Family falling apart over Religion

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I am new here... Sad

I am so sad!
My Husband of almost 19 years is a recovering Alcoholic/Drug Abuser..
He was a major addict to Crack Cocaine. Our Children and I have lived years of hell. You name it he most likely done it. And we got to see it or be the brunt of his actions. It was aweful. I was the one raising my children alone. I protected my childern the best I could and their Father would sometimes disapear for a week at a time on drug binges. We just went on living our life. I felt if I left my husband I would be abandoning him tearing our kids from their father, but if I stayed my kids learned horrible things from him and felt so unloved by their Father or he could not hurt them as he was doing. I did my best to show my kids the things he was doing was not good, and hoped they would see from their own hurt and the hurt they seen he caused around him. Needless to say, My kids leaned towards me and have not ever gain much respect for their Father. He was really never a Father to them. Actually out of his on guilt when coming down from drugs he would try to be the cool friend and talk cool sexual stuff with our oldest son and his friends and so on...
Around 20 months ago, My husband after getting in legal trouble decided to start going to church. This should had been a good thing. But... He became very unkind.. I had an abused Nephew living with me to try and help him as a good Christian should. My Husband became aweful to him. Saying he was Satan, mentally and Physically attacking him. My heart was broken when my Husband ignored my tears again in life and kicked my Nephew out of my house to go back living with his drug addict abusive mom. My hands were tied.
Everyone kept telling me he will balance out...
Well he has now been involved with another Church (Pentecostal) and in so many ways it is tearing this family apart.
He is not a kind person.. Now he is so deeply involved that a good deal of his time is with the Church (As if he had not been in our life enough when on drugs). He is become extremely SRTCT! Uses the bible against the kids. Says God says to obey your Father. (Though he never earned respect from them). He uses bible verses as punishment. How sinful the kids are if they disrespect him. My kids and I have always believed in God, Or trust me we would not made it through years of hell. But because of the craziness my husband is always displaying it is back firing causing us to resent the bible which leaves me with guilt. I believe my husband needs to show his belief by his new found action and speak of the loving God, But it is always the opposite. He stomps and yells that the Lord will be served in his house. It is as if he has found a new addiction that he is abusing. He is constantly forcing his beliefs on our freinds, family and children. Basically saying this is his house and things will go his way. To heck with me. He is mean. Not kind as a Christian should be. My kids are not seeing an excepting, loving man. They see a contorl person and are resenting him more. He is often degrading. Telling our 19 year he is not a man. Wants him to be a man, yet treats him like a boy.
Another issue is that many of the things my husband says is off the wall. Example: One day he was telling our kids that he was a Jew. For the bible says if you believe in Jesus than your a Jew. Another time our youngest daughter had been talking about wanting a cell phone (She was 9 an play toy) and my husband must had grabbed by accident an extra cell phone we had and stuck it in his truck. He found it that day and swore that God placed that cell phone in his truck for he had told our daughter if she prayed hard enough for one her prayer may be answered. Just the other night he said at the dinner table that if you are a true beliver than you can drink posion and handle a rattle snake and you will not die. He said it is a scripture which I know what he is talking about, but that is not what I believe it means. It angers me to see him telling this stuff to my kids. Confusion and craziness..... Am I wrong... What should I do?

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Sounds like your husband has simply replaced one addiction with another over the years and "religion" has become his latest.

He need professional mental help but I suspect he will see any attempt at that as a way to undermine his religious beliefs at the moment. In my own personal experience those that are the most "enthusiastic" in their religious beliefs are the "recent converts" and attempting to get them to see anything is all but impossible.

You, on the other hand, need to decide how long you are willing to be the recipient of his abuse. While staying together for the sake of the childern is admirable you reach a point where doing so becomes foolish. Only you can decide when that point is. Perhaps some counseling for yourself could help you sort that out?

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Your husband has made a God in his own image--leave him to that God. Crack or no crack, your husband is not a Family Man.

You and your kids deserve something better.

Good luck.

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I am very sorry for what you are going through. I had chemical abuse in my family and with close friends and hope that I can offer a bit of what I have learned.

First of all. You need to take care of yourself and your kids. I strongly suggest that you get yourself and your kids involved in a program that will help you through this. As you may know, you can not force your husband to do anything, but you can start healing yourself.

There are many good programs for families of addicts. I was involved in a program run in a hospital here (it was part of a recovery program for a good friend). They really help.

You should talk to your doctor as hospitals have connections to very good resources. Al-anon may also be a good program to check out.

