we make everything possible in order to have this divorce being as smooth as possible. but there are no smooth divorces.

“This is the deal, it’s the best deal possible and the EU will not change its fundamental position when it comes to this issue so I do think the British parliament – because this is a wise parliament – will ratify this deal.”

The French president, Emmanuel Macron described it as “a day of mourning”, while the Dutch prime minister, Mark Rutte, warned MPs no better deal was on offer from the EU, urging them to back the agreements the May was bringing back to parliament.

“If I would live in the UK I would say yes to this, I would say that this is very much acceptable to the United Kingdom,” Rutte said, because the deal “limited the impacts of Brexit while balancing the vote to leave”. In a bid to help the prime minister, he said May had “fought very hard” and now there was “an acceptable deal on the table”.

“You know I hate [Brexit] but it is a given,” he told reporters. “No one is a victor here today, nobody is winning, we are all losing.”
... ... ...
0 Replies
 
Olivier5
 
  1  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 04:18 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Sorry about that.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 08:26 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
If this is successful, Britain's withdrawal from the EU on 29 March 2019 should proceed without chaos for the time being.


I would not want to be a Briton on April Fool's Day 2019.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 09:35 am
@ehBeth,
Julian Smith, the government chief whip is now May’s most important cabinet colleague by far.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 01:30 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Today, Arlene Foster said the DUP could back a Norway-style deal (>DUP may back Norway-style Brexit deal, says Arlene Foster<), an option attracting increasing sympathy.

And >Labour plays waiting game over second Brexit referendum<.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Sun 25 Nov, 2018 02:19 pm
@ehBeth,
ehBeth, The Brits withdrawal will cost everybody, and I also predict that they will lose many jobs in addition to their GDP going lower. Anyone who has studied Economics in college would understand the problems of a Brexit. I disagree, there will be much chaos after Brexit.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Mon 26 Nov, 2018 08:17 am
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
LONDON (Reuters) - Europe’s top court will hold an urgent hearing on Tuesday over whether Britain can unilaterally reverse its decision to leave the EU, in a case supporters of membership hope could pave the way to a second referendum and ultimately stop Brexit.

The European Court of Justice (ECJ) is being asked to interpret whether Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty - the mechanism by which Britain notified the European Union of its intention to leave - can be revoked.

Britain is due to exit the world’s biggest trading bloc on March 29 next year but it remains unclear whether British Prime Minister Theresa May’s draft withdrawal deal agreed with the EU on Sunday will be passed by parliament.

She has warned Britain could leave without a deal or that there could be no Brexit at all. That latter statement has given added significance to the outcome of the case before the ECJ - whose supremacy over UK legal matters May has cited as one reason to leave the EU.

If it concludes Britain can unilaterally reverse Brexit, it could give British lawmakers (MPs) a third viable option as an alternative to May’s deal or what ministers describe as a chaotic no deal scenario - staying in the bloc after another referendum.

The British government has fought to stop the ECJ hearing the case, saying it is irrelevant because ministers have no intention of reversing Brexit, while May has consistently ruled out a second referendum.

“Theresa May wants to blackmail us into voting for her bad deal by thinking the only alternative is the disaster of crashing out with no deal,” Joanna Cherry, a Scottish National Party lawmaker and one of the group of Scottish politicians who instigated the case told Reuters.

“We say (Article 50) can be unilaterally revoked - whether that’s the case or whether the court just says it can be revoked with permission - we’ve got the answers that we need in order as members of parliament to be able to say there is a concrete option of stopping Brexit.”

EXPEDITED
The case was referred to the Luxembourg justices for a ruling by Scotland’s top court and in a demonstration of its importance it has been “expedited” by the ECJ for Tuesday’s one-day hearing before a full court of judges.

Article 50 states that if a state decides to withdraw, it has two years to agree an exit deal with the remaining 27 EU members, although this process can be extended if the European Council unanimously agrees.

There is no mention of whether a state can change its mind. No other member state has ever left the 60-year-old bloc.

However, John Kerr, the British diplomat who drafted the clause, has repeatedly argued that it can be unilaterally reversed.

“The die is not irrevocably cast, there is still time and, until the UK has left the EU, the Article 50 letter can be withdrawn,” he wrote in a recent pamphlet.

Other legal experts are unconvinced, arguing costs already incurred by the other EU states from divorce talks and the clause’s focus on protecting the interests of its remaining members meant it could not be reversed solely at the UK’s whim.

It is not clear when the ECJ will give its ruling but Cherry was optimistic it would come before British lawmakers vote on the deal which is expected in mid-December.
Reuters
 

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