@firefly,
DAVID wrote:Elliot Rodger never got rejected by any girl.
In his lengthy manifesto, tho he complains about rejection
very redundantly, he offers not even ONE instance
of any girl having declined his invitation to go out.
He never offered an invitation.
That was his downfall; he was disabled by fear.
firefly wrote:I think you have a much more accurate idea of what Elliot Rodger
was like than Hawkeye does, particularly the fear that gripped him,
and probably prevented him from taking the initiative in any social
encounter, including with other males.
It did; someone explained sexual reproduction to him. He understood that,
but he gives no indication that anyone told him that boys
have the responsibility to initiate social contact with girls.
I suspect that he
WAS told of it, but that his
fear shut it out
of his consciousness. His fear was not his friend.
firefly wrote:Do you remember his terror at his graduation, I think it was in 6th grade,
because he'd have to announce his name from the stage after receiving his diploma?
Yes; his name and his high school,
but thay
made him do it. I 've heard that in survays, people have
ranked public speaking worse than death, in terms of intensity of fear.
I remember back to my age 13: I had too much fear of
PRIVATE speaking,
in terms of chickening out
many times qua asking out my First Love. Public speaking was OK.
I lived in a state of terror of embarrassment of her rejecting a social invitation from me.
After I was 14, I saw her wearing a birthday corsage, in school indicative of her 14th birthday.
I broke the ice by wishing her a Happy Birthday. Social conversation ensued,
to which I appended my invitation for a Saturday night date and I got rejected.
That was the
happiest moment in my life, before or since; ineffable thrill
in that I had finally
defeated my social cowardice. I did not expect that
JOY.
A few weeks later, I asked her again. It was much
less stressful to approach her
the 2nd time. I got rejected again. I was thrilled again, but not as much as before.
A few months later, I asked her again. It was much easier to approach her.
I was rejected again. I felt very good about asking her again,
but not as thrilling as the first 2 times. These were the effects
of approach-avoidance reactions. As I read Elliot's manifesto,
I remembered those experiences. I wondered if Elliot wud have
hated me
for having succeeded in making social contact with her, whereas he was mute.
In contrast to Elliot, I
NEVER had even the
slightest ill will
toward her concerning her rejection of my invitation.
It was obvious that she was well within her rights.
firefly wrote:He wasn't just shy. His social anxiety was massive, and quite debilitating.
Yes, indeed. It was very sad.
From his manifesto, he seemed to be in relatively good mental health
in his earlier years, and really freaking out in terms of psychosis
toward the end, progressively worse.
firefly wrote:But, while other males sometimes did take the initiative with him,
the females likely didn't because, as you point out, "the extant social paradigm requires the boy to take the initiative". However, if he was unable to do that, or simply couldn't recognize that was the social paradigm, he would simply transfer the "duty" onto the female in order to satisfy his sense of entitlement. The whole idea of showing interest in another person, or trying to engage them, was beyond him. Not only did he never ask a girl out, his manifesto contains no reports of any efforts, at all, to just have a conversation with a girl.
Well, to be fair, his efforts to establish social contact
and to give the town the opportunity to redeem itself, consisted
of exhibiting himself as a pedestrian, marching thru its streets,
thereby affording its ladies the opportunity to run out and intercept him.
Based on my experience as of c.5O years ago:
this can actually
HAPPEN, if u have the presence of mind
to be leading a sufficiently cute dog (preferably a puppy); chick magnets.
firefly wrote:He really thought that, if he just stood on campus, next to his BMW,
wearing his $300 sunglasses, those status symbols really would act like
an actual magnet to attract beautiful girls, who would suddenly rush
to his side, and immediately announce, "I want to be your girlfriend."
He engaged in a lot of magical thinking like that, and it seemed part
and parcel of his generally autistic thinking.
Well, actually, that
HAS WORKED (un-expectedly)
but when it has, it was more than obvious that the young lady
is of a mercenary mind and intentions; not personal.
Quote:autistic thinking-- preoccupation with inner thoughts, daydreams,
fantasies, private logic; egocentric, subjective thinking lacking objectivity
and connection with external reality
Thank u for that information. I did not know that.
David