Please do this-- for yourself and your kids. It may help your husband as well, but he has to decide what he wants. You need to take care of yourself first.

Second, from what you have said, your husband is not a recovering addict. The process of recovery involves taking responsibility for your behavior and "making amends" for the people who you have hurt. I don't know if he is using or not, but it is clear that he is not taking responsibility for his behavior. He is not owning up to how his addiction is hurting his family and he is not working on changing.

You husband needs help. Some churches have very good recovery programs, but unfortunately others provide a crutch for addicts to avoid dealing with their problems. It is clear that the church is not helping your husband. You should insist that he gets real help for his problems.

In the program I was a part of, the first thing they told us about dealing with addicts is "Don't accept unacceptable behavior". An addict will only change when he is forced to. If you continue to accept his abuse, it will continue. In a program they will help you draw very clear lines about what you will not accept from him. You will have a lot of options when you get the support you need from others.

Please get some help for yourself and for your kids. This will give you what you need, and may be the only way to help your husband.

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One other thought. The problem is abuse, not religion.

If your husband was abusive but wasn't religious, it would be just as bad, right? if you husband was religious but not abusive you wouldn't have a problem.

The abuse is addictive behavior and you should think of it as such. The religion is just as excuse.

You should insist that the abuse stop. Period.

Don't get sucked into the trap of arguing against God (or his idea of God). You husband has the problem that is hurting you and your children. He needs to deal with it.

Addicts will often try to set up a fantasy that they are being "persecuted". You can prevent this by focusing on the problem - his addiction. If you blame his religion you are just playing into your husbands fantasy.

Please get help for yourself. I can't say this enough.

After that, you will have the strength to insist that he stop his abuse. He needs treatment to deal with his problem and you the the right to insist that he gets it.

I wish you the best.

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EBrown makes excellent sense.

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As usual, ebrown says it too well for me to add to it.

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Wow.

There are few situations when I would advise a divorce, but this is one.

You've suffered through some hard stuff with the drug abuse. I'm really thinking of the kids. He's done a lot of damage, and now, I almost think the abuse is worse with the religion.

Honey, for the sake of the children, I'd get them out of there. Whether you go, or not, they need counselling to talk to a professional and sort out their misconceptions about life, religion, and their feelings about their father.

I think he is dangerous. I think you should get yourself and those kids out of there--and I don't think I'd tell him first.

The crack may have permanently damaged his brain. He could quickly become a physical or sexual abuser--or produce a snake to prove his religion... Please get out of there, and don't let him know until you and your stuff are out. He is screwing up your kids.

I have an ominous feeling about your situation.

Your children need therapy, IMO.

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EBrown, Thank You for the advice.....
I do understand it is my husband not Religion, But I wonder if the Religion is Teaching him some of the strangest things he believes of Christianity. He seems to think now that he is clean from drugs and is into Religion than it is his way or no way..When he was on drugs, he was a horrible but half way nice person due to his guilt of never being around. Even though many of his so call nice ways was damaging. (Like trying to be a cool Dad/friend and have sexual talk with his oldest boy, as in the Clinton way- You'll get the picture, or Covering up that our oldest daughter was caught shop lifting- Many neighbors knew, but not Dear Mom, I found out the hard way) he Believes All his beliefs are the truth (No matter how foolish many are; I don't believe God drops off material things like Cell phone, because a 9 yr old prayed for it) and what he believes is all that matters. Today is Fathers Day and our oldest son (19) has chosen to be with his girlfriends parents rather than his Dad. For whenever he see's his Dad who claims to be a Christian he say's something negative towards him. Always nick picking an argument. My son has been in some trouble, but is not a bad kid. He has had a rough life and being the oldest he got the most responibility of the 4 kids. Having to come and get his siblings when his Father showed up at home after a week of being on a drug binge skitzing. He would take his siblings to his girlfriends house. My Point is, so much damage had already been caused by my husband past and their relationship was hanging by a thread and for my husband to know get into Religion and use it as a control against the kids is worsen the situation. Our son is a sinner if he has Sex with his girlfriend out of wed lock... Yes, it is.. I agree and don't like it, but he was born out of wed lock.. I was only 16 and did not get married until he was 6 months old.. And to consider how my husband talked with him of how cool it was to be with girls etc. Makes me feel my husband is a hipercrite for not approving of the type of man he help create in life... May I add our oldest daughter called to say happy Fathers Day, but as well chose to be off elsewhere for they get tired of the constant bible pull of scriptures, rather than having a dad to relate to and love God as well... The other 2 children has hardly said much...

