@parados,
Quote:Both viewers see their time as normal
Para, I never said they didn't
Quote: Marty's watch would show it as 10 minutes.
Show what, Para
Quote:Viewers on earth would see Marty's watch as slower than that.
Than what
Quote: Earth would see their watch as showing 10 minutes.
Who are
they
If you've sneaked into her ship another passenger, let me assure you it's entirely unnecessary, only contributing to the complexity of our exchange
Quote:Marty would see earth's time as slowing down
Yes, at risk of repetition, once more, again, however, at first she gets the illusion that our watch is not slower but faster since she's passing through two ten-minute passels of photons in just an instant. After she passes however, yes that's when she sees our time as stopped
Quote:the other's (moving) clock is ticking at a slower rate than the local clock.
Yes that's the way it usually works, and in fact with your train passengers the same reasoning would apply; but not so dramatically since in the article you provided, they're both traveling so very slow, relatively, so during their approach the effect of one's acceleration over the other is too small to be measured
Quote:... there is nothing I can do to help you
Apparently not
Quote: the point of view of each will be that the other's (moving) clock is ticking at a slower rate than the local clock
Yes but again, once more, anew, repeatedly, one more time Para, initially the participant who has accelerated will see the other's time as running just a bit faster than otherwise. He hasta since he's encountering more of the other's photons. Once they've passed however, yes, each sees the other's clock running at the same slower rate. It's all elementary special relativity
Nevertheless I believe I do see from whence our apparent impasse arises. Before they meet, let's suppose Marty looks out her side window. As she passes successive clocks that we've placed on intermediate asteroids, she indeed notes a rapidly advancing reading; and if she doesn't understand Al she might conclude that she's seeing the other's clock run faster also, just as you infer
However, and again you other a2k'ers, and yes I've already said this several times, forgive me for the constant repetition, such an inference is an illusion brought about by Marty's incredible acceleration, which she can confirm not by continuing to watch us out her front window but instead peering straight our that side window , choosing
one of those clocks, watching it most carefully as she's passing it (She's capable of flicking her eyeballs pretty darn fast). She'll find that in fact, according to classical relativistic theory, that yes she's seeing it (nearly) stopped, running at the very same minuscule rate that we back on earth see hers
…coming perhaps to the very sudden realization as she passes by and looks out her rear window when our movements apparently come to a sudden halt. "Oh yes," she recalls, "Now I remember Al and that bit about the effect of acceleration"
Para my gratitude revisited for this interesting chat, but now I've just gotta do some yardwork
Accounting also for any remaining typos
But come on now, somebody except the feisty fella above who resents us abbreviating his agnomen, amongst some 100,000 potential respondents, there must be one or two who understands Al better than the rest of us