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All i can see when I read this post is how easily I can take the word 'religion/God/Church' out and put in Crack.
Example " He uses the bible against my nephew ".... replace it with cocaine. Same behavior. sad but true. I have been there unfortunatly, on both sides. And the bad part is that 'finding god' is a common thing for people to do after they sober up. And they usually do it for the wrong reasons (ie: legal reasons, acceptance , assistance etc..) from where I stand, if it were me, I would make that apoint.
I would point out how his 'finding god' is basically b/s and that he traded one stone for another ... just to throw at his family. But I am a diffrent person. That suggestion may / may not work for you. Probally the later. Sofia has a wonderful point of divorce.
No matter WHAT your religion, what ever god you worship.. no god wants thier people to suffer. Please dont use your religion to NOT keep divorce an option. If you do that then you are repeating the same abuse he is giving you... just to yourself.
Religion isnt something that should tear a family apart. On the contrary , it makes families and people stronger if they so choose. Dont be afraid to walk away. Dont be afraid to say no. And dont be afraid to save your life. It seems like religion is a weapon in your household... not a part of the foundation.
Abuse starts simple and comes in many forms.. but 9 times out of 10, the abuse advances to physical before you know it. Worry about how YOU can take care of YOU because if YOU are not there who is going to take care of the kids?
I honestly think that he is a lost cause if there isnt some major interjection from a psychiatrist and some psychotrophic meds. And I am sorry, but you can not provide either one.
Save you. Take care of you. Love you. Be all about you from now on ok ?
:-)

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You have been given some excellent advice.

The Bible does give three instances where divorce is acceptable. I think that you fit in those circumstances. Your children are in danger from this man. Both before, with the drugs and now with his new addiction.

He has found a new way to try and control he circumstances.

I think that you need to leave and not look back. This man has hurt both you and your children to the point where they are going to continue the cycle unless they see it for what it is and get help.

My mom had to leave my dad for the same reasons...not as extreme as yours but it was to the point where she knew that us girls were in danger and she knew that our lives were important enough to get us out.

I think that you need to do the same thing for your children. It won't be easy and he will most likely make it an even bigger hell for you than what you have been through. But unless you make the change you are going to have to live through even more abuse.

God can perform miracles and He is able to change your husband but we have to do our part. Your husband isn't in a place where he can see what he needs to do be become more like Christ. That is what Christians are to be striving for. Not to become the best rule keepers they can be...but to be more like Christ and love.

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DeAnnaB--

I'm not a Christian, but I understand the basic message of Christianity is "God is Love".

You are doing your best to present an objective picture of your family, but your man doesn't come across as a loving husband or father.

He's a showboating bully and he's damaging your kids.

All these years you've been "fair" to him. Now be "fair" to your kids--and incidently to yourself.

Good luck.

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DeAnna, Welcome to A2K. It's my belief that trying to hang your husband's problems on religion is the wrong way to go. It seems to me, from reading your first post, that he has a disease called drug addiction. Everything else is anathema to that disease. In other words, it's a crutch in "addition" to his drug addiction. Trying to analyze religious belief of any individual will lead you nowhere. Another observation I have is that you have two choices about your husband; stay or leave. In order to make the right decision, I would suggest you seek outside help before you take any action. Many communities have shelters for families when the father or husband is a danger to his family. Maybe that's something you may wish to consider for the immediate - to protect yourself and your children. Good luck.

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Welcome to A2K, DeAnna.
I will agree with the others in that your family is not "falling apart over religion", but it is falling apart over the abusiveness of your husband. Substitute "Pentecostal" with any other denomination or faith, and I suspect your husband would still just hear what he wanted to hear at the services and use his religion as a tool for abuse. He certainly won't change as long as he's attending his current church--what he needs is private counseling or a radical change in the teaching he is adhering to.
It seems unlikely you could persuade him to get private counseling; however, there are Christian organizations like Promisekeepers, Vision New England Men's Ministries, etc. that promote a more Christ-like view of women and family. Maybe he could be persuaded to attend one of these conferences? My reason for this recommendation is that Promisekeepers, etc., try to encourage men to place their family's happiness and well-being ahead of their own, by teaching the men to serve and pray for their loved ones. Even if you don't agree with all of their philosophy, the "applications" seem like they could work wonders in your husband if he lets them sink in. It seems to me that the heart of your problem right now is your husband's self-centeredness--his own needs, power, image, etc. have consistently been his first priority, at the expense of you and the kids.

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lab rat- I disagree. As other people have said before, I think that his behavior has little to do with religion. It is about abuse and control. He needs to work on why he finds it necessary to be so abusive to his wife and family. Right now, a loving oriented religion, IMO, would hold absolutely no appeal for him.

Personally, I think that DeAnnaB needs to get out of the situation with her husband, as quickly as possible, for both her and her children's safety.

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Iagree. I think his behaviou is indicative of a disease and not of religion.
disease isnt a choice but can be treated, religion is a choice that can be changed.

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hypothetical question.... if this WASNT your husband and some man was treating you and your kids like this... you would leave HIM right?

well.. apply that same protective tactic here. He isnt the man you married... obviously. So why stay?

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Years ago I was part of a group that formed the Domestic Violence Association of Central Kansas. I was also a certified alcoholism counselor working with families of alcoholics. I am also a committed Christian. These three things often dovetailed into one another.

There was one time we had gone to the hospital to counsel a young woman. In an alcoholic rage, her husband had put her there after fracturing her nose, cheek, and jaw and inflicting numerous other painful injuries. We were able to convince her that she and her children had to get away from this creep and agreed to see an attorney to start the legal separation, file charges, and the process to get a restraining order.

Before the attorney could get there, she was visited by her fundamentalist pastor who advised her that it was her duty to submit to her husband and that divorce was not an option for her. She left the hospital and went back to her husband. Two years later she died from a 'mysterious' accident. The proof that the death penalty deters is that I did not murder that preacher.

I believe that belief in God with true spirituality is extremely helpful in helping people win over addictions and nothing is as effective for a good prognosis as a loving, faith-based support group. I also fully believe distorted religious beliefs amplified by untreated alcoholic psychosis could very well be part of DeAnna's husband's current problems and is actually contributing to severe emotional and psychological abuse.

And I concur wholeheartedly with the others here. DeAnna, get yourself to the nearest Al-Anon group-- try out several different groups and stick with one or two for at least six months--it often takes that long to 'get the program' and learn important survival skills. And get yourself to the nearest domestic violence counseling center to learn your options to get away from one who is seriously harming you and your children.

And then do it. Explain to him that if he gets professional help and stops his destructive behavior, then you'll talk. Otherwise, you're out of there. Do not go back until your counselor deems it safe to do so.

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DeAnnaB,

Seldom have I read a more disturbing post on A2K. It isn't religeous counseling you need, but a quick kick in the pants.

For 19 years you have lived in what for most people would be an intolerable situation. Crazy, but if you want to throw away your life that's your decision and you would have my sympathy if nothing else. In this case, as you report it, not getting that jerk who occasionally walks on two legs out of your life may be criminal.

That's right criminal. Your children have been abused almost from the time they were born, and you let it happen ... for well over a decade. How far has the abuse gone? Have the children been beaten, sexually abused, or merely made to cower beneath sheets in the hope that they might escape a drug crazed lout? By keeping them in that environment you have abdicated your responsibities as a mother and parent. Into this little domestic hell you've brought another child, a nephew already apparently abandoned to a doubtful fate. How many times have you all gone hungry, or had to avoid the landlord because the budget money was being burned up in a crack pipe. Your children, your chief responsibility, are teenagers or almost teenagers, and what is it they've learned? Isn't it hatred, fear and anxiety? Their potential has been largely wasted because you kept them in an abusive household.

Do a little investigation and find the local women's shelter. Pack your bags quietly and get the children out of there .... yesterday. Disappear where your 19year millstone can never find you, or the children.

My mother could never bring herself to do that, and as a result my sisters and I were terribly damaged. Our abuse only lasted something like seven or eight years while a drunken stepfather made our life almost unbearable. By the time I was 17, I felt I had two basic choices: shoot the SOB, or drop out of school and leave town. It was a close thing, but I joined the Navy and tried to get on with my life. I felt great guilt leaving my mother and sisters behind, but would shooting the bastard been better? Why didn't Momma love us, love me, enough to leave? She never got further than a couple of blocks before, we turned around and went back. As bad as our situation was, our tormentor was "just" a violent alcoholic who while intoxicated was fond of doing beastly things to women and children.

The emotional upset I feel over this is largely the result I suppose of my own unresolved hurt. Still hurting after a space of almost fifty years! Please, get out of there and repair as much of the damage to those kids as you can while there is still time. What have you been waiting for? What does it take to convince you that almost anything would be better than to continue the last 19 years indefinitely into the future?

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What Asherman said.

I would add that if you are in any way concerned how your husband will react, have a competent witness or witnesses with you when you tell him you are leaving or just leave and then tell him why on the phone later.

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Family falling apart over Religion

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